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The same could be said about people who escaped the Soviet Union and China in the 70s.
It's not propaganda.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Wolves In Snow
Propaganda? I lived in Miami. MANY Cubans who left will tell you the horrors of living there. It's so great, that people risk their fricken lives on tires and plywood, floating around in shark infested waters, not knowing if they'll make it or not, to get away from there. Yeah, what a slogan for the country.
It's taught to young minds in high school and college that everything you heard about communism / socialism are lies and that the Soiet Union was a socialist paradise. Also that Cuba is oppressed by the big bad USA.
Quote:
Originally Posted by don1945
Where in the Hell do you guys come up with this s*** ? I live in Florida, I KNOW CUBANS, a LOT of Cubans. They are not here because it is some island paradise, they are here because they are kept under the thumb of the repressive government, keep in poverty , and refused access to the rest of the world.
Sometimes I think this stuff gets posted just to get a rise and reaction from people, because it certainly is from la la land.
Once again I never said their economic system was great, or that I liked their central government, what I did say was that Cuba has a very extensive democratic political structure at the local level that is far superior to what you usually see in the western world. Democracy that spreads to economic institutions and societal ones gives the people more say in how their communities operate.
And as far as poverty goes, you can’t forget the crippling US sanctions that have left it out of the global supply chain.
IDK about "crippling" sanctions. They were doing fine until the USSR collapsed.
As such, the US is still Cuba's 5th largest trading partner.
I always thought that the sanctions weren't that effective anyway and gave Fidel an excuse for why Cuba's economy was so bad....and that they should be ended.
GoFundMe? Not necessary. There has to be some left over rafts made by Cubans to get here. Give them one and they can float over to paradise.
Those rafts would be 24 years old so I wouldn`t put much faith in them. People in poor countries have always tried to get to a country with a higher standard of living. Are Mexicans fleeing Capitalism? It certainly looks that way. How is capitalism doing in the Philipines and Russia?
It's taught to young minds in high school and college that everything you heard about communism / socialism are lies and that the Soiet Union was a socialist paradise. Also that Cuba is oppressed by the big bad USA.
I’m not an authoritarian socialist. I don’t like the central government in Cuba. I also understand a lot of their pain comes from being left out of the global supply chain.
What I am promoting is their direct local democratic structures that give people a say in more than their representatives, but also a say in their economic institutions and direct policy.
Democracy in Cuba is very real and very grassroots and in it’s a political system we should look into.
Cuba is still dominated by an authoritarian regime that controls every aspect of its citizens´lives for the profit of a few at the top. The regime calls itself “socialist” because it is otensibly based on “socialist” trademark ideas such as prohibition of private property, State control of all economic activity, central planning and a one-party system. Each one of these features has contributed to transform Cuba from one of the wealthiest Latin American countries into a poverty-stricken and isolated island.
there have never been, any “true” communist countries on planet Earth. According to Marx, in communism the State itself ceases to exist and all property is held in common. In reality, communism - just as nazism, fascism and socialism - has never been more than a poor excuse to create totalitarian regimes that have oppressed billions and killed hundreds of millions of people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324
I’m not an authoritarian socialist. I don’t like the central government in Cuba. I also understand a lot of their pain comes from being left out of the global supply chain.
What I am promoting is their direct local democratic structures that give people a say in more than their representatives, but also a say in their economic institutions and direct policy.
Democracy in Cuba is very real and very grassroots and in it’s a political system we should look into.
Ill take our version of capitalism anyday over oppressive cuba.
Explain how capitalism doesn't equal democracy?
how is having a government control every aspect of your life called democracy?
State control of the economy is not what authoritarian is. Having private control of capital isn't what democracy is.
In Democracy people have a say in how their country is run, not just the private capitalist who own all the wealth. Cuba has democracy spread to their economic institutions spreading democracy there, that is something capitalist countries can't do.
In fact in a lot of ways you can't have practicing democracy with capitalism as they're incompatible.
again....how is having state control of everything democracy???
Private control is about democracy. I own my house and the land it sits on. that is MY PRIVATE control of it. That is democracy. The more power you give to the government over your life, the less freedom you have.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324
State control of the economy is not what authoritarian is. Having private control of capital isn't what democracy is.
In Democracy people have a say in how their country is run, not just the private capitalist who own all the wealth. Cuba has democracy spread to their economic institutions spreading democracy there, that is something capitalist countries can't do.
In fact in a lot of ways you can't have practicing democracy with capitalism as they're incompatible.
Look at Chile under Pinochet or Indonesia under Suharto to see dictator capitalism.
Also, I'm an anarcho-syndicalist, so I care about freedom more than any communist or capitalist.
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