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Thrillobyte, the majority of Christians are taught amillenianism and live in countries where none of the people you've mentioned are even known to exist.
Well, then what you're saying (and I agree with you wholeheartedly) is that America is the only country in the world where dumb-as-cluck Christians by the tens of millions regularly turn on their boob-tube and settle down to watch hour upon hour of the prosperity-gospel and rapture drivel spewed by bunco artists like Copeland, Crefo, Jakes, Myers, Paula, Prince, Hinn, Popoff, Tilton oh, the list is endless...nowhere else in the world except maybe Africa, where Hinn is more popular than Nelson Mandela.
Someone once asked why don't "civilized" continents like Europe have these nuts plastered all over their TV screens and I replied because over in Europe people can think for themselves. Most Christians in this country have the collective IQ of a cretin. They can't think for themselves, reason for themselves, make spiritual decisions for themselves so they turn to these con-men to make their spiritual decisions for them, "If it's good enough for Kenneth Copeland, it's good enough for me. After all, the guy has conversations in tongues with another minister and they seem to be able to communicate with each other in a heavenly language or somethin' because they're laughing and joking and having a good time, so it must be the real deal."
Translation: Copeland: Can you believe these dopes are buying that we're communicating in this gibberish when the simple fact is we don't have a clue what in hell we saying to each other?
I'm convinced that at least a large majority of Christians, at least the gullible ones that lap this stuff up all day long are pre-tribulationists because that's what 99% of the prophecy gurus out there teach, like Lindsey, the laLonde Bros. Jack va Impe, Grant Jefferies, Tim LaHayne, and co. again for the simple reason that it is the point of view that sells the most books, tapes, DVD's etc and makes the most money for the authors and their publishers. It's just the "I-want-it-now" philosophy of the X-Y-Z generations in Christian packaging.
Full or partial. Well, me, I'm a full. I don't believe the Bible teaches that Jesus is returning physically at a future date to set up a millennium kingdom and rule from Israel. Again, this scenario is just pure hokum concocted by writers over the centuries to drum up sales of books (Scofield was one the biggest culprits in promoting all this nonsense for the sole purpose of selling his Scofield Bible). Preterist means that the person believes ALL PROPHECY was fulfilled by 70 AD. Any close reading of Matthew 13-14 and Revelation will tell you that Jesus and John were saying THIS generation--the one Peter, Paul and John were in, were the ones that would see all these thing comes to past. Revelation: "for the time is near; it is at hand; it is at the door".
Partials like RC Sproul hedge their bets and reserve Jesus' coming at a future date, but if they were truly honest with their audiences and weren't worried about offending them and losing monetary support, they'd level with them and admit they don't really believe Jesus is returning the way it has been painted in "Left Behind" and countless other prophecy books (which I have read and know the scenario backwards and forwards). It all reads like a big Hollywood blockbuster, and it's supposed to because that's what Christians pay billions of dollars for---to escape into this dream world, this fantasy of Jesus riding on white horses back to earth to establish a kingdom where our evil neighbor is raptured into hellfire and Jesus sets up a Socialist world government where people suffering from cancer don't have worry about their healthcare premium getting paid. It's all pure escapist fantasy.
I've read the heartbreaking stories on Rapture in the Air forum and others, people desperate for the rapture to come because their lives are living hells. "When is Jesus going to come??? I want to get out of here and go to heaven to be with the Lord!!" It's just....heartbreaking.
I would say the rapture teaching is one of the greatest evils ever to descend upon the Christian body. It has given every generation from Christ onward---over 2000 years---false hope that He was returning, and billions of Christians since Christ have died heartbroken, impoverished, and disillusioned and have lost their faith because of it.
Evil, pure evil.
I am sorry that this Rapturitis has hurt you spiritual. Date settings are the worst. I had friends they believed in the 1988 Rapture. They said that was good for their family. But the one that calls evil good will soon call good evil, and so it came. This people that believed a lie of the devil, I doubt that they ever repented and cast out this spirit of deception in the name of Jesus, so they go on to be deceived and deceiving others. I never bought their lies, because I stand on the word of God, it is beside the Holy Spirit our protection. Jesus answered the devil with the word of God. Jesus said, that day and hour is not known. If anyone wants to find that day, he acts against the word of God. But the devil will help him to find a date. Then in his pride and excitement he proclaims it to the world. no problem in times of internet. Some believe it and get hurt. Jesus said that deception would be the beginnings of sorrows.
I just read from Irenaeus about the Rapture. He was a disciple of Polycard, who was taught by the Apostle John. He taught Post-trib, that the church will be put to flight by the Antichrist, who will reign 3 1/2 years, then Jesus comes back and the resurrection of the just happens (this is the First Resurrection of Rev 20:4+5) which goes together with the Rapture. I think it would be good when some folks would study the traditions of the apostles, they could learn, if they want.
IMO you went from one extreme to another and missed the truth which is in the middle. According to 1. Thess 4:17 there is a caught up (rapture), together with a change of the resurrected body in immortality, which is necessary for the kingdom of God (1. Cor 15:51-54), which is eternal.
God bless
It doesn't matter whether or not someone believes in the rapture. It's got nothing to do with salvation. Why do people constantly try to poke sticks at their brothers and sisters?
Titus 3:9-11 "But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. A man that is an heretic after the first and second admonition reject; Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.
God told all the Israelites 20 years and older that they would die in the desert. The youngest person in that group would have to have been 60 when he died. Everybody 19 years +364 days and under got to enter Canaan. God had to supernaturally see to it that all 20 and older were dead by the time 40 years had passed, except for Joshua and the other guy. A mother a daughter and her daughter comprises three generations, or an average of 75 years, assuming each married at 24 and had a child a year later.
Please note who Jesus was addressing at Matthew 24 v 3. Jesus was having private words or a private conversation with his 1st-century disciples. The word ' this ' in verse 34 means Jesus is talking about a ' generation of disciples' that would start in the first century. Disciples of Jesus would continue down to the time of the great tribulation of verses 21,29 which has No opening point mentioned.
Just as the words instantly or immediately [ verse 29 ] in Scripture do Not always mean right at the moment, but bridges a long gap in time. What started in the first century did not end in the first century. Verse 29 bridges or overlaps to our time period or time frame. We have disciples of Jesus alive on earth today. They are all part of a ' disciple generation ' that was generated or started in the first century. Nothing to do with how long a person's life span is.
I am a little late posting this as I have just finished The Rapture Generation by David Watson. I am reading it for the third time. I am a speed reader and don't absorb some material so I always read something twice if it captures my interest and a third time possibly for research purposes. This book was written by a fine chivalrous Christian man who obviously loves the Lord, besides the fact of being a high school educator. I being a Christian admit I can not Quote scripture by memory as so many although I can quote some...the ones I was taught as a child. What I can say without any doubt there will absolutely be a Rapture. I read and study the Bible, mostly King James Version and the NIV. I am sorry if you don't believe there will be This Rapture, The Second Coming or what you call it. No one knows the moment. There is no true date of evidence except that "He Will Come Again". Of course there is all the scripture of certain dates, although December 25th is not the exact date Christ was born.... Or is it? I don't really know, I am just grateful he came. I am grateful for that moment in time that changed the World forever. How am I so certain, by pure Faith and Trust in Him. This I am clear about also. I am thankful David Watson provided such a minds eye view about what the Rapture is and how it might be. It brought a deeper appreciation of every single event in Biblical Times. Of course, this is just my opinion and to the World I am just one. I am one however that wants to make the most out of this life, to Love and Serve in whatever I am to be doing. I do appreciate all the references used and comments made as I always want to be open to new knowledge and insight. My faith is unshakeable. I will one day be with Him in one of those many mansions Jesus spoke of. Robyn Terry
I sympathize with Rapturites who are busy chewing on their nails and watching the headlines for any news that can be spinned by prophecy gurus into anything remotely resembling the Apocalypse. I used to be in that camp myself until about 2008 when I came to the painful realization that the rapture was never going to come. 2008 was a watershed year, in case the rapturites don't know. It marked the end of any possible extension of the generation Jesus talked about that is the darling of prophecy gurus [/b]
You use the Bible to falsify the Bible. You quote scripture as evidence that scripture is false. Because... because... because.... you're interested in upholding the "true meaning" of prophecy.
I have always said there was no rapture or that it sure isn't from the scriptures quoted about a rapture.
The Bema judgment comes first and that is death, not rapture.
You die in the Bema judgment and it is because you are two men in a bed and you have just been cut in half, divided soul and spirit and the eagles will come and have a feast while a whole world laughs at Christians because judgment begins at the sanctuary of God.
I do however believe in a honeymoon, after all, the bridegroom comes at midnight and surprises his bride and he takes her away.
I have always said there was no rapture or that it sure isn't from the scriptures quoted about a rapture.
The Bema judgment comes first and that is death, not rapture.
You die in the Bema judgment and it is because you are two men in a bed and you have just been cut in half, divided soul and spirit and the eagles will come and have a feast while a whole world laughs at Christians because judgment begins at the sanctuary of God.
I do however believe in a honeymoon, after all, the bridegroom comes at midnight and surprises his bride and he takes her away.
I thankfully never did believe it because I wasn't taught by them, but I was curious as to what they were talking about that wasn't in there, and so studied it out for myself. It's so absurd, it makes you wonder how they can reject the truly spiritual things for something that farfetched. Peace
I thankfully never did believe it because I wasn't taught by them, but I was curious as to what they were talking about that wasn't in there, and so studied it out for myself. It's so absurd, it makes you wonder how they can reject the truly spiritual things for something that farfetched. Peace
Well, I gotta tell you. If you don't see it, you've never read the Bible. And whatever you "studied out", it wasn't the Bible. Believing it is another discussion, but it's pretty much undeniably there. What you're saying is like saying there's nothing about the Civil War in "Gone With The Wind".
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The Rapture Generation
