When Africans Meet African-Americans

[prospectheightsresident]

Originally Posted by caribny

Recent Africans are from the nation or the ethnicity. So one can he a Yoruba American, or a Ghanaian American. "Africa" is a loose concept that those from that continent only embrace when they leave that continent. So much so that there are arguments about whether Moroccans are "African" or not. There are Moroccans who would say "no", even as Morocco is in Africa. There are Nigerians who would say "hell no, because of attitudes towards black Africans that many Moroccans embrace.

NONE of these people who have direct connections to Africa call themselves "African American". These are just people being used against black Americans who use the term "African American" in the same way as do others use Irish America, Italian American, etc. Except of course they have no idea of their specific African point of origin, and in any case most black Americans represent various blends of everything from Senegal down to Angola.

That's the point behind the generic "African-American." Folks don't know where exactly in Africa their ancestors came from.

I will say that any negative attitudes I've experienced from Africans against, say, black Americans, has largely been from the older generation. And even then it's been a minority. The younger generation seems to be much more connected with black Americans. For context, my experiences have been within higher education mostly, where I knew quite a few African international students and even more first and second generation U.S. citizen descendants of African immigrants.

As to your other points, it is interesting. Every Moroccan and other Northern African I've known has proudly identified as African. Anecdotal, yes, but we're friends with an Egyptian American couple (she was born in Egypt while he was born in Canada to Egyptian immigrants). Both call themselves African. The Moroccan family we grew up next to in Brooklyn (they were all immigrants) called themselves African as well (note, these were mixed mixed with "black" African and Arab families as well as Berbers). Perhaps because there were no other Moroccan families around in the area, but we all hung out with each other and enjoyed each other's company growing up. We still keep in touch with each other many years after, even as people have up and moved across the country.

[caribny]

Originally Posted by prospectheightsresident

That's the point behind the generic "African-American." Folks don't know where exactly in Africa their ancestors came from.

I will say that any negative attitudes I've experienced from Africans against, say, black Americans, has largely been from the older generation. And even then it's been a minority. The younger generation seems to be much more connected with black Americans. For context, my experiences have been within higher education mostly, where I knew quite a few African international students and even more first and second generation U.S. citizen descendants of African immigrants.

As to your other points, it is interesting. Every Moroccan and other Northern African I've known has proudly identified as African. Anecdotal, yes, but we're friends with an Egyptian American couple (she was born in Egypt while he was born in Canada to Egyptian immigrants). Both call themselves African. The Moroccan family we grew up next to in Brooklyn (they were all immigrants) called themselves African as well (note, these were mixed mixed with "black" African and Arab families as well as Berbers). Perhaps because there were no other Moroccan families around in the area, but we all hung out with each other and enjoyed each other's company growing up. We still keep in touch with each other many years after, even as people have up and moved across the country.

My introduction to black Americans was through doing an MBA at an Ivy League school. Many of the black Americans were in fact intrigued by foreign black students.

However in the outside world in the 1970/80s tensions were so strong that Black American and black Caribbean congregants sometimes couldnt sit together in church. And more working class Africans claimed that they suffered more bigotry and ignorance from black than they did from white Americans. At time the descendants of enslaved peoples still found Africa to be embarrassing. This was the time of famine and the infamous flies living on children's faces. That being the images of Africa.

So yes education has much to do with it. Also generational. Immigrants live within their own communities, so have less to do with black Americans. The kids are integrated into American life through black Americans, whether they wish to or not. So both younger black Americans and black immigrants have more nuanced views of each other than do their parents.

The North African vs the rest of Africa is as heated as a debate between Dominicans and Haitians. And this was revealed in the last World Cup when the excellent performance was described by one of the Moroccan players as a "victory for the Arab world". Even though Morocco plays as an African nation and the Gulf States play with the Asians. The heat seems to exist as much WITHIN the Moroccan communities as it does say between Moroccans and West Africans. Of the North African states I also suspect that Morocco has the most contact with black Africa, maybe even more than Egypt. This will mean a broader range of ideas on the subject. Many black Africans see North Africans as black hating racists and the recent ranting of the Tunisian president, as well as killings in Morocco enhances that view.