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Saying you did anything is taking credit, only Christians seem to have a problem understanding this. I chose, I believed , I found, I sought is nothing but taking credit, especially when scripture clearly states he chose, sought and found .
It doesn't have to be one over the other. It is a matter of perspective. Jesus did everything for man to be saved. Lost men look a lot of places for life, for an answer to the ache in their hearts. When one comes into the light, it is as if he has "discovered" or "found" the truth. He has been searching and then, voila, the light comes on, man sees the truth. But to be saved he then must repent and believe. Yes, man must do this. It isn't taking credit, because it is a scriptural command if you will. Not repenting and not believing will keep you from being saved. Repenting and believing will lead you into the salvation THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE.
This isn't a big deal. Believing is required. Believing that Jesus' substitionary death on the cross purchased my salvation... all glory is his. Believing opens the door to what already has been done. This isn't that difficult to comprehend.... then, of course, you choose to believe a flawed theology that you were taught, not discovered by reading scripture outside of that teaching.
It doesn't have to be one over the other. It is a matter of perspective. Jesus did everything for man to be saved. Lost men look a lot of places for life, for an answer to the ache in their hearts. When one comes into the light, it is as if he has "discovered" or "found" the truth. He has been searching and then, voila, the light comes on, man sees the truth. But to be saved he then must repent and believe. Yes, man must do this. It isn't taking credit, because it is a scriptural command if you will. Not repenting and not believing will keep you from being saved. Repenting and believing will lead you into the salvation THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN DONE.
This isn't a big deal. Believing is required. Believing that Jesus' substitionary death on the cross purchased my salvation... all glory is his. Believing opens the door to what already has been done. This isn't that difficult to comprehend.... then, of course, you choose to believe a flawed theology that you were taught, not discovered by reading scripture outside of that teaching.
But it was always light dawning upon him, it was always the goodness of seeking him out bringing him to a place where he could do nothing but say I believe and change in his life be the outcome.
It's all of God. It amazes me how Christians would even consider otherwise.
No, Mike didn't come to earth without sin and then die on a cross bearing his sin or the sin of anyone else. Only one came to do that and he deserves all the glory and credit. Believing in Christ's atoning work on the cross is not taking any credit. How can one take credit in something that transpired 2000 years ago? Mike thinking that he goes to the right church, has the right theology, can quote scripture better than anyone else... thinking that any of those things gets him an inside track with God, now that would be taking credit for his own salvation. But believing? It is what we are called to do to be saved.
I don't see why this is so difficult to comprehend. But then again I haven't been taught Calvinism FIRST and then how to twist scriptures to come up with this skewed theology. No one reads the scriptures on their own and comes up with TULIP. They are taught it by someone who already holds this viewpoint.
It shouldn't be difficult to understand, but no matter how clear you make it, some of these people simply are unable to comprehend the issue. But then, they are also confused about a number of other spiritual issues.
The Bible says that you must believe on Christ in order to have eternal life, and also says that you cannot boast (take any credit). And yet some of these people say, 'Saying you did anything is taking credit,' as a previous poster did.
Placing your faith in Christ for eternal life is the exact opposite of trusting in yourself or anything which you can do to earn eternal salvation. Christ did all the work and gets all the credit. Man simply comes to Christ for salvation through faith.
Rom. 4:1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? 2] For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3] For what does the Scripture say? "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS." 4] Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5] But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,
Abraham, rather than being able to take any credit before God, was instead credited or imputed with God's righteousness by believing God. Abraham was justified through faith. Gen. 15:6 Then he believed in the LORD; and He reckoned it to him as righteousness.
Saying you did anything is taking credit, only Christians seem to have a problem understanding this. I chose, I believed , I found, I sought is nothing but taking credit, especially when scripture clearly states he chose, sought and found .
It is a mystery why so many Christians insist on believing that the "lost sheep" must find the shepherd . . . instead of the other way around. Christ comes to and finds the "lost sheep." They do not find Him.
It is a mystery why so many Christians insist on believing that the "lost sheep" must find the shepherd . . . instead of the other way around. Christ comes to and finds the "lost sheep." They do not find Him.
We all like sheep have gone astray. The good shepherd seeks till he finds the very last one. What a wonderful, amazing, loving shepherd we have. Good morning everyone, have a beautiful, blessed day!!!
But it was always light dawning upon him, it was always the goodness of seeking him out bringing him to a place where he could do nothing but say I believe and change in his life be the outcome.
It's all of God. It amazes me how Christians would even consider otherwise.
You just negated your stance with this explanation, "...bringing him to a place where he could do nothing BUT SAY I BELIEVE and change in his life be the outcome." You inserted a "BUT" after "DO NOTHING" which negates the "NOTHING" of "DO NOTHING" and then you listed an action verb "SAY" which is man's response so you are admitting that man DOES DO something in the equation.
Man is not a robot. God gave him choices from the very start. Man still has a choice regarding his spiritual destiny. You admit it right here. Man has to respond to the salvation call to be saved.
You just negated your stance with this explanation, "...bringing him to a place where he could do nothing BUT SAY I BELIEVE and change in his life be the outcome." You inserted a "BUT" after "DO NOTHING" which negates the "NOTHING" of "DO NOTHING" and then you listed an action verb "SAY" which is man's response so you are admitting that man DOES DO something in the equation.
Man is not a robot. God gave him choices from the very start. Man still has a choice regarding his spiritual destiny. You admit it right here. Man has to respond to the salvation call to be saved.
So you believe that one day hey presto you just happened to choose and believe in God. No influence or persuasion, drawing,revealing of God prior to you believing ?, you did it all by yourself while dead in sin and in your alienated mind.
So you believe that one day hey presto you just happened to choose and believe in God. No influence or persuasion, drawing,revealing of God prior to you believing ?, you did it all by yourself while dead in sin and in your alienated mind.
No, talk about putting words in someone's mouth. But your definition is that man does nothing of his own in response to Christ's death on the cross. Christ died for man, Christ bore man's sin on the cross, Christ came to earth and lived a sinless life, was worthy alone of all men to go to the cross and then be raised from the dead because he had no sin of his own to keep Him in the grave. He alone bore the weight of sin when he died for man. He alone arose from the grave, victorious, triumphing over death hell and the grave.
How can anyone say that trusting in this is taking any credit?
If I did not believe, if I did not repent, if I did not confess, would I then be saved? No. So believing, repenting and confessing are part of the equation, the part that God calls on me to do. That is my faith in action. I don't have to do works to receive this fee gift, but I must believe.
Why do you have to go to the extreme that I wasn't persuaded or drawn? Why do you have to act like God was playing hide and seek and I had to do all the looking and seeking? No, God was involved all along, but the process of my spirit being born again did not happen until I said yes to Him.
If I gave you a million dollars would that say anything great and glorious about you, other than you weren't daft enough to refuse it? Really wouldn't say much about you, but would say that I was wealthy, generous and extremely kind. A gift says everything about the giver, not the receiver.
If I gave you a million dollars would that say anything great and glorious about you, other than you weren't daft enough to refuse it? Really wouldn't say much about you, but would say that I was wealthy, generous and extremely kind. A gift says everything about the giver, not the receiver.
Except, of course, the receiver is ever so much more clever than those daft idiots that supposedly "refuse" it?
Except, of course, the receiver is ever so much more clever than those daft idiots that supposedly "refuse" it?
And your point?
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