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Old 06-27-2009, 12:09 AM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,473,584 times
Reputation: 4799

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Quote:
If our adversaries believe we will diminish our own self-respect by keeping silent or acquiescing in the face of successive crimes against humanity, they are wrong. What we see throughout the world is an uprising of intellect and will. As Lech Walesa said: “Our souls contain exactly the contrary of what they wanted. They wanted us not to believe in God, and our churches are full. They wanted us to be materialistic and incapable of sacrifices; we are anti-materialistic, capable of sacrifice. They wanted us to be afraid of the tanks, of the guns, and instead we don't fear them at all.”
Let us not take the counsel of our fears. Let us instead offer the world a politics of hope, a forward strategy for freedom. The words of William Faulkner, at a Nobel Prize ceremony more than three decades ago, are an eloquent answer to those who predict nuclear doomsday or the eventual triumph of the superstate: “Man will not merely endure,” Faulkner said, “he will prevail. . .” because he will return to the old verities and truths of the heart. He is immortal because, alone among creatures, “he has a soul, a spirit capable of compassion and sacrifice and endurance.”
http://193.178.1.112/oireachtas/Addresses/04June1984.htm (broken link)

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Old 06-27-2009, 01:14 AM
 
Location: Northridge/Porter Ranch, Calif.
24,511 posts, read 33,321,730 times
Reputation: 7623
Quote:
Originally Posted by PITTSTON2SARASOTA View Post
I forgot to thank Ronald Reagan for "Trickle Down Economics"; because the middle class and poor must just love being pissed on!
This was posted on city-data before. Once again:

The American economy performed better during the Reagan era than during the years before or after him. Real median family income grew by $4,000 during Pres. Reagan's term after experiencing no growth at all in the Carter years, not to mention the fact that interest rates, inflation and unemployment fell faster under Reagan than they did immediately before or after his presidency. From 1981 to 1989, the U.S. economy produced 17 million new jobs or roughly 2 million new jobs each year. Under Pres. Reagan, productivity grew at a 1.5% annual rate- lower than in the '50s and '60s, but much higher than in the post-Reagan years. By comparison, under Pres. Clinton, productivity grew at an annual rate of 0.3% per year.

The fact is that the middle class and lower class paid less in taxes in 1989 than they did in 1981 and the wealthy paid more in taxes in 1989 than they did in 1981.
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Old 06-27-2009, 01:18 AM
 
48,502 posts, read 96,877,697 times
Reputation: 18304
With reagan its the easily seen results that count. i think he wil rank right upo their with many of teh great presidents. He and Clinton were by far the best speakers of the last presdients and I give the definitwe edge to reagan. Just the fact that thier were Democtrats for reagn his last term in these days says alot.
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Old 06-27-2009, 01:47 PM
 
19,226 posts, read 15,326,750 times
Reputation: 2337
Reagan was responsible for the corporate takeover of farms coast to coast.

The backlash was the Freemen of Montana.

Now Monsanto and others are trying to corner the market on world food production.

Both Bush and Reagan worked hard to get all means of American production handed over to Corporate Interests. Both and Obama fascists all.
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Old 06-27-2009, 07:01 PM
 
3,555 posts, read 7,851,443 times
Reputation: 2346
Fleet wrote;
Quote:
The American economy performed better during the Reagan era than during the years before or after him.
As the 13 year olds on here constantly say; "source or it never happened". Actually Reagan benefitted a lot from the upswing in the business cycle, you did know that the US economy had been in bad shape from about '72 onward, right?

Quote:
Real median family income grew by $4,000 during Pres. Reagan's term after experiencing no growth at all in the Carter years, not to mention the fact that interest rates, inflation and unemployment fell faster under Reagan than they did immediately before or after his presidency.
Not in dispute, but it's in dispute, except at Fox News as to why. BTW, "immediately after his Presidency" would be GHW Bush.

Quote:
From 1981 to 1989, the U.S. economy produced 17 million new jobs or roughly 2 million new jobs each year.
Actually about 16.1 million, compared to 22.7 under Clinton. I notice you don't mention anything about the stock market performance under Reagan.

Quote:
Under Pres. Reagan, productivity grew at a 1.5% annual rate- lower than in the '50s and '60s, but much higher than in the post-Reagan years. By comparison, under Pres. Clinton, productivity grew at an annual rate of 0.3% per year.
Not sure where you got this stat, now why you included it. Actually I'm pretty sure Reagan's productivity growth rate was better, maybe 1.7, but Clinton's wasn't much worse, unless you're comparing ALL factors, versus labor input only.

Quote:
The fact is that the middle class and lower class paid less in taxes in 1989 than they did in 1981 and the wealthy paid more in taxes in 1989 than they did in 1981.
I don't have my stats here, but IIRC Reagan went back and increased taxes several times after the "big tax cut" and if the wealthy were paying more it's because there were a whole lot more wealthy. And you can't exclude SS/FICA from working class folks, that went up a bunch under Reagan.

I think by taking Fox as your sole source for all things Reagan you've not looked closely enough at all stats.

Good info in your post though.

golfgod
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Old 06-27-2009, 11:20 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,796,716 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJon3475 View Post
Your problem is helping them over the hump bankrupts an already struggling country. The same problems California faced when he took over. $1 million dollars a day more than it took in. Do you think he taxed more or cut? Was he re-elected? Was he then elected president? Yeah yeah I know Californians are whacky...
He told people to "vote with their feet", in other words move. He didn't help them attract new industry, that type of thing. And Good God, are you going to let people starve? Actually, the unions ran food banks back in the early 80s in Pittsburgh. Sorry, his cavalier attitude soured me on him.

"For every problem there is a solution which is simple, obvious, and wrong."
— Albert Einstein
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Old 06-27-2009, 11:23 PM
 
Location: southern california
61,288 posts, read 87,441,267 times
Reputation: 55562
reagan got our self respect goin after viet nam. he also taught us that debt was meaningless.
reagan was a movie star not an economist.
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Old 06-27-2009, 11:31 PM
 
Location: PNW
689 posts, read 743,225 times
Reputation: 159
Yes...we definitely need to get over this Reagan worship. In case everyone has not heard, it's time to worship Obama. I mean he's been in office for a few months now. News flash... Hello everyone.
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Old 06-28-2009, 09:50 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,473,584 times
Reputation: 4799
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfgod View Post



Actually about 16.1 million, compared to 22.7 under Clinton. I notice you don't mention anything about the stock market performance under Reagan.
Why don't you find out what Clinton thought about Reagan.
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Old 06-28-2009, 09:51 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,473,584 times
Reputation: 4799
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
He told people to "vote with their feet",
That was Milton Friedman... And it was a response to the unfettered economies of Singapore, Hong Kong... etc. You might like it because it is exploratory of what no regulation at all provides. Great products for the people with no safeties.
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