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Aha. Well, thank you for clarifying. Hmmm. If I were going to try to nail the naysayer pulse of the thread overall, I'd say that most posters generally feel that our culture is overreacting to teen sex, that concerns about teen sexuality are historically ubiquitous, and that assessments of current teen sexual behavior, deemed promiscuity in comparison with past generations, are exaggerated and inaccurate. While I can see that this suggests that teen sexual behavior has little relationship to self-esteem, I don't think that equates to enjoying degradation. Which is why I didn't understand where you got that.
I dig your confrontational ways, Urban Sasquatch, which is why I responded. That said, your comment that, ideally, you would like to procreate on a self-contained island, eliminate your associations with women, and control your child's upbringing completely suggests that you are a bit... ridiculous! Nah, but it does make you sound angry and suspicious.
Some posters may feel that way (the overreaction to teen sex and the historical ubiquity of "these darned kids and their rock music") but there are definitely statements coming out where any attempt to explain is like playing that childish game where no matter what one says, they've got to either nitpick individual words or one-up the stakes as though it somehow proves something.
By way of illustration, a young man works in the office next to mine. He was just a kid when he came here seven years ago and he talked and acted like a kid. At the time he had a large Akita named Lord and he was in the habit (since I was in the military as well as into martial arts and fitness at the time) of asking me how I would defend myself in silly, hypothetical scenarios.
"What would you do," he asked me one day "If Lord attacked you?"
I didn't know what this was about and it was nuts. However, we were on a smoke break and the atmosphere was casual, so I responded casually.
"I'd kill him, I guess. Why would you ask that?"
He pressed on. "You think you could kill him if he attacked you? He's pretty big."
"What am I supposed to do, lay there and take it?"
"What if he had rabies and was totally insane?"
"Why are you asking me this stupid stuff?"
"I'm just making conversation. What if?"
"Same thing, and then go get rabies shots. Are we finished?"
*pause*
"...........what if there were two of him?"
No matter what I said the whole point was to reach a place where the ONLY answer was that I should admit my utter helplessness in the face of horrific onslaught. I began to make fun of this kid anytime he brought that stuff up, exaggerating his own scenarios for him: What if Lord was filled with rabies and aliens took him and mutated his DNA so that he was half Akita, half Rottweiller and half Velociraptor -- all 150 percent of him -- and he could shoot lasers from his eyes and was the size of the Chrysler building?
I often feel like I'm dealing with that when I make a statement involving a broad sweep of people in general and someone replies with what is essentially "Nuh-UH, 'cos I know this ONE person who didn't do that at all!"
Because that nullifies everyone else who does, right?
Not saying you did that, only that it happens a LOT in here... hell, virtually anywhere.
As for my self-contained island, remember (if you're going to say it's ridiculous) so that it's accurate: I said the only thing I'd like better than that was a loving and trustworthy partner with whom to have a child.
I think that portion kind of qualifies my statement rather than making it sound ridiculous, don't you?
I'm not sure teenage girls are easier today than in the past?
It's possible that they appear easier because the media and society openly talk about & inject sex into every facet of our lives, including products, clothes, shows and music, especially those targeted towards teenagers.
I'm also not convinced that "good & vigilant" parenting alone will stop teenagers hell-bent on having sex, from doing so. Let's not forget that after 1st grade at the latest, we (parents) are no longer their primary source of information. When I was a teenager, many girls in my neighborhood went to parochial school and their mom's were generally SAHM, while I went to public school and my parents were pretty lax because they were both so busy. I can tell you that out of all of us, I was by far the "good girl" in the bunch.
No doubt all of these things have some influence on them, but ultimately teenagers developmentally will seek out their pleasure without thinking of long-term consequences. They want to grow up really fast, feed their hormonal urges (boys) or gain self-esteem and love (girls). Teenagers biologically and developmentally haven't really changed over the generations, I think it's just less hush-hush today, therefore it probably isn't any different today.
I think it will ultimately depend on the maturity and self-esteem of the individual teenager.
As for my self-contained island, remember (if you're going to say it's ridiculous) so that it's accurate: I said the only thing I'd like better than that was a loving and trustworthy partner with whom to have a child.
I think that portion kind of qualifies my statement rather than making it sound ridiculous, don't you?
The part that was emphasized in my reading of it was how ideal that auto-production would be. But yea, yea it does qualify the statement.
Tell me why I should care as long as they're not making babies or catching/spreading STDs. I'm up for any reasonable argument that's not religiously based.
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Originally Posted by Whyte Byrd
I'm more concerned about these kids than why you or someone else doesn't. But thank you for the invite.
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Originally Posted by Violett
Well, that's the thing. If you can't verbalize to a teenager why they shouldn't do a pleasurable behavior, they're going to do it. "It's just wrong" is an argument that never holds water with teens. They need a reason.
LOL!!!!! Hahahahah!!!! Since WHEN is REASON reason enough for kids to stop doing what's fun???? It doesn't take a lot of reason to figure out that racing on the highway can kill, but kids still do it. It doesn't take a leap of logic to realize that a contraceptive that is 99% effective isn't very effective at all. 1% ineffective X millions of promiscuous girls = HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE numbers of girls getting pregnant before they are ready to raise the kid.
This IS the number ONE reason that the free love flower power sexual revolution in the 60s was one of the worst things to happen to our society in the past 100 years. And it doesn't have anything to do with religion. It's also the reason we excuse women... ENCOURAGE women to murder their unborn babies.
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Originally Posted by mgt04
Is it because of religious implications? I dunno really just posing the question...
No, it's because it's stupid to ignore the very real possibility that you will get pregnant when you have sex, even with "protection."
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Originally Posted by ulnevrwalkalone
So this girl has her life together enough to attend church, school, and extracurriculars, and is doing well enough to go to college. But because she is having sex theres something wrong with her???
Uh, yes.
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AS long as she is safe an not getting pregnant or spreading stds the only thing I see wrong here is I didn't find a girl like that in high school
And what is the assurance that she is safe, won't get pregnant, or spread stds? If condoms are 1% ineffective against pregnancy, they are 1% ineffective against STDs.
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Originally Posted by Violett
People only put that kind of value judgment on themselves because society tells them that they're supposed to. When you break it down, there's no real reason teen girls shouldn't have sex if they're being careful.
Wrong wrong WRONG! "Being careful" is a myth. 1% ineffective is freaking WAAAAAY ineffective.
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Back in the day, being abstinent had a reason. It's because we didn't have the pill.
The pill's not good enough. Sterilization isn't good enough!! 3 out of every 1000 STERILIZED couples get pregnant within a year!!! Did you know THAT?? Multiply THAT number by the millions of people engaging in regular sex in the west. That is the low end of how many "protected" people get pregnant each year.
I'm glad somebody here recognizes that there's a double standard when it comes to sexuality.
I think the question shouldn't be "why are teenage girls so easy these days" but rather "why does society continue to punish and look down on sexually-assertive women while it's okay for men to engage in the same behavior?"
No, it's "why does society continue to encourage sexual promiscuity?" Just because boys do it doesn't mean that it's ok for girls to do it too. NEITHER should be promiscuous.
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Originally Posted by Violett
Any guy who doesn't respect you if you sleep with him is a misogynist dbag and totally not worth your time.
We're talking boys here, come on. They aren't exactly the model for male behavior. Their job is to learn, not to be an example. So, don't use them as an example.
Perhaps because most adults are pretty "easy" too ? We live in a highly sexualised society where anything goes.
There's your answer right there. Good one Mooseketeer.
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Originally Posted by Whyte Byrd
I doubt it's most, seriously.
No, Mooseketeer is right. Just look at Sex in the City. People might not have sex at the drop of a hat, but they do have sex at the drop of a hat after the 3rd date, or after they become boyfriend/girlfriend, or after they reach that arbitrary line in the sand. MOST adults in the western world DO engage in sex way to easily today.
Teenage girls were still easy in the mid 90's, just sayin.......
Not as many.
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Originally Posted by Mt-7
I think that mother's were and are hoping that they will get a little help keeping their son's on the straight and narrow. We as women involve our emotions and brains in this. Men, not so much. We give a little piece of our heart out each time.
Thank you. Absolutely true. There is usually truth behind stereotype. Men and Women ARE different.
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Originally Posted by skel1977
Teenage girls have always been easy. I guess in the past they have been more secretive about it. Now its cool to brag about it.
This is just not true. Well, there have always been easy teenage girls. But it's only recently been acceptable for ANY teenage girl to be easy.
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Originally Posted by Capt. Dan
I dont think teenage girls are any "easier" these days. I think there are more men willing to take advantage of thier youth and naivete. Girls of today are no different than girls of yesterday.
You're right and you're wrong. Girls are essentially the same. But they are behaving differently. The difference is our culture.
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It's when the teen girls turn thier infatuations toward an older man like me, and they do this more than people may realize,that we need men to be decent and caring and point the girls in a different direction.
I really don't think the problem in question is young girls having sex with older men. The problem is teenage promiscuity. And it is real and it is growing.
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Originally Posted by Avienne
See, if there's one thing I can't stand, it's when people pin what they perceive to be "loose morals" on girls, with no mention of boys whatsoever. Who do you think these "easy girls" are sleeping with?
Without easy girls, teen boys wouldn't have anyone to have sex with. Boys have always wanted sex. Surprise!!! They reach their sexual peak 10 years before girls do! Again, males and females ARE DIFFERENT!
Am I excusing boys' behavior. No. I don't like that either. But it doesn't mean that it's okay for girls to be slutty too. Stay on topic.
By that rationale, women no longer have any use for men whatsoever.
Well, that's EXACTLY what we are seeing amongst women these days! Haven't you heard the term "I don't need a man. I want one?"
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Originally Posted by teatime
If anything, we need to empower the boys to stand up for their rights, too, and not be ashamed to report inappropriate behavior.
A-MEN! We need to get back to teaching boys how to become men! Where are all the men these days?
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That said, your comment that, ideally, you would like to procreate on a self-contained island, eliminate your associations with women, and control your child's upbringing completely suggests that you are a bit... ridiculous! Nah, but it does make you sound angry and suspicious.
