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Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TabulaRasa
I would be surprised if you know people as well as you think you do.
Ok, well, I'm not. Most of the people I've dated I'm still friends with. Including my first (we're going to our high school 25th next year together). I've been to many of their weddings, know many of their families, often get together on holidays, and generally the people I date remain in my life long after we stop dating. I think I knew they were good people from the very beginning and they remain good people now. They're my closest friends, all that has changed really is that the sex ended and we transitioned to friendships. Some after 2-3 dates, others after years of dating.
Except it is a big deal when a man doesn't want to wait. Then he gets castigated the way the OP has been on this thread--even though he said he is interested in a relationship with her. Suddenly, he's just in it for sex, he's a cad, he doesn't deserve her, he should do her the favor and dump her, blah, blah, blah.
The way I see it, if people are going to get up on high horses and rag on people who get busy more quickly than they do, I get to rag on the prigs and the prudes. Goose, gander.
I guess I don't see how it's a big deal. If he really wants a relationship, he should be willing to wait until she's comfortable. I can't imagine bailing after 3 dates with someone. And if it is that big of a deal to him - then obviously she's not the right person for him to have a relationship with. If someone is genuinely interested in a relationship with a person - then you wait until both parties are ready or at the very least, have a discussion about it and see what is going on.
When it comes to sex - it's about waiting until both people are ready. Just because someone is ready first - it doesn't mean that they are then entitled to sex. But like I said, if one person wants to wait for a long time and the other person doesn't - then maybe they just aren't right for each other.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with or weird about being guarded when meeting with a complete stranger for the first time.
When I was single, I was never "afraid" of going on a date. But I also wasn't a throw-all-caution-to-the-wind moron who thought nobody could ever hurt me.
And not producing my genitalia three dates in as a general rule of thumb isn't a stance I can agree with because I consider my vagina to be the Holy Grail. It's because, frankly, who the eff are YOU, person I've gone on three dates with? I really don't know yet.
Exactly. This is really not so complicated.
Women bear the risk of pregnancy in a way men don't too.
Not to mention, in general women are hardwired to associate emotional connection with good sex.
Some of us wait until we are more comfortable with the situation/guy to protect ourselves and our hearts, that's all.
I would be surprised if you know people as well as you think you do.
Is it really that difficult to accept that some people have good radar? Once I got into my late 20s, mine was finely tuned. Actually, it was finely tuned before that, but I ignored my gut when I shouldn't have.
I can't speak for Timberline, as he's a man and all, but I have much older sisters. I had the benefit of learning from their mistakes, and seeing from a distance what traits are good and bad in a man, and what clues he gives by the things he says and does that will tip a woman off to his character. Even so, I realize that if a man turns out to be a jerk, that's on him, not me. It has no bearing on my worth and self-esteem. Only he is responsible for his behavior.
For example, if a man carries some dopey double standard and would consider a woman "too easy" for being with him "too soon," I see that as a deal-breaking character flaw in him, whether he took that attitude with me or spoke that way about other women. I have pretty stringent criteria for what I like and don't like in terms of a man's attitude, which actually makes my weeding process go a lot quicker than women who dance around playing the "get to know you" game.
My own theory--and this is going to sound brutally sexist and misogynistic, but so be it--is that a lot of women talk too much or focus on the wrong things (job, house, money, etc.) and don't listen and observe enough in the early stages. If you ask the right questions, you can learn a lot by just letting him answer.
"And some can see the emotional wrecks, the confusion and bitterness that prevails among many women who allow their bodies to be nothing more than a vessel with man after man after man,"
I know a woman who does that, actually 2. She is married and has one hook up one after the next. They are not even a ONS because they don't last a night. She leaves the bar with a man, then comes back an hour later with out him. Ive seen it happen a couple of times, but the locals say she does it every night she is there. She is always complaining to mutual aquantainces that she can't find a man .
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 36,995,252 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilac110
I can't speak for Timberline, as he's a man and all, but I have much older sisters. I had the benefit of learning from their mistakes, and seeing from a distance what traits are good and bad in a man, and what clues he gives by the things he says and does that will tip a woman off to his character. Even so, I realize that if a man turns out to be a jerk, that's on him, not me. It has no bearing on my worth and self-esteem. Only he is responsible for his behavior.
For me it just came naturally. I always had female friends growing up (platonic), so there was never any mysterious element to the other sex (I still don't get how this is an issue for so many people). People, without hidden agendas (and those are exceptionally rare) are pretty forthright with who they are, and what they're about. Now, what they want in a relationship is trickier as people don't often know themselves (and people often confuse what the person says they "want" with what they "want with me", two very different things). But the first part (who they are and what they're about) and whether they're "good" people at their core, is really apparent very quickly... When I say "good" people I mean something more, I mean "my people", a person that is good and we're on the same page.
Lots of this is picked up within minutes. Some of it is part of good chemistry, for those that have healthy relationships generally. I realize not everyone seems to be able to trust their chemistry though.
Keep telling yourself what you need to. You have very limited experience with sex, having only had one partner, a husband. You don't know the half of it, Molli. You really don't, and you're not in a position either to offer advice to women more experienced than you are or to judge them for it.
Lilac, why are you so defensive? Are you unable to really internalize your behavior and consider it to be acceptable? Post after post after post on this thread and others you are defensive as all get out. I'm beginning to find some humor in all of this.
Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
41,936 posts, read 36,995,252 times
Reputation: 40635
Quote:
Originally Posted by Molli
Lilac, why are you so defensive? Are you unable to really internalize your behavior and consider it to be acceptable? Post after post after post on this thread and others you are defensive as all get out. I'm beginning to find some humor in all of this.
She isn't really being defensive. She's being very honest, pragmatic, and rationale. It's real talk.
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