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So trusting Jesus as the Saviour of all mankind is an error. Indeed, that is interesting.
That was not the point of my post, now was it ???
The point of my post was that as twin said, "They are always attempting to trap Jesus in his word when they disagree with it by always endless barrage of questions." ... by which I agreed with twin and his post.....
And pointed out that some who hold to universalism have accuse the Christian...... just like the Pharisees did by when they barraged Jesus with all those questions trying to trap him and while doing this also said Christ had a demon..... by which is no different that some universalist have and are doing just as the Pharisees of that day in saying that the Christian who believes Christ and the power of His Holy Spirit in their lives and calling that power the antichrist..... just as the Pharisees accused Christ having a demon !!
..... "Many, I tell you, will try to enter and will not be able to"
Yes, the teaching of universalism is in error of the Holy Scripture !! I will not deny that.....
It is your choice in what you want to believe and that is between you and God !!
Last edited by Cyber Munchkin; 03-10-2011 at 12:09 PM..
The point of my post was that as twin said, "They are always attempting to trap Jesus in his word when they disagree with it by always endless barrage of questions." ... by which I agreed with twin and his post.....
And pointed out that some who hold to universalism have accuse the Christian...... just like the Pharisees did by when they barraged Jesus with all those questions trying to trap him and while doing this also said Christ had a demon..... by which is no different that some universalist have and are doing just as the Pharisees of that day in saying that the Christian who believes Christ and the power of His Holy Spirit in their lives and calling that power the antichrist..... just as the Pharisees accused Christ having a demon !!
Yes, the teaching of universalism is in error of the Holy Scripture !! I will not deny that.....
It is your choice in what you want to believe and that is between you and God !!
I think we all can share the burden of making accusations to someone at some point no matter which label we attach to ourselves or place on others.
If I can trust that through Jesus all mankind will be saved because Jesus is the Saviour of the world, then what is in error about that?
If your point is not about the error of believing in Christ, then what of my belief in Jesus in these matters?
I think we all can share the burden of making accusations to someone at some point no matter which label we attach to ourselves or place on others.
If I can trust that through Jesus all mankind will be saved because Jesus is the Saviour of the world, then what is in error about that?
If your point is not about the error of believing in Christ, then what of my belief in Jesus in these matters?
You are incorrect...... not everyone shares the burden of such accusations..... especially those who accuse the Christian that the work of the Holy Spirit is a demon or serve the antichrist.
.....You know the answer to your second question, I will not hash is out once again of the false teaching of universalism.... yet, you can choose to believe whatever you want that is between you and God !!
Your third question.... like I said, you believe whatever you choose that is between you and God.
I was agreeing with Twin in his post, my post was not directed at "Phazelwood" and what he believed......
........the point in my post that I posted was....
"The point of my post was that as twin said, "They are always attempting to trap Jesus in his word when they disagree with it by always endless barrage of questions." ... by which I agreed with twin and his post.....
And pointed out that some who hold to universalism have accuse the Christian...... just like the Pharisees did by when they barraged Jesus with all those questions trying to trap him and while doing this also said Christ had a demon..... by which is no different that some universalist have and are doing just as the Pharisees of that day in saying that the Christian who believes Christ and the power of His Holy Spirit in their lives and calling that power the antichrist..... just as the Pharisees accused Christ having a demon !!"
You are incorrect...... not everyone shares the burden of such accusations..... especially those who accuse the Christian that they have a demon or serve the antichrist.
.....You know the answer to your second question, I will not hash is out once again of the false teaching of universalism.... yet, you can choose to believe whatever you want that is between you and God !!
Your third question.... like I said, you believe whatever you choose that is between you and God.
I was agreeing with Twin in his post, my post was not directed at "Phazelwood" and what he believed......
........the point in my post that I posted was....
"The point of my post was that as twin said, "They are always attempting to trap Jesus in his word when they disagree with it by always endless barrage of questions." ... by which I agreed with twin and his post.....
And pointed out that some who hold to universalism have accuse the Christian...... just like the Pharisees did by when they barraged Jesus with all those questions trying to trap him and while doing this also said Christ had a demon..... by which is no different that some universalist have and are doing just as the Pharisees of that day in saying that the Christian who believes Christ and the power of His Holy Spirit in their lives and calling that power the antichrist..... just as the Pharisees accused Christ having a demon !!"
The idea presented here is a false representation of what is going on.
Someone reacting to being questioned by saying "quit trying to trap Jesus" is simply making a false attempt to equate everything they say as 100% truth and therefore it cannot be questioned.
Agreement with such a statement is simply trying to align ones self and believing that what you believe is also without question true and absolute.
Even if you do not realize that and have only been taught an argumentative technic, that is all it amounts to.
The idea presented here is a false representation of what is going on.
Someone reacting to being questioned by saying "quit trying to trap Jesus" is simply making a false attempt to equate everything they say as 100% truth and therefore it cannot be questioned.
Agreement with such a statement is simply trying to align ones self and believing that what you believe is also without question true and absolute.
Even if you do not realize that and have only been taught an argumentative technic, that is all it amounts to.
You have the freedom, yes, freedom in choosing to believe whatever you want Phazelwood it is between you and God.....
Cyber Munchkin the Pharisees barraged Jesus continually with the law at the same time trying to trap him by it. Whether it was healing on the sabbath, not condemning the adulterer, they questioned the fact he had the authority to forgive,that he dined with sinners,that he wouldn't stand with them in their haughty hearts of condemnation towards sinners that in their eyes fell short in the law, Jesus said "He desired mercy not sacrifice(Mercy..something the Fundy believes Jesus has in short measure).
Now having been a poster on this forum for a few years one thing i know for sure is that those who believe in UR have never questioned Jesus in such things, in fact they have lauded him up as the Law fullfilled, because love is the fulfillment of the law and God is love.
On the other hand i have seen those who not only reject universalism but reject them as heretics to oppose anything that would suggest God IS loving and mercy to the worst of us, regardless of whether they are a believer or not.There are those who reject UR i have a lot of time and respect for,because they do not treat you like a leper for believing in UR
But love ye your enemies, and do good, and lend, hoping for nothing again; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be the children of the Highest: for he is kind unto the unthankful and to the evil.Be ye therefore merciful, as your Father also is merciful.
Do you see the significance of what i have underlined, God wants us to BE what HE IS. Not what he may or may not be, or could be or could not be but what HE IS.
We bear the same nature of our Father, by believing HE IS LOVE .
Back to the topic then. Who are they? Who are the people left outside to bang on the door? What is your opinion? If everyone were automatically saved, then there wouldn't be anyone left outside. Wouldn't you agree?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber
I guess I must have missed it. Don't be too subtle, because God gave me only so much processing power. Fair? Maybe not, but it was what God gave me, so I'll take it.
Fair. On the first quote above you asked "If everyone were automatically save,..." I do not know why you wrote that because I never said such thing. Therefore I cannot answer the questions that follow.
All I am saying is that I do not agree with God's logic as portrayed by Bible believers that if you do not believe in Jesus your works do not matter and the example of killing women and children on taking a piece of land.
With this in mind I tend to believe there must be some error somwhere that people come up with this type of logic God has assuming the Bible is the word of God, take care.
Fair. On the first quote above you asked "If everyone were automatically save,..." I do not know why you wrote that because I never said such thing. Therefore I cannot answer the questions that follow.
It wasn't really a question, it simply pointed out that the Bible teaches that some people will be inside, and some will be outside.
Quote:
All I am saying is that I do not agree with God's logic as portrayed by Bible believers that if you do not believe in Jesus your works do not matter
It is not just portrayed by Bible believers, the Bible spells it out:
Hebrews 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please him, for whoever would draw near to God must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who seek him.
Ephesians 2:8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast
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