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Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iknowftbll
Maybe not for theirs, but would they object to someone else pursuing it?
The only person I would have a problem with pursuing it would be my mother. I just don't think it is a healthy choice at her age. Of course, there is zero chance of that happening.
But this has happened (or is happening) with gay marriage as well.
No, it's not. Gay marriage isn't any different from heterosexual marriage. A legal marriage involves 2 people. You have certain benefits from marriage - like tax breaks, health insurance (although now many companies offer these to partners as well), visitation rights, inheritance even if there is no will, etc. This is based on 2 people. In order to make marriage involve more than 2 people - they would have to rewrite a lot of these things. Who does the money go to in the event of death? Is it split evenly? If someone is on life support and not all the spouses agree on what to do - who gets to decide? And so on and so forth.
Oh - and people watching shows based on thinks like sister wives isn't the same thing as people accepting it or wanting to be a part of it. People like to watch crazy things.
First we had "Sister Wives." Now we have "My Five Wives." (FWIW, I'll never again be able to listen to David Bowie's "Modern Love" and not think of polygamy. )
Our culture has taken a softer stance against gay marriage. As recently as the late 1990s it was still considered incomprehensible that gay marriage would reach mainstream. Now it is not only becoming mainstream, but it almost seems like you're not allowed to oppose it anymore for any reason. If you do oppose it, keep your opinion to yourself or be branded a hate-mongerer.
I think then it is fair to wonder if other, shall we call them "non-traditional" marriage alignments, are not far from the mainstream as well. With shows like those above paving the way, our culture may be slowly normalizing to the idea of plural marriage. Right now, plural marriage is dismissed as something practiced only by a few whack-job extremists from cults. But I think change may be on the horizon.
For example, the Browns (of "Sister Wives") are presented as a highly functional family. If you watch the show, it is inevitable that you will begin to like Cody, all four of his wives, and their kids. They dress and look like normal people. This is significant because a lot of people think of girls dress like they're on the set of "Little House on the Prairie" when they think of polygamy. And while the cameras cannot possibly capture every emotional struggle, they do bring to light some critical thinking points that can lead viewers to ask themselves "what if?"
Furthermore, the network would not be introducing another polygamy show if there was not some sort of demand signal from the viewing public. This tells me curiosity is aroused. And with it, perhaps a spirit of acceptance toward polygamists is on the horizon?
What say you? I mentioned two reality TV shows as my basis for public interest in this topic. Perhaps someone here is aware of some other source or movement to propel this idea forward? For example, some Muslims practice polygamy and it existed in early Judaism as well. Perhaps we would see a "Preachers and bootleggers" sort of alliance in the coming years?
NOTE: This post is not a values judgment on the subject of gay marriage or polygamy. It is simply a question based on observation.
If anything, my guess would be no. Considering here in the U.S., our system is FAR from being progressive as mass media paints it out to be. And, I wouldn't group polygamy with progressive modern thinking- more like 18th century King James/feudalism in Europe.
In the age of modernism, we seem to be moving backwards in time with iphones and pc phones serving as the only saving glory.
That being said, the way people vote is also starting to resemble a theocratic society where nobody really questions what politicians are doing anymore, and both the red and blue parties are basically the same.
We're shifting more towards a conservative movement with our own personal privacies taken away, fear being so instilled.
Polyamory/polygamy on the rise? Maybe if people started adopting religious views which promote it like certain branches of Mormanism. But, Christianity seems to be strong and prevalent in this sort of economy/society.
No, it's not. Gay marriage isn't any different from heterosexual marriage. A legal marriage involves 2 people. You have certain benefits from marriage - like tax breaks, health insurance (although now many companies offer these to partners as well), visitation rights, inheritance even if there is no will, etc. This is based on 2 people. In order to make marriage involve more than 2 people - they would have to rewrite a lot of these things. Who does the money go to in the event of death? Is it split evenly? If someone is on life support and not all the spouses agree on what to do - who gets to decide? And so on and so forth.
Okay, I see what you are saying regarding laws now. The whole system is based on two people.
It is not a coincidence that the vast majority of suicide bombers come from polygamous societies. With polygamy, high status (rich) men are the big winners as they can take on multiple attractive women. If the rich guy has five wives, it means there are four or men out there who are doing with out female companionship altogether. (that is why they are tempted by finally getting some sex virgins upon death). In polygamous Mormon societies, low status men are expelled from the group altogether once they approach manhood (and ends up doing twink porn to pay the bills).
High status females are also losers in this system because they have to share a man whereas they would not have to do so in a monogamous society.
All of this is to day that no, it isn't catching on. We just watch it on TV.
First we had "Sister Wives." Now we have "My Five Wives." (FWIW, I'll never again be able to listen to David Bowie's "Modern Love" and not think of polygamy. )
Our culture has taken a softer stance against gay marriage. As recently as the late 1990s it was still considered incomprehensible that gay marriage would reach mainstream. Now it is not only becoming mainstream, but it almost seems like you're not allowed to oppose it anymore for any reason. If you do oppose it, keep your opinion to yourself or be branded a hate-mongerer.
I think then it is fair to wonder if other, shall we call them "non-traditional" marriage alignments, are not far from the mainstream as well. With shows like those above paving the way, our culture may be slowly normalizing to the idea of plural marriage. Right now, plural marriage is dismissed as something practiced only by a few whack-job extremists from cults. But I think change may be on the horizon.
For example, the Browns (of "Sister Wives") are presented as a highly functional family. If you watch the show, it is inevitable that you will begin to like Cody, all four of his wives, and their kids. They dress and look like normal people. This is significant because a lot of people think of girls dress like they're on the set of "Little House on the Prairie" when they think of polygamy. And while the cameras cannot possibly capture every emotional struggle, they do bring to light some critical thinking points that can lead viewers to ask themselves "what if?"
Furthermore, the network would not be introducing another polygamy show if there was not some sort of demand signal from the viewing public. This tells me curiosity is aroused. And with it, perhaps a spirit of acceptance toward polygamists is on the horizon?
What say you? I mentioned two reality TV shows as my basis for public interest in this topic. Perhaps someone here is aware of some other source or movement to propel this idea forward? For example, some Muslims practice polygamy and it existed in early Judaism as well. Perhaps we would see a "Preachers and bootleggers" sort of alliance in the coming years?
NOTE: This post is not a values judgment on the subject of gay marriage or polygamy. It is simply a question based on observation.
No, the society shifts towards temporary unions or outright promiscuity.
Polygamous societies were generally rather centered on rich men maintaining harems, with one "primary" wife (usually one with legitimate heirs) and revolving door for the other women who happen to come and go, depending on their looks and youth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by iknowftbll
Maybe not for theirs, but would they object to someone else pursuing it?
That's because an increasing number of people are libertarian on those issues. They tend to care about their own lives and their own family and they tend to be tolerant of what other people do about things that are related to their own families. Notice the difference between words "support" and "tolerate".
I don't really give a rat's tush if someone wants to engage in polygamy, but it doesn't seem like it's going to become a fad. It's a pain in the ass from every description I've read, even when the parties are supposedly more enlightened about gender roles.
The whole Sister Wives and My Five Wives scenario, first of all, rests on this idea of the husband as a rock star in his own home. It's just ridiculous. I have a hard time taking those shows seriously. Yeah, it works for them, but for the pragmatic person who believes in gender equality, it just seems overly patriarchal (even with the modern veneer) and unnecessarily complicated.
Polyamory is the obvious choice in secular society in some ways, but again, it simply introduces too many complications for the average person to want to be involved. Between kids and work, most of my married friends barely have time for each other, let alone to include other people in their relationship. Add onto that the concerns about STDs.
Really, the thing is that polyamory and polygamy are simply too much work and effort to make them feasible without a lot of discord and infighting. Most people will not gravitate this way, even with a legal seal of approval.
I think then it is fair to wonder if other, shall we call them "non-traditional" marriage alignments, are not far from the mainstream as well. With shows like those above paving the way, our culture may be slowly normalizing to the idea of plural marriage. Right now, plural marriage is dismissed as something practiced only by a few whack-job extremists from cults. But I think change may be on the horizon.
The true measure of whether plural marriage is going mainstream will be when we see acceptance of women having more than one husband. I don't see that happening any time soon, if ever.
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