Did Jesus Leave Any Writings That He Wrote Himself? (believer, religion, testimony)
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Moses never wrote anything himself because Moses was not real. A real person in his power would have probably been literate, or at least had the foresight to ask a scribe to write for him.
Likewise with Jesus. If (Assuming he were real) He thought his teachings to be so important, and he himself were illiterate, why didn't he ask anyone... someone ... anyone... to write anything down?
Has anyone come up with a plausible reason for this? For the record I don't believe for a second that Jesus was illiterate, which makes the lack of writings even more confounding.
If I was the messiah I would do all the talking for myself with no speech writers or editors. Anything else would be a compromise.
, Jesus of Nazareth was an observant Jew and a rabbi (thus, making him a Pharisee, as well).
Just because they called him "rabbi" doesn't mean he was.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LargeKingCat
Moses never wrote anything himself because Moses was not real.
I have to laugh when people say there’s no evidence of Moses. Um, no kidding. Moses is not a name. And now for the hard of hearing, MOSES IS NOT A NAME.
Moses is part of a name and rendered in Egyptian as Ms-s. It means “from emanated.”
Ptahmoses = emanated from Ptah (aka Enki)
Tutmosis/Thutmose = emanated from Thoth (aka Ningishiddza)
Ramoses/Rameses = emanated from Ra (aka Marduk)
Ahmeses/Ahmoses/Ahmosis is another one. So, the reason you can’t find evidence of Moses is because Moses is not a name, it’s part of a name.
What was Moses’ real name?
It’s obvious the prefix was the name of a god, whom later Hebrews found offensive and struck it from texts. Which god? Ptahmoses is a good choice, the god of water, from whence Moses allegedly was found (and that story mirrors an earlier written story from another culture – putting an infant in a basket and floating it down a river to be found by another).
I have no idea what Moses’ real name might have been, but it would certainly be interesting to find out. Some have suggested Mermose, an Egyptian general from roughly the same time frame (circa 1450) but I find that unlikely.
As far as Moses writing the Pentateuch, it is possible, but very unlikely that he wrote the idiotic and tedious laws that appear scattered throughout the Exodus Trilogy (Exodus, Leviticus and Numbers), but there's no way he wrote anything else. For one thing at least part of Genesis existed as a written text long before the birth of Moses so that rules that out.
The Bible itself checked against history, dear lady. You could work it out for yourself if you troubled to look. I have explained it previously times without number. I sometimes feel that I am talking to a load of graven images who can neither hear nor see.
Actually, "logic" and "evidence" can only be supported by the one who agrees with the logic or evidence. One persons logic is no worse or better than anothers. It's in the experience itself where we grow in logic and within our own selves where evidence resides when it comes to our spiritual nature. By agreeing to disagree, we fall in line with what Jesus taught. To turn the other cheek, to love one another, to figive and have compassion. No where in His teachings does He say evidence or logic are necessary. When you grow spirtually, you come closer to Truth and the evidence can only be supported by the self.
There are no winners in the Kingdom of God. There are only children of God's doing the best they can and loving each other. Winning an argument in no way gets you through those pearly gates in the end.
I cannot agree. There is only sound logic and unsound logic. Just as there is only one way to use mathematics. Correctly or not.
By agreeing to disagree we play into the hands of those who use poor logic, pseudo science, fake historical claims and whatever anecdotes they can produce out of their own heads in order to support their own beliefs.
I have heard the argument before that 'God's logic' is better than man's logic. and 2+2 = 5 - if God says so.
"No where in His teachings does He say evidence or logic are necessary."
Nevertheles you ignore that the gospels are full from one end to the other through Acts and into Paul with arguments, propositions and evidences and all poor logic, false claims and fudged evidences.
If you want to grow spiritually, you won't do it by winning arguments for God or even by floating about in a serene expecation of getting to the pearly gates (while sweetly excluding all those who do not subscribe to your views, devil of a doubt) but by using all the mental tools we have and using them correctly.
Or, if you can't do that, at least by listening to those who can.
In addition to being a carpenter (thereby, would've been able to read construction plans, including measurements), Jesus of Nazareth was an observant Jew and a rabbi (thus, making him a Pharisee, as well) who would've been able to read and write both Hebrew and Aramaic (using the Hebrew alphabet) in order to participate in the three daily (evening, morning and afternoon) worship services, let alone the weekly Shabbat (Sabbath) service.
I agree. I gather that 'Carpenter' could cover anything from a chair - maker to a property developer. In fact I would not be surprised if Jesus hadn't been a Jew well educated in the law and able to read and write Aramaic, greek, hebrew and probably a bit of latin, too.
That he left nothing in writing suggests to me that his mission was in deeds, not words.
The Bible itself checked against history, dear lady. You could work it out for yourself if you troubled to look. I have explained it previously times without number. I sometimes feel that I am talking to a load of graven images who can neither hear nor see.
I didn't realize you are a believer in the Bible. For some reason, I was under the impression you're a non-believer. Would you please clarify this? Thank you, dear sir.
I didn't realize you are a believer in the Bible. For some reason, I was under the impression you're a non-believer. Would you please clarify this? Thank you, dear sir.
Easy. In a court of law one listens to a witness' statement. If the statement does not stack up it is dismissed as being unbelievable. That does not make the Judge a believer in the witness.
The nativity story is wrong. First the massacre of innocents - specifically endorsed by that odd website - is recorded only by Matthew - none of the others. Further, though Herod's misdeeds are pretty well documented, an atrocity of that kind has no mention. By all reason we have to discount it and the only reason it is is there is Matthew taking his story cue - from the OT.
Mark does not mention the nativity at all and John fails to mention that Jesus was born in Bethlehem even when there is a challenge about Jesus being a galilean.
The nativities of Luke and Matthew are irreconcilable. Matthew has Jesus' family as Judeans and they only go to Galilee in order to escape Herod's son after Herod's death. The take of the star and wise men is nonsense of course. Even if they had seen a remarkable star, they would never get 'messiah' from it and, if they followed a moving star ..what, they left it parked outside in the star -park while asking Herod where to go? Absurd!
So is Herod summoning the Sanhedrin when he should of course have thought of his own family or generals as the origin of a 'king' rather than immediately thinking 'scripture'.
Then Luke, after the deposing of Herod's son and the Roman takeover has Jesus' family - living in Galilee - going to register for the tax which didn't even apply to Galilee. You can see that Jesus couldn't be born in the time of Herod and then after his death when the Romans took over.
Thus any message that the story is substantially true is not credible. Do yourself a favour and know that such claims have got to be hogwash.
I cannot agree. There is only sound logic and unsound logic. Just as there is only one way to use mathematics. Correctly or not.
By agreeing to disagree we play into the hands of those who use poor logic, pseudo science, fake historical claims and whatever anecdotes they can produce out of their own heads in order to support their own beliefs.
I have heard the argument before that 'God's logic' is better than man's logic. and 2+2 = 5 - if God says so.
"No where in His teachings does He say evidence or logic are necessary."
Nevertheles you ignore that the gospels are full from one end to the other through Acts and into Paul with arguments, propositions and evidences and all poor logic, false claims and fudged evidences.
If you want to grow spiritually, you won't do it by winning arguments for God or even by floating about in a serene expecation of getting to the pearly gates (while sweetly excluding all those who do not subscribe to your views, devil of a doubt) but by using all the mental tools we have and using them correctly.
Or, if you can't do that, at least by listening to those who can.
I really hate to burst your bubble but having a high mentality DOES NOT get you into heaven. Even those you claim that use poor logic can get into heaven. The way to heaven is through the soul, not the mind. "God's truths are plain and can be understood by the simple minded. Any religion or set of beliefs that require mental facilities, cannot be true because God designed that all His children shall understand His truths without the necessity of having a higly developed mind".
I don't read the bible so it's irrelevant to me. And, using my logic, what if we got it wrong. What if the words we use are not really the correct ones in a spiritual sense. Wouldn't that make us all wrong. We don't know all of the truths and we shouldn't pretent that one logic is better than another.
From what I know of things spiritual, we are backwards. We do things backwards and it's gonna take something big to turn it all in the right direction. Using my logic, it starts with ourselves. Agreeing to disagree means to turn the other cheek. Let each [erson think the way they want, live the way they want and think something is true if they want. The Master taught that. He didn't come here to change our ways, He came here to show us something better so that we could incorporate that into whatever we already knew. Instead, we murdered him and threw His teachings out the window and yet we still make the claim that we follow what He taught. If so, we would know peace. We would know heaven on earth right now.
Reason and logic are not necessities. They are what we have come to expect through being taught. Love is the only thing necessary to build ourselves spiritually and to become perfect. It doesn't take religion. It takes love and, as you know, love is not logical. It just IS.
I really hate to burst your bubble but having a high mentality DOES NOT get you into heaven. Even those you claim that use poor logic can get into heaven. The way to heaven is through the soul, not the mind. "God's truths are plain and can be understood by the simple minded. Any religion or set of beliefs that require mental facilities, cannot be true because God designed that all His children shall understand His truths without the necessity of having a higly developed mind".
I don't read the bible so it's irrelevant to me. And, using my logic, what if we got it wrong. What if the words we use are not really the correct ones in a spiritual sense. Wouldn't that make us all wrong. We don't know all of the truths and we shouldn't pretent that one logic is better than another.
From what I know of things spiritual, we are backwards. We do things backwards and it's gonna take something big to turn it all in the right direction. Using my logic, it starts with ourselves. Agreeing to disagree means to turn the other cheek. Let each [erson think the way they want, live the way they want and think something is true if they want. The Master taught that. He didn't come here to change our ways, He came here to show us something better so that we could incorporate that into whatever we already knew. Instead, we murdered him and threw His teachings out the window and yet we still make the claim that we follow what He taught. If so, we would know peace. We would know heaven on earth right now.
Reason and logic are not necessities. They are what we have come to expect through being taught. Love is the only thing necessary to build ourselves spiritually and to become perfect. It doesn't take religion. It takes love and, as you know, love is not logical. It just IS.
I can't say I'm sorry to burst your bubble as it really needs bursting. Getting at the truth does not require a high mentality. It requires using the available mental tools correctly, wihich will yield pretty sounds results even with a rather mediocre intellect such as my own.
Everything that you write after that is preaching. Preaching what you do not and cannot know as if you had some hotline to God. If you refuse to use the tools to find the truth about what records are left us or the sources on which you rely, what credibility can you possibly claim for all the suppositions and guesswork about what he did or we did or what he wants or what we are supposed to do - all without a shred of evidence but Faith.
That's some bubble.
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