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Because you would not answer the questions I asked, I was asking some others (other questions)
Your questions have been answered multiple times by multiple posters and links to studies have been attached, yet you keep coming back to claim no one has answered them. At the same time you have brough nothing to the table except baseless critisizim.
Quote:
You make the point several times of the need for repentance in your statement. Then you conclude that even if the believer dies in this unrepentant state, only his works will burn. So, what is the need for repentance, or works, beyond your first dedication when you were saved? In your stated opinion their salvation is assured.
You have digressed into a tangential discussion of faith vs. works which is a great debate for the theologians but has no application in a discussion of Hebrews 6:1-8.
If you tried, you would understand, but time after time you demonstrate you have no interest in seeing anyone else's view point. If you read my post with intent to understand, you would know what I said about the concequence of non-repentance, and you would also have your answer to your "what is the need for repentance" question.
Last edited by Finn_Jarber; 11-29-2011 at 05:34 PM..
If you tried, you would understand, but time after time you demonstrate you have no interest in seeing anyone else's view point. If you read my point again with intent to understand you would learn that the concequence of non-repentance it, and that automatically answers your qustions "what is the need for repentance".
Finn, I am trying to understand your 1 Cor 3:13 interpretations. I do not understand your point because i do not see it in the cited scripture. You seem to be providing support to the "once saved always saved" belief. Yet suggest a need for repentance several times in your statement. You then conclude that even repentance is not needed because once saved always saved. Repentance was not even referred to in the scripture: it was specific to works. It is confusing.
You are correct Finn, I am not satisfied with a just a POV. What I am asking for is a scripturally based explanation for arriving at the specific POV. Not wild speculation.
There is one scripture in particular that explicitly refutes the "once saved always saved" belief, Hebrews 6:1-8.
Contrary to your assertions no one has provided an explanation, answered my questions, or engaged in a dialog. An interpretation was suggested, but bears no resemblance to the actual scripture. No where does the scripture refer to sacrifices or works as the subject. Other than your insistence that it does, I would think we are talking about different verses.
I am not asking for an unsubstantiated POV, I am asking for an examination and explanation of how that POV could possible come from reading Hebrews 6:1-8.
The Peril of Falling Away
1Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, 2of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment. 3And this we will do, if God permits. 4For in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6and then have fallen away, it is impossible to renew them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. 7For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; 8but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.
If "once saved, always saved" is true, what is the "Peril" that these Bible translators are talking about in their heading, and why would Paul engage in this warning at all?
Where do you see sacrifices and works being talked about as the subject in these verses?
Finn, I am trying to understand your 1 Cor 3:13 interpretations. I do not understand your point because i do not see it in the cited scripture. You seem to be providing support to the "once saved always saved" belief. Yet suggest a need for repentance several times in your statement. You then conclude that even repentance is not needed because once saved always saved. Repentance was not even referred to in the scripture: it was specific to works. It is confusing.
Again, it is impossible for you to understand, when you have decided to not understand. There is no point in repeating the same information to you.
What did I tell you about the consequence of non-repentance?
When you go back and read what I said about it, then you have the answer to your question about why repentance is necessary. It is necessary to overcome the concequence of not repenting. Get it?
Actually, I do not think it can ever happen. This proves how little you listen when others try to explain you their view.
LOL, I know your POV. Just engaging you in banter since any real scriptural discussion seems to be out of the question.
I am really not interested in a faith vs. works discussion. That is hold over from the days of justifying the reformation and an old chestnut for the theologians, like how many angels fit on the head of a pin.
Everyone knows that works without faith are meaninless, and faith without works is dead. Trying to change the "once saved, always saved" discussion iinto one about "works" is pointless. It is like the old adage "when all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail".
Hebrews 6:1-8 proves the belief of "once saved, always saved" is false. It has nothing to do with "works" and the fire that "burns up" in Hebrews 6:8 has no correlation with the flames of 1 Cor 3:13. However, I digress is to a discussion on scripture and not POV, sorry
Again, it is impossible for you to understand, when you have decided to not understand. There is no point in repeating the same information to you.
What did I tell you about the consequence of non-repentance?
When you go back and read what I said about it, then you have the answer to your question about why repentance is necessary. It is necessary to overcome the consequence of not repenting. Get it?
I hope you will not repeat the same information again, I hope you will be more articulate.
No, i do not get it. If I am saved and nothing can change that (once saved, always saved) works and repentance have no purpose to my salvation in the long haul, I am saved, I believe. So, why did you say there was a need for repentance several times?
Also, you cited 1 Cor 3:13, but I see no reference to repentance in there. This is one of those POV things again, not requiring scriptural support?
[quote=BWW1962;21911112]
No, i do not get it. If I am saved and nothing can change that (once saved, always saved) works and repentance have no purpose to my salvation in the long haul, I am saved, I believe. So, why did you say there was a need for repentance several times. [\quote]
I wrote the answer to you in plain language, but you say "I don't get it". You dont get it, because you don't want to get it.
What can i say? I tried to get you to read my post and understand it, but you refused. There are none as blind as those who refuse to see. There is nothing more I, or anyone can do to get you to understand as you have decided to not even try to understand.
No, i do not get it. If I am saved and nothing can change that (once saved, always saved) works and repentance have no purpose to my salvation in the long haul, I am saved, I believe. So, why did you say there was a need for repentance several times. [\quote]
I wrote the answer to you in plain language, but you say "I don't get it". You dont get it, because you don't want to get it.
What can i say? I tried to get you to read my post and understand it, but you refused. There are none as blind as those who refuse to see. There is nothing more I, or anyone can do to get you to understand as you have decided to not even try to understand.
Have a nice day.
I read your post many times and it is incomprehensible as an explanation of "once saved always saved". You state repentance is needed several times and then conclude saying it is not. You cite a completely unrelated scripture and then cannot answer questions. You might as well have cited Genesis 1:1 as 1 Cor 3:13 as a support for your explanation
I appreciate that you have done all you can. Thanks for the effort.
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Once saved, fallen away
