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Think of how many poor, sick, and needy people with inadequate insurance -- or no insurance at all -- could have been treated with a hundred million dollars?
Given that the average American spends around 4K a year on insurance premiums, not very many. You could pay for 25K Americans to have insurance for a year. Course that doesn't cover the equally high deductibles. That wouldn't even be enough to fill a football stadium.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirina
How many apartment buildings and single person homesteads could have been built for the homeless, with no need for them to pay a mortgage or excessive rent?
The point is, that kind of money could have been put to far better use -- and if these ridiculous strutting apologists were even one-tenth the Christians they claim to be, they would be using the money for just such an altruistic purpose.
Still a drop in the bucket. It would make a far bigger impact if every American just donated one dollar. You would immediately have over 300 million. Also, the money didn't just appear out of nowhere. It was funded through donations and investors who purchased bonds or got lifetime memberships. Therefore, it wouldn't have been possible to raise 100 million completely from charitable giving.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirina
Instead, they use it to blindside the American people with complete and utter ignorance of science, building one of the biggest wastes of property ever devised by a human being. Instead, they have to build a monument to right-wing religious propaganda that spews lies and misconceptions around every corner. I bet even the toilets in that place are somehow deceitful, saying, "You don't really have to pee like a Russian race horse. No ... no you don't ... go in your pants. Do you think dinosaurs had toilets? They couldn't stop to use the bathroom when Jesus was riding them, you know."
Nothing factual in your statement. I will point out again, tripadvisor and google reviews have overwhelming glowing reviews about this attraction. Thousands of people are glad they went to visit this "wastes of property" as you say.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shirina
Practically everything in that museum runs contrary to proven, demonstrable reality.
And to make matters worse, I have no doubt they profit from that monstrosity one way or the other. They get to "lie for Jesus" and get paid at the same time.
I can only hope that I live long enough to see that ark become a mecca for urban explorers, ghost hunters, and groups of partying teens with a couple of six packs and a can of spray paint.
Then why should any city or government ever use tax payer money to fund a piece of art or a park? After all those dollars could be used for health insurance! All you show here is a biased against Christianity. If it had been a monument of Superman, I doubt you would have any problem with it.
May I take the time to point something out here...?
I posed a query on how the Ark funds may have been better spent to Theists that Jeffbase was kind enough to earnestly answer. I respect his answer and "respectfully" disagree with it in a later post, citing my take on it in a response to a post made by Shirina.
Quite a few of you have quoted Jeffbase's answer to me by throwing it back in his face with such vitriol it makes me concerned Theists may hesitate to earnestly answer any questions I (or anyone else) might have going forward for fear of reprisal. Disagreeing and taking a counter stance is fine, but must it be done in such a manner?
I would not want to feel I would have to add a "miranda" to future questions:
"Anything you say can and will be used against you"....
You know what you didn't have back when we had blue laws and most people went to church? Kids mass murdering their classmates.
WOW. I am relatively new here, but it hasn't taken long to see that your arguments have all the logic of "the moon looks white at night, therefore it must be made of Vermont cheddar."
You know what else we didn't have back then (or at least as much of)? Widespread availability of assault weapons. The internet, where kids can feed off each other's angst, and brush up on technique. Violent video games. Bullying, which has always been there but is taken to new levels via social media. A 24 hr news cycle that gives everyone their 15 minutes of fame. Perceived glorification and notoriety. And on, and on. I doubt that any one of those things is individually responsible for school shootings. This is what social science can help us understand (sorry if the word "science" offends). But I know of zero evidence that blue laws or going to church had an inhibitory effect on kids shooting classmates.
[ETA: Please excuse the vitriol, if any. I am sensitive to the immediately foregoing plea for respectful disagreement, but I don't know how else to respond to a comment that takes such an unsupported leap.]
Last edited by HeelaMonster; 09-26-2018 at 07:51 AM..
Interesting comments. I think that most of us have come across the drop in a bucket apologetic when greedy bosses excuse their massive salary increases by saying that paying themselves a million extra a year is nothing compared to the crippling expense of paying their staff $5 extra a year, so, regrettably no raise this year, either.
I appreciate your argument from art gallery and statues of Superman. I wondered whether anyone would come up with that. It's one reason why I like your posting better than a few others.
I may say that I look with a certain amount of disgust at council spending on cheezy street furniture at the top of a principle city thoroughfare that is looking increasingly like a back street in Mogadishu, but with a lot more drunks, druggies and streetwalkers. But I would have no objection to a new library, art gallery and museum. The bottom line being the purpose it serves.
No doubt for you, the Ark Encounter, Creation museum and Bible Disneyland is worth bilking the Public of millions to build because it Promulgates the Truth. To me, it is a propaganda machine intended - at best - to keep peddling this pack of lies as though it was fact and at worst to make a very nice living out of the bamboozled sheeple.
I think Ken Hamm is actually genuine, and he cheats and defrauds because he genuinely thinks it is God's work and everyone should pay for it. He sees nothing wrong at all with criminal business practices, because only True believers should be involved in the construction. I admit that the Ark looks impressive, some parts of it look quite mice inside. I like the polished wood and the Noachian Chandeliers. Pity he didn't have the triceratops -powered conveyor belt for transporting Dino -poop to the gunn'ls, but the Pakicetus model is exemplary by all accounts. Doesn't alter the fact that it is a fraud, a swindle and badly overpriced, an that would be reason enough to want to see it go belly -up, put into recievership and taken over for some useful purpose, like an evolution museum.
Last edited by TRANSPONDER; 09-26-2018 at 07:54 AM..
WOW. I am relatively new here, but it hasn't taken long to see that your arguments have all the logic of "the moon looks white at night, therefore it must be made of Vermont cheddar."
You know what else we didn't have back then (or at least as much of)? Widespread availability of assault weapons. The internet, where kids can feed off each other's angst, and brush up on technique. Violent video games. Bullying, which has always been there but is taken to new levels via social media. A 24 hr news cycle that gives everyone their 15 minutes of fame. Perceived glorification and notoriety. And on, and on. I doubt that any one of those things is individually responsible for school shootings. This is what social science can help us understand (sorry if the word "science" offends). But I know of zero evidence that blue laws or going to church had an inhibitory effect on kids shooting classmates.
[ETA: Please excuse the vitriol, if any. I am sensitive to the immediately foregoing plea for respectful disagreement, but I don't know how else to respond to a comment that takes such an unsupported leap.]
I agree that you can't just isolate one single factor as having a particular cause and effect. There are millions of kids who play violent video games and never have any desire to hurt a person in real life. I believe it is a combination of factors including lack of a church family or spiritual relationship which can create the recipe for someone to snap.
I can speak from personal experience that I was bullied relentlessly in school even starting in first grade. I can still remember to this day being in tears when getting on the school bus and no one would let me sit with them. They would scoot to the edge and shake their head and I would be forced to stand up for the bus ride. Not sure why the driver allowed that crap. I'm sure it wouldn't fly today. However, thankfully I could come hope to a loving family and had a church home where I felt accepted and valued as a member of the body of Christ.
Kids often just lack empathy, and will highlight any weakness or difference that they can exploit. Many kids don't have the support at home, and then strip away going to church as well and they are completely isolated and feel hopeless.
I agree that you can't just isolate one single factor as having a particular cause and effect. There are millions of kids who play violent video games and never have any desire to hurt a person in real life. I believe it is a combination of factors including lack of a church family or spiritual relationship which can create the recipe for someone to snap.
I can speak from personal experience that I was bullied relentlessly in school even starting in first grade. I can still remember to this day being in tears when getting on the school bus and no one would let me sit with them. They would scoot to the edge and shake their head and I would be forced to stand up for the bus ride. Not sure why the driver allowed that crap. I'm sure it wouldn't fly today. However, thankfully I could come hope to a loving family and had a church home where I felt accepted and valued as a member of the body of Christ.
Kids often just lack empathy, and will highlight any weakness or difference that they can exploit. Many kids don't have the support at home, and then strip away going to church as well and they are completely isolated and feel hopeless.
Thanks for your reply. I am sorry you were bullied as a kid.
We can agree that feelings of isolation and hopelessness are often root causes, with other things (guns, internet, etc) providing the means to the end. We may still differ on the absence or presence of church, as a mediating factor, but I don't doubt that SOME find shelter and acceptance there. There may be others who, through the fog of mental illness (unmentioned above, but also a contributing factor), find righteous support for their actions. We certainly agree on a combination of factors.
Kids often just lack empathy, and will highlight any weakness or difference that they can exploit. Many kids don't have the support at home, and then strip away going to church as well and they are completely isolated and feel hopeless.
And gay kids are bullied worst of all. Especially by religionists like yourself. Since you know some of the pain they endure daily, I don't understand how you can look at yourself in the mirror without flinching. I know you're capable of empathy and because of that I used to have hope for you. But I soon realized that all your empathy is for yourself and you have none to spare for others.
May I take the time to point something out here...?
I posed a query on how the Ark funds may have been better spent to Theists that Jeffbase was kind enough to earnestly answer. I respect his answer and "respectfully" disagree with it in a later post, citing my take on it in a response to a post made by Shirina.
Quite a few of you have quoted Jeffbase's answer to me by throwing it back in his face with such vitriol it makes me concerned Theists may hesitate to earnestly answer any questions I (or anyone else) might have going forward for fear of reprisal. Disagreeing and taking a counter stance is fine, but must it be done in such a manner?
I would not want to feel I would have to add a "miranda" to future questions:
"Anything you say can and will be used against you"....
Yes, I advocate a certain sophisticated restraint when responding to Christian apologetics. But such exchanges do get heated (both ways), and I imagine many of those who respond have History with Jeff, who rarely restrains his tongue or vitriol of anything else, when responding to us.
I agree that you can't just isolate one single factor as having a particular cause and effect. There are millions of kids who play violent video games and never have any desire to hurt a person in real life. I believe it is a combination of factors including lack of a church family or spiritual relationship which can create the recipe for someone to snap.
I can speak from personal experience that I was bullied relentlessly in school even starting in first grade. I can still remember to this day being in tears when getting on the school bus and no one would let me sit with them. They would scoot to the edge and shake their head and I would be forced to stand up for the bus ride. Not sure why the driver allowed that crap. I'm sure it wouldn't fly today. However, thankfully I could come hope to a loving family and had a church home where I felt accepted and valued as a member of the body of Christ.
Kids often just lack empathy, and will highlight any weakness or difference that they can exploit. Many kids don't have the support at home, and then strip away going to church as well and they are completely isolated and feel hopeless.
Is there any (non-violent) person you can think of that you would never share a seat/meal with?
WOW. I am relatively new here, but it hasn't taken long to see that your arguments have all the logic of "the moon looks white at night, therefore it must be made of Vermont cheddar."
You know what else we didn't have back then (or at least as much of)? Widespread availability of assault weapons. The internet, where kids can feed off each other's angst, and brush up on technique. Violent video games. Bullying, which has always been there but is taken to new levels via social media. A 24 hr news cycle that gives everyone their 15 minutes of fame. Perceived glorification and notoriety. And on, and on. I doubt that any one of those things is individually responsible for school shootings. This is what social science can help us understand (sorry if the word "science" offends). But I know of zero evidence that blue laws or going to church had an inhibitory effect on kids shooting classmates.
[ETA: Please excuse the vitriol, if any. I am sensitive to the immediately foregoing plea for respectful disagreement, but I don't know how else to respond to a comment that takes such an unsupported leap.]
Sorry, but, while I agree with most everything else, violent video games have absolutely *nothing* to do with it.
Yeah, they're an easy scapegoat because, well, there's violence in them. But in truth, there is a correlation, if not a causation, that corresponds with lower crime rates when computer games are played since they also teach people cooperation, team playing, and allows the mentally and physically disabled to interact with other people while actually doing something -- and not just chatting in a "room" somewhere.
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