Hinsdale Vs. Glencoe (Chicago, Waukegan, Wheaton: low income, 2013, elementary school)

[twodoor2]

Originally Posted by holl1ngsworth

I feel terrible for anyone moving from out-of-state that bought into Rolling Meadows district based on these ratings, only to be confronted by the grim reality later.

The school has averaged 63% meet/exceed on the PSAE over the past five years, has a typical average ACT score of 22, and has made frequent headlines for gang-related violence. That gets you 19th best in Illinois?? Janky.

Don't pay attention to US News rankings.

Good Point! They gave Elgin High a bronze medal not too long ago. Makes you wonder?

[wjj]

Originally Posted by Lookout Kid

This hardly matters to this Glencoe vs. Hinsdale conversation if Hinsdale Central is ranked better than New Trier, does it? But it's hard to argue with the fact that the North Shore and Northern Suburbs have most of the best public schools in the suburbs according to the U.S. News rankings.

For the top ten public suburban schools I get one in the west, SEVEN to the north, and two in the northwest.... More than 2/3 of the top ten schools are in the northern suburbs:

1. Stevenson (NORTHWEST)
2. Deerfield High School (NORTH)
3. Highland Park High School (NORTH)
4. Prospect High School (NORTHWEST)
5. Hinsdale Central High School (WEST)
6. Libertyville High School (NORTHWEST)
7. John Hersey High School (NORTHWEST)
8. Evanston Township High School (NORTH)
9. Buffalo Grove High School (NORTHWEST)
10. Vernon Hills High School (NORTHWEST)

Then the next ten have three in the west, four in the north, and three in the northwest:

11. Glenbard West High School (WEST)
12. New Trier High School (NORTH)
13. Glenbrook North (NORTH)
14. Glenbrook South (NORTH)
15. Main South (NORTHWEST)
16. Lake Forest (NORTH)
17. Neuqua Valley (WEST)
18. Metea Valley (WEST)
19. Rolling Meadows (NORTHWEST)
20. William Fremd (NORTHWEST)

Then the western suburbs come in in force in the next several slots. Where do the south suburbs make their debut on this list? Lincolnway East in Frankfort comes in later... Still a "Silver Medal" tier school, which is really good nationally.

I think your labels of north and northwest are off. From someone who has lived in this area for over 35 years, Buffalo Grove, Lincolnshire (Stevenson), Libertyville, and Vernon Hills are most definitely considered to be Northwest suburbs. All are further west that Maine South and Prospect and Hersey and are several miles west of I 294/94. Evanston, and Highland Park would be considered North. Deerfield, you would get a mixed response, since it straddles I 294, but since it is mostly east of there, probably tilts north. Same for Northbrook.

I think there are more top schools in the Northwest suburbs (9) than any other area (though I question how Rolling Meadows gets in there, especially ahead of Fremd which is widely recognized as one of the best schools in the area). But I do agree, it is a big area and that plays a part.

South suburbs really do lag.

I think the OP would be happier in Northbrook, Lincolnshire, Riverwoods, or Deerfield given all the discussion here. I'm not sure that Glencoe or Hinsdale are a good fit.

[My Kind Of Town]

Originally Posted by wjj

I think your labels of north and northwest are off. From someone who has lived in this area for over 35 years, Buffalo Grove, Lincolnshire (Stevenson), Libertyville, and Vernon Hills are most definitely considered to be Northwest suburbs. All are further west that Maine South and Prospect and Hersey and are several miles west of I 294/94. Evanston, and Highland Park would be considered North. Deerfield, you would get a mixed response, since it straddles I 294, but since it is mostly east of there, probably tilts north. Same for Northbrook.

I think there are more top schools in the Northwest suburbs (9) than any other area (though I question how Rolling Meadows gets in there, especially ahead of Fremd which is widely recognized as one of the best schools in the area). But I do agree, it is a big area and that plays a part.

South suburbs really do lag.

I think the OP would be happier in Northbrook, Lincolnshire, Riverwoods, or Deerfield given all the discussion here. I'm not sure that Glencoe or Hinsdale are a good fit.

EDIT: Thought I was replying to a different thread, my fault. For this OP, it really depends on budget and if location matters for employment.

[twodoor2]

One subject extremely important is mathematics and at the Illinois Interactive Report card site, Hinsdale South outperforms Glenbrook North in mathematics, although both are above the 80th percentile range. Fremd, which was mentioned above, is in the 80th percentile ranges as well. I would look to that site to make proper school comparisons, rather than subjective articles.

[My Kind Of Town]

Prospect High is a very good school but their numbers are not nearly as impressive when accounting for the percentage of low-income students. It carries a super low percentage of 2% low-income students. By comparison, Hinsdale Central is at 6% and New Trier at 4%.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by holl1ngsworth

I feel terrible for anyone moving from out-of-state that bought into Rolling Meadows district based on these ratings, only to be confronted by the grim reality later.

The school has averaged 63% meet/exceed on the PSAE over the past five years, has a typical average ACT score of just 22, and has made frequent headlines for gang-related violence. That gets you 19th best in Illinois?? Janky.

It's just one example of MANY that show how criminally bad US News rankings are... pay no attention.

Rolling Meadows High School is clearly on an upswing after taking a back seat to Prospect and Hersey for many years. 58% take AP tests, and 44% pass the them. These are based on NATIONAL curriculum and tests, so they are a good comparison between districts from various states. This combined with a low student/teacher ratio put them ahead of many other schools in more expensive suburbs. 71% "meets or exceeds" on the stupid PSAE test is not bad (latest reported and climbing each year), and higher than Wheaton Warrenville South and Glenbard West. By almost any measure of data and testing, this is a good school.

[holl1ngsworth]

Originally Posted by Lookout Kid

Rolling Meadows High School is clearly on an upswing after taking a back seat to Prospect and Hersey for many years. 58% take AP tests, and 44% pass the them. These are based on NATIONAL curriculum and tests, so they are a good comparison between districts from various states. This combined with a low student/teacher ratio put them ahead of many other schools in more expensive suburbs. 71% "meets or exceeds" on the stupid PSAE test is not bad (latest reported and climbing each year), and higher than Wheaton Warrenville South and Glenbard West. By almost any measure of data and testing, this is a good school.

Thanks for bringing up Wheaton Warrenville South versus Rolling Meadows, because I think it puts on full display why the US News rankings are complete and utter bologna. Rolling Meadows' terrible local rep has already been discussed, and I would add that Wheaton Warrenville has an outstanding local rep and routinely sends students to Ivy and other top-rated universities.

Let's look at the numbers, pulled directly from the US News' 2015 rankings:

Rolling Meadows: #30 IL, #661 US
67% PSAE meet/exceeds
44% of students passed an AP Exam
3.3 average exams per test taker
22.3 average ACT score

Wheaton Warrenville South: Unranked
71% PSAE meet/exceeds
45% of students passed an AP Exam
4.2 average exams per test taker
23.9 average ACT score

There is NO WAY to explain these rankings. Wheaton South rates better by EVERY MEASURE and they are still not only ranked below Rolling Meadows, but also a host of other schools that are FAR worse. US News rankings are absurd to Nth degree. As it relates to the OP, both Hinsdale and New Trier should be ranked higher than they are.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by holl1ngsworth

Thanks for bringing up Wheaton Warrenville South versus Rolling Meadows, because I think it puts on full display why the US News rankings are complete and utter bologna. Rolling Meadows' terrible local rep has already been discussed, and I would add that Wheaton Warrenville has an outstanding local rep and routinely sends students to Ivy and other top-rated universities.

Let's look at the numbers, pulled directly from the US News' 2015 rankings:

Rolling Meadows: #30 IL, #661 US
67% PSAE meet/exceeds
44% of students passed an AP Exam
3.3 average exams per test taker
22.3 average ACT score

Wheaton Warrenville South: Unranked
71% PSAE meet/exceeds
45% of students passed an AP Exam
4.2 average exams per test taker
23.9 average ACT score

There is NO WAY to explain these rankings. Wheaton South rates better by EVERY MEASURE and they are still not only ranked below Rolling Meadows, but also a host of other schools that are FAR worse. US News rankings are absurd to Nth degree. As it relates to the OP, both Hinsdale and New Trier should be ranked higher than they are.

It is all very explainable, and "local reputation" is garbage--particularly in the notoriously snooty northern suburbs. But the "unranked" schools like WWS should be ranked. They are only unranked because they place a series of hurdles to EVEN BE CONSIDERED, so WWS missed one of those hurdles this year. It's not unranked because it didn't score well, they didn't even include it for consideration.

By the way, looking at the latest school report cards, Rolling Meadows is now 71% and WWS has dropped below 70. I believe WWS to be a good school, but I also want to point out that Rolling Meadows is improving.

[holl1ngsworth]

Originally Posted by Lookout Kid

It is all very explainable, and "local reputation" is garbage--particularly in the notoriously snooty northern suburbs. But the "unranked" schools like WWS should be ranked. They are only unranked because they place a series of hurdles to EVEN BE CONSIDERED, so WWS missed one of those hurdles this year. It's not unranked because it didn't score well, they didn't even include it for consideration.

By the way, looking at the latest school report cards, Rolling Meadows is now 71% and WWS has dropped below 70. I believe WWS to be a good school, but I also want to point out that Rolling Meadows is improving.

My point exactly. The hurdles make the methodology garbage. I could build a better algorithm in my sleep.

More students passed the PSAE, a greater percentage of students passed at least one AP exam -- while taking almost one whole exam more, and students scored more than a point and a half higher on the ACT. There is no way to justify the descrepency.

[Lookout Kid]

Originally Posted by holl1ngsworth

My point exactly. The hurdles make the methodology garbage. I could build a better algorithm in my sleep.

More students passed the PSAE, a greater percentage of students passed at least one AP exam -- while taking almost one whole exam more, and students scored more than a point and a half higher on the ACT. There is no way to justify the descrepency.

Looking at the data, Wheaton Warrneville South didn't pass "Step 2", which means that "economically disadvantaged" students do worse at WWS than the the state average.

Here is the description for "Step 2":

Step 2: For schools passing this first step, the second step assessed whether their disadvantaged students – black, Hispanic and low-income – were outperforming disadvantaged students in the state.

We compared each school's math and reading proficiency rates for disadvantaged students with the statewide results for these student groups and then selected schools that were performing better than their state averages.

They missed this by less than half of a percentage point. Economically disadvantaged students at WWS perform 0.4% below the state average, so the school got booted from the rankings. They will probably be back in the rankings next year if they make even the smallest amount of progress.