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Old 03-08-2018, 10:37 AM
 
Location: Middle of the valley
48,534 posts, read 34,873,169 times
Reputation: 73802

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
The tariff does not apply to domestically produced steel.

Maybe you did not realize this.

If you did not understand that local US steel producers will raise prices (what EVERY article is explaining), how can you even have a stance?

THIS is trumps base. THIS is how he got elected. THIS is why he still has supporters.
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Old 03-08-2018, 10:37 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 4,498,256 times
Reputation: 3981
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
Right in the OP and the second post in this topic.

Maybe you should read them.
And I posted a link that shows this company 1 billion dollar expansion started in 2014 in North America.

So now you will praise Obama correct?
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Old 03-08-2018, 10:54 AM
 
Location: 49th parallel
4,610 posts, read 3,304,325 times
Reputation: 9603
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
The tariff does not apply to domestically produced steel.

Maybe you did not realize this.
WaldoKitty, I am afraid you do not understand how tariffs work. I'm producing a piece of steel in the US for $10. I pay my employees a good salary, but no one is buying my steel because they can buy it in China for $5. A tariff is put onto Chinese steel to raise it to $10 per piece. Now everyone pays $10 for steel, making all steel products cost more in the US. I'm happy; I can pay my employees the same and still sell all my steel because it costs the same as Chinese steel. But the millions of people who buy products made with steel (many millions more than those employed making steel) must now pay more for everything that is made with steel - cars, bikes, office buildings, soda and beer cans, glasses frames, stoves, washing machines, everything you use. Now I might figure people would pay a dollar more for my US steel because they wouldn't have to bring it in from China. So now my steel is $11 per piece. This is called inflation, because my employees, who now have to pay more for everything made with steel, want raises to keep up with living costs. Next door, my neighbor's factory, whose employees are also suffering, needs to give them a raise, so they must put up the cost of the product they make, to pay for the raises. Repeat.
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,710,498 times
Reputation: 14818
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
Right in the OP and the second post in this topic.

Maybe you should read them.

You know, it helps to actually follow a conversation before responding.


Maybe you should read the link(s) in the posts I quoted.
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:06 AM
 
Location: NC
11,222 posts, read 8,307,135 times
Reputation: 12469
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
The tariff does not apply to domestically produced steel.

Maybe you did not realize this.

Guessing you never took a course in economics. Pricing is influenced by supply and demand. In a commodity market, both imports and domestics contribute to supply, with virtually no product differentiation (because it's a commodity). A disruptor to a significant portion of the supply chain affects the commodity price.

If you need it broken down further, there are many factors that contribute to this. One (of many) is that due to the tariff, suppliers on the margin will no longer produce, because it is no longer economically viable (they won't make a profit). It will decrease supply, causing the commodity price to go up as a result of decreased demand.

You will (accurately) point out that increased prices benefit domestic producers, however:
1. I am responding to your comment. Yes, it will result in ALL steel prices increasing, and
B. As many have tried to point out to you, the artificial profits to the domestic steel industry ONLY benefit the domestic steel industry. All others don't benefit. It's not just the importers, but more importantly, the consumers of the commodity product, which in this case (Steel) is found in many products.

The short explanation is that it is another form of wealth distribution. In this case, it is taking wealth from citizens, in the form of a tariff, and redistributing it to the corporate welfare recipients, the steel industry.

I will close with this: As a stock-owner in Nucor Steel (America's largest and most successful steel company right now, I think...) I will benefit. As an American, I will pay the price. I put my role as an American citizen higher than my own selfish needs. I'm guessing this is the part that you have a hard time understanding.
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:19 AM
 
13,693 posts, read 9,014,113 times
Reputation: 10416
I will note that my brother-in-law, the one that identifies with the Tea Party yet has not worked for close to 30 years, instead accepting Federal disability benefits all that time, is firmly with Mr. Trump concerning tariffs.


Of course, he does not think it would affect him. He is not worried about being unemployed, for that is his natural state. Even if the steel industry were to come to his door and tell him that there are now thousands of well-paying jobs available, he would be unmoved, and go back to watching football.


Yes, cave-dwellers (such as he is, sadly, though a cave with multiple television sets) seem to be remarkably unaffected by the outside world.


Oh. Except when Obama was president. He seemed to be upset about any good economic news, like he was personally affronted. Perhaps he was afraid that the 'liberals' would cut off his disability and require him to work.


He was pleased when I told him, a year or two ago when he hit age 55, that he no longer had to fear being taken off disability.


He does live on a limited income (disability), and he does gripe about the low cost-of-living increases by the Government. However, he found a happy solution: his sister (my wife), whom provides him with money from time to time.


Yes, do not condemn those that sit at their computer all day posting 300+ times a week, and refuse to recognize basic economic facts, or reject the opinions of economists that spend their whole lives studying their craft. Those that live in caves are not subject to normal stimuli.


I will close with a saying from Mark Twain:


"Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience".
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:22 AM
 
52,431 posts, read 26,643,000 times
Reputation: 21097
Quote:
Originally Posted by Myghost View Post
Guessing you never took a course in economics.
Quote:
Originally Posted by James Bond 007 View Post
For reference, since some people here do not seem to understand Economics 101.
Ad hominem fallacy.

Get back to us when you have a real argument.



(it's always the same ones)
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:23 AM
 
Location: Kansas City, MISSOURI
20,871 posts, read 9,546,294 times
Reputation: 15596
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
Ad hominem fallacy.

Get back to us when you have a real argument.
Pointing out that you do not understand basic economics is not an ad hominen. It is an observation of fact.
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:24 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 4,498,256 times
Reputation: 3981
Quote:
Originally Posted by legalsea View Post
I will note that my brother-in-law, the one that identifies with the Tea Party yet has not worked for close to 30 years, instead accepting Federal disability benefits all that time, is firmly with Mr. Trump concerning tariffs.


Of course, he does not think it would affect him. He is not worried about being unemployed, for that is his natural state. Even if the steel industry were to come to his door and tell him that there are now thousands of well-paying jobs available, he would be unmoved, and go back to watching football.


Yes, cave-dwellers (such as he is, sadly, though a cave with multiple television sets) seem to be remarkably unaffected by the outside world.


Oh. Except when Obama was president. He seemed to be upset about any good economic news, like he was personally affronted. Perhaps he was afraid that the 'liberals' would cut off his disability and require him to work.


He was pleased when I told him, a year or two ago when he hit age 55, that he no longer had to fear being taken off disability.


He does live on a limited income (disability), and he does gripe about the low cost-of-living increases by the Government. However, he found a happy solution: his sister (my wife), whom provides him with money from time to time.


Yes, do not condemn those that sit at their computer all day posting 300+ times a week, and refuse to recognize basic economic facts, or reject the opinions of economists that spend their whole lives studying their craft. Those that live in caves are not subject to normal stimuli.


I will close with a saying from Mark Twain:


"Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience".
And the very next post proved your point.
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Old 03-08-2018, 11:24 AM
 
Location: NC
11,222 posts, read 8,307,135 times
Reputation: 12469
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
Ad hominem fallacy.

Get back to us when you have a real argument.
My argument was the part of my quote that you edited out.

I'm still not sure if it was beyond your level of comprehension, or if you just had to ignore it to maintain your dignity. To quote you (and often), "do you ever get tired of being wrong?"
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