Am I alone in hating Montgomery County? (Silver Spring, Bethesda: mobile home, college)

[DCarea]

I don’t know how MoCo’s income distribution has changed over the decades, but compared to NoVa counties with comparable population size like Fairfax, MoCo’s current median household income is lower: $127.9K for Fairfax vs $111.8K for MoCo. MoCo has a sizable segment with HH incomes below $90K, where places like Wheaton and Silver Spring are at $88K each, whereas Fairfax lower range are still mostly above $100K.

Comparison between MoCo and Fairfax below:

MoCo median HH income: $111.8K

$235.5K Travilah
$192.3K Chevy Chase
$189.7K Potomac
$172.9K Bethesda
$111.8K Rockville
$111.7K North Bethesda
$98.8K Germantown
$91.8K Gaithersburg
$88.3K Silver Spring
$88.2K Wheaton

Fairfax median HH income: $127.9K

$238.9K Great Falls
$222.6K Mclean
$168.3K Vienna
$149.8K Burke
$131.1K Chantilly
$121.6K Reston
$121.3K Centreville
$111.7 West Falls Church
$101.1K Annandale
$103.4 Springfield

[Veritas Vincit]

Originally Posted by bufflove

MoCo has never been homogenous. The "dodgy apartments" and "run down strip malls" are from the 50s and 60s - it's not like the more modest post-war neighborhoods were built yesterday. They've been working class areas for 70 years. The only difference is that working class has gone from predominantly white to predominantly hispanic and some people view the latter as less-than.

It's a little more complicated than that. Dodgy apartments often are dodgy because they haven't been renovated in a while and lack amenities that people now expect but would not have been standard 40-50 years ago. That depresses rent, that changes the makeup of the tenant pool.



Run down strip malls are just that, run down. In retail, old always sucks vs new unless there's considerable and consistent investment in upkeep (which your typical strip mall management isn't going to do). But when those strip malls were new or 10-15 years old they probably were perfectly fine for affluent shoppers (of course the way affluent people approach shopping in general has also massively changed since the 1970s).

[ion475]

Originally Posted by Veritas Vincit

It's a little more complicated than that. Dodgy apartments often are dodgy because they haven't been renovated in a while and lack amenities that people now expect but would not have been standard 40-50 years ago. That depresses rent, that changes the makeup of the tenant pool.



Run down strip malls are just that, run down. In retail, old always sucks vs new unless there's considerable and consistent investment in upkeep (which your typical strip mall management isn't going to do). But when those strip malls were new or 10-15 years old they probably were perfectly fine for affluent shoppers (of course the way affluent people approach shopping in general has also massively changed since the 1970s).

For the "run down strip malls" it highly depends on the demographics nearby anyway. A strip mall in Wheaton vs. one even in Rockville (i.e. around Twinbrook Station) can be built around the same time, yet the latter probably feels less run down as businesses actually make sure things are being upkeep - between parking lot pavement to store facade...

The apartment part is 100% accurate, though - older apartments that lack amenities are magnets for lower income people. MoCo is not alone in that "moving poor into older suburban area". Those suburban apartments with lower income people still tend to be better than one in neglected "inner city", though.

Originally Posted by DCarea

I don’t know how MoCo’s income distribution has changed over the decades, but compared to NoVa counties with comparable population size like Fairfax, MoCo’s current median household income is lower: $127.9K for Fairfax vs $111.8K for MoCo. MoCo has a sizable segment with HH incomes below $90K, where places like Wheaton and Silver Spring are at $88K each, whereas Fairfax lower range are still mostly above $100K.

Comparison between MoCo and Fairfax below:

MoCo median HH income: $111.8K

$235.5K Travilah
$192.3K Chevy Chase
$189.7K Potomac
$172.9K Bethesda
$111.8K Rockville
$111.7K North Bethesda
$98.8K Germantown
$91.8K Gaithersburg
$88.3K Silver Spring
$88.2K Wheaton

Fairfax median HH income: $127.9K

$238.9K Great Falls
$222.6K Mclean
$168.3K Vienna
$149.8K Burke
$131.1K Chantilly
$121.6K Reston
$121.3K Centreville
$111.7 West Falls Church
$101.1K Annandale
$103.4 Springfield

If anything this would be my main gripe with MoCo - either you're really wealthy or you're stuck in areas that are just not that nice. MoCo badly lack areas similar to Centreville/Chantilly - i.e. ~$130k HHI. You've Rockville, you've South Rockville (I mean North Bethesda), but that's just a small area compare to Burke/Chantilly/Centreville/Reston. Not everyone can afford Potomac/Chevy Chase similar to how most people in FFX can't exactly afford McLean/Great Falls.

[Turnerbro]

Originally Posted by ion475

For the "run down strip malls" it highly depends on the demographics nearby anyway. A strip mall in Wheaton vs. one even in Rockville (i.e. around Twinbrook Station) can be built around the same time, yet the latter probably feels less run down as businesses actually make sure things are being upkeep - between parking lot pavement to store facade...

The apartment part is 100% accurate, though - older apartments that lack amenities are magnets for lower income people. MoCo is not alone in that "moving poor into older suburban area". Those suburban apartments with lower income people still tend to be better than one in neglected "inner city", though.



If anything this would be my main gripe with MoCo - either you're really wealthy or you're stuck in areas that are just not that nice. MoCo badly lack areas similar to Centreville/Chantilly - i.e. ~$130k HHI. You've Rockville, you've South Rockville (I mean North Bethesda), but that's just a small area compare to Burke/Chantilly/Centreville/Reston. Not everyone can afford Potomac/Chevy Chase similar to how most people in FFX can't exactly afford McLean/Great Falls.

I'd argue Olney, Rockville and West Gaithersburg are MOCO's equivalent of that.

[DCarea]

Like NoVa, I’m only a fan of certain parts of MoCo. Overall, it doesn’t have the same appeal as beautiful historic neighborhoods like Old Town Alexandria, or the many lovely neighborhoods in DC like Georgetown, DuPont Circle, Logans Circle, Capitol Hill, etc. MoCo lacks this.

That said, places like downtown Bethesda is super modern, walkable, and pleasant. It’s a short Metro ride into DC for my DC fix. Silver Spring isn’t my cup of tea, it feels dilapidated in comparison, and the Metro ride into DC from that end just isn’t as pleasant.

[ion475]

Originally Posted by Turnerbro

I'd argue Olney, Rockville and West Gaithersburg are MOCO's equivalent of that.

Totally forgot about Olney.

FFX Co overall is still more "average" compare to the bipolar nature of MoCo. Of course, it helps that the less well off suburbs in NOVA are in PWC.

Originally Posted by DCarea

Like NoVa, I’m only a fan of certain parts of MoCo. Overall, it doesn’t have the same appeal as beautiful historic neighborhoods like Old Town Alexandria, or the many lovely neighborhoods in DC like Georgetown, DuPont Circle, Logans Circle, Capitol Hill, etc. MoCo lacks this.

That said, places like downtown Bethesda is super modern, walkable, and pleasant. It’s a short Metro ride into DC for my DC fix. Silver Spring isn’t my cup of tea, it feels dilapidated in comparison, and the Metro ride into DC from that end just isn’t as pleasant.

That's bc SS is run-down mess lol. Most people live there only bc it is cheaper while still having enough amenities / being walkable while staying out of the district itself.

DT Bethesda is of course nice...it is really pricy for a reason.

[dkf747]

Originally Posted by Turnerbro

I'd argue Olney, Rockville and West Gaithersburg are MOCO's equivalent of that.

Where exactly is this West Gaithersburg? Do you mean the part of the city west of I-270? Or do you mean North Potomac (the areas of the County outside of, and west of, the city limits)? That area used to be nicer than the area east of 270. I think it still is, but just trying to understand the area you are referring to by calling it West Gaithersburg, a name I had never heard of in all the years I lived in that area.

[ion475]

Originally Posted by dkf747

Where exactly is this West Gaithersburg? Do you mean the part of the city west of I-270? Or do you mean North Potomac (the areas of the County outside of, and west of, the city limits)? That area used to be nicer than the area east of 270. I think it still is, but just trying to understand the area you are referring to by calling it West Gaithersburg, a name I had never heard of in all the years I lived in that area.

I believe the OP is referring to "Western part" of Gaithersburg...so basically the area you're describing (i.e. Kentlands / Lakelands area + Crown).

It's still nicer than the area east of 270, and definitely WAY better than that area around Lakeforest "Mall" or most of Montgomery Village.

And yeah...as much as I want to call North Potomac "West Gaithersburg" I don't think anyone does that (unlike South Rockville I mean North Bethesda )

[bufflove]

Originally Posted by ion475

That's bc SS is run-down mess lol. Most people live there only bc it is cheaper while still having enough amenities / being walkable while staying out of the district itself.

DT Bethesda is of course nice...it is really pricy for a reason.

It's safe to say people who think downtown Bethesda is great generally aren't fond of downtown Silver Spring. The opposite is also very much true. I think downtown SS is fantastic - when I lived there I'd eat a different cuisine every night, there were fun and interesting events every weekend, and it's a vibrant neighborhood at almost any hour. The AFI, Fillmore, and Black Box Theater mean SS has the quality of cultural amenities generally found only in far larger cities.

By comparison, Bethesda has the Round House, a (very) small number of quality of restaurants, and a nightlife that's worse than just about any other part of the region. Bethesda has historical advantages of a large job core and old money neighborhoods that result in good school ratings. Other than that, I don't think it compares well head-to-head with its surroundings, except for people specifically interested in a sleepy area. The Fine Arts Festival is great, though. I hit that up every year, even if I do end up having to drive to Pike & Rose or Silver Spring after for a good meal or a solid bar.

[Mr Beco]

Originally Posted by Matty1

Cons:

-housing is absurdly expensive
-traffic is horrendous
-jobs are hard to find
-stuck-up and spoiled bratty people
-cold weather 7 months out of the year



Pros:

???????????

So far, this year's winter is fabulous! I'll take 60's in February any day.....traffic is bad, and the pike has always been bad on the weekends, and when it rains. Wegmans going to be open in 2024 so traffic at Triwnbrook Metro is going to get worse......Not sure about jobs, but yeah....bratty people especially in Whole Foods....I find myself stepping out of people's way while I shop there, otherwise, if I didn't move, we would bump....Housing is really expensive but its expensive everywhere.....