Why does homosexuality anger conservative Christians more than other sins? (Gospel, procreation)
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If I can jump in here.... Comparing Christian Fundamentalism to Nazism gets no one anywhere. The Christianity that Jesus laid out is not to be compared to left and right American western democratic politics. Both sides can claim a stake by picking and choosing. It is as good as someone on the right calling someone a little more progressive a Communist. Does no good in any debate.
If we are going to keep this within a biblical sphere (and this is a Christian forum and Christianity is nothing without scripture and its basis in the doctrine, can we at least agree on that?), I say that the right place that a conservative or fundamentalist Christian needs to look at with fear and trembling and seeing how much their doctrine and their hardline hold on is off base, is to look at the Pharisees. The Pharisees were the object of condemnation by Jesus. Not prostitutes, not tax collectors, not drunks.... the Pharisees.
Why? They were viewed as the arbiters of what was right and wrong within the "church" of the day. They made God a hard task master that must be pleased by one's actions and attitudes and beliefs and set up a structure that they could appear to follow that the masses could not... yet did not follow these very rules themselves when exposed.
Read the gospels again folks. If you are a conservative Christian (and yes, I still see myself as a conservative Christian in many ways even tho I know many would say I am now falling away...) but read the gospels in a new light. Did Jesus condemn any group? Yes. Pharisees. No one else.
It is a dangerous place to have your theology close off the gospel to groups of people that need it. And in this overall debate back to the OP, the American evangelical church has shunned and made unwelcome those that have same sex attraction and whatever way that works out in the individual's identity in the LGBTQ spectrum. Holding a hard line against any of these identities has done NOTHING to stop these desires within the individual. Saying love the sinner/hate the sin is just another way of saying get the hell out of this church. We conservative Christians need to realize we have missed the mark on this subject and are in dangerous territory of being sorted with the goats in the teaching from Matthew 25.... "When you did this to the least of these, you did it unto me."
If I can jump in here.... Comparing Christian Fundamentalism to Nazism gets no one anywhere. The Christianity that Jesus laid out is not to be compared to left and right American western democratic politics. Both sides can claim a stake by picking and choosing. It is as good as someone on the right calling someone a little more progressive a Communist. Does no good in any debate.
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I agree. Although on the other hand i dread to think what this country would be like under a president who holds to the beliefs of many fundamentalists on here from either side of the aisle.
At the end of the day, if fundamentalist christians did what Jesus did, which was preach peace to those who were near and those that are afar off, instead of calling those whose lifesyle they are not agreeable to, sinners who need to repent, they would be doing something effective, rather than being a hinderance and a stumbing block to the many, i mean how the hell is a homosexual ever going to take what a fundy has got to say, seriously, if all they are doing is fault finding. Is it any wonder they seek God through other means.
You were responding to me (post #6915), and as for the personal attacks and insults, it is the norm with you. Anger and hatred is the "fruit" of your spirit.
What did I say that you find so insensitive?
Awwwww.........he is trying to stir up a reaction.
I'll pray for you Warden.
Hope you get better soon.
I appreciate the prayers and can use them. You need the practice.
I agree. Although on the other hand i dread to think what this country would be like under a president who holds to the beliefs of many fundamentalists on here from either side of the aisle.
At the end of the day, if fundamentalist christians did what Jesus did, which was preach peace to those who were near and those that are afar off, instead of calling those whose lifesyle they are not agreeable to, sinners who need to repent, they would be doing something effective, rather than being a hinderance and a stumbing block to the many, i mean how the hell is a homosexual ever going to take what a fundy has got to say, seriously, if all they are doing is fault finding. Is it any wonder they seek God through other means.
It is the supreme irony that the message of the embodied epitome of God's Love, Jesus the Christ, would be used to condemn and disparage love between consenting adults. The corruptions of His message in the "precepts and doctrines of men" are the true abomination.
I agree. Although on the other hand i dread to think what this country would be like under a president who holds to the beliefs of many fundamentalists on here from either side of the aisle.
At the end of the day, if fundamentalist christians did what Jesus did, which was preach peace to those who were near and those that are afar off, instead of calling those whose lifesyle they are not agreeable to, sinners who need to repent, they would be doing something effective, rather than being a hinderance and a stumbling block to the many, i mean how the hell is a homosexual ever going to take what a fundy has got to say, seriously, if all they are doing is fault finding. Is it any wonder they seek God through other means.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD
It is the supreme irony that the message of the embodied epitome of God's Love, Jesus the Christ, would be used to condemn and disparage love between consenting adults. The corruptions of His message in the "precepts and doctrines of men" are the true abomination.
Conservative Christian Fundamentalists fear that their next President may be homosexual.
If I can jump in here.... Comparing Christian Fundamentalism to Nazism gets no one anywhere. The Christianity that Jesus laid out is not to be compared to left and right American western democratic politics. Both sides can claim a stake by picking and choosing. It is as good as someone on the right calling someone a little more progressive a Communist. Does no good in any debate.
If we are going to keep this within a biblical sphere (and this is a Christian forum and Christianity is nothing without scripture and its basis in the doctrine, can we at least agree on that?), I say that the right place that a conservative or fundamentalist Christian needs to look at with fear and trembling and seeing how much their doctrine and their hardline hold on is off base, is to look at the Pharisees. The Pharisees were the object of condemnation by Jesus. Not prostitutes, not tax collectors, not drunks.... the Pharisees.
Why? They were viewed as the arbiters of what was right and wrong within the "church" of the day. They made God a hard task master that must be pleased by one's actions and attitudes and beliefs and set up a structure that they could appear to follow that the masses could not... yet did not follow these very rules themselves when exposed.
Read the gospels again folks. If you are a conservative Christian (and yes, I still see myself as a conservative Christian in many ways even tho I know many would say I am now falling away...) but read the gospels in a new light. Did Jesus condemn any group? Yes. Pharisees. No one else.
It is a dangerous place to have your theology close off the gospel to groups of people that need it. And in this overall debate back to the OP, the American evangelical church has shunned and made unwelcome those that have same sex attraction and whatever way that works out in the individual's identity in the LGBTQ spectrum. Holding a hard line against any of these identities has done NOTHING to stop these desires within the individual. Saying love the sinner/hate the sin is just another way of saying get the hell out of this church. We conservative Christians need to realize we have missed the mark on this subject and are in dangerous territory of being sorted with the goats in the teaching from Matthew 25.... "When you did this to the least of these, you did it unto me."
It is the supreme irony that the message of the embodied epitome of God's Love, Jesus the Christ, would be used to condemn and disparage love between consenting adults. The corruptions of His message in the "precepts and doctrines of men" are the true abomination.
It isn’t just love between consenting adults, but that does no demonstrable harm. The point to me is the concept of a god that would deny love for no good reason: just apparent spite.
If I can jump in here.... Comparing Christian Fundamentalism to Nazism gets no one anywhere. The Christianity that Jesus laid out is not to be compared to left and right American western democratic politics. Both sides can claim a stake by picking and choosing. It is as good as someone on the right calling someone a little more progressive a Communist. Does no good in any debate.
If we are going to keep this within a biblical sphere (and this is a Christian forum and Christianity is nothing without scripture and its basis in the doctrine, can we at least agree on that?), I say that the right place that a conservative or fundamentalist Christian needs to look at with fear and trembling and seeing how much their doctrine and their hardline hold on is off base, is to look at the Pharisees. The Pharisees were the object of condemnation by Jesus. Not prostitutes, not tax collectors, not drunks.... the Pharisees.
Why? They were viewed as the arbiters of what was right and wrong within the "church" of the day. They made God a hard task master that must be pleased by one's actions and attitudes and beliefs and set up a structure that they could appear to follow that the masses could not... yet did not follow these very rules themselves when exposed.
Read the gospels again folks. If you are a conservative Christian (and yes, I still see myself as a conservative Christian in many ways even tho I know many would say I am now falling away...) but read the gospels in a new light. Did Jesus condemn any group? Yes. Pharisees. No one else.
It is a dangerous place to have your theology close off the gospel to groups of people that need it. And in this overall debate back to the OP, the American evangelical church has shunned and made unwelcome those that have same sex attraction and whatever way that works out in the individual's identity in the LGBTQ spectrum. Holding a hard line against any of these identities has done NOTHING to stop these desires within the individual. Saying love the sinner/hate the sin is just another way of saying get the hell out of this church. We conservative Christians need to realize we have missed the mark on this subject and are in dangerous territory of being sorted with the goats in the teaching from Matthew 25.... "When you did this to the least of these, you did it unto me."
if all that is true THEN why did John the Baptist come first? why did that fact get him killed? maybe because men hate repentance? and maybe all men/mankind hate to be humbled!
but either way "the way of the Lord" had to be prepared by repentance.. and Jesus condemned many in so many ways understood only in their culture ... by saying "go and sin no more" and in other ways.. only those in their culture at that time would understand HOW HE DID IT .. certainly not an American gentile and maybe not even most current jews.. in the 21 century.... He was calling them sinners.. everyone and releasing them from their guilt and spiritual connection to the sin and with it the demonic connections to their sins...... he did not say that to just the pharisees!!
John called all men to repentance and Jesus said it in so many ways ... go and sin no more to all levels of society, then gave them an obedience test , just like he did Abraham! maybe so they could see what was in their own hearts.
when you do this kind of false statement, your intent is vilify his religion theirs and or ours. But the roots of religions is glorious..
yet you do not vilify the human heart AND IT ISN'T GLORIOUS!!! Not the hearts and wills of men ..of all men and all mankind AND WHAT THEY CAN DO TO truth!! which is where the blame game should go to, to "the will" and heart of man. really your statement is very false!
John was preparing "the way of the Lord" and for the kingdom of God a call to repentance.. ... calling for repentance of all sin.. not just to the Pharisees and Sadducee and other sects of scribes there at that time. they were just the vocal ones.. the none vocal ones just walked away... he couldn't even heal in some such cities where their hearts were evil and judgmental and just as demanding and deadly as any Pharisee !
All these were men who maybe did not read his word or study it ,maybe it was either to "holy" to be read .. or not holy enough to them.. .. !! and some like to only argue and very aggressively about other mens thoughts about God's word.
I think it might be a kind of way to ignore God..
to not actually talk to him, but to talk about him, kind of like Gossip.
so maybe it makes some feel "spiritual" and certainly "intellectual" also .
and certainly that can be happening on all three sides of "his religions" and the nons- religion that follows all them all around gossiping about God and man.
It isn’t just love between consenting adults, but that does no demonstrable harm. The point to me is the concept of a god that would deny love for no good reason: just apparent spite.
Or, perhaps, sex was purely created 'by God' for procreation, so all other forms of sex, including recreational sex by heterosexuals, would also be seen as being 'off-limits'. And, the desire for sex is necessary since few would procreate just out of a sense of duty.
I guess if we really want to know why 'God' appears to have His tights in a twist over gay sex we simply need to revisit the question originally asked by the OP and ask for an honest answer from conservative Christians. After all, it's the 'fundies' who have created a God in their own image so why not ask them? Their reason will be God's reason. We're back to square one. Baptist Fundie? Jeff? Finn? n..Xuipa? Anyone? Why DOES God have a special ax to grind with gay people? Just give your personal viewpoint on this question and that will be how God feels. See how it works?
I don't want to answer that because I have answered it a hundred times.. God hates sin not the sinner.. even the name of this thread admits it is a sin..
you can't prove by function or by spirit that homosexuality isn't sin.. there is a stinking boat load of sins not listed in there as sin.
but perversions of married sexuality is listed in there as sin.. and that includes all forms of perversions of married legal and binding /intercourse/ they became one flesh. "leave his father and mother and cleave to his wife and the two shall become one flesh./.."..and in the next age it is one in spirit and flesh too..
there is also no example of a righteous homo relationship in this word..anywhere.
His right ( male)arms and his Left hand/arm (female) become one human .. and as such the return of the perfect - Pre EVE Adam was created whole a " them " was in the him.... in that " legal and binding relationship ... partnerships ...lies wholeness and in that only lies balance. a very non-narisitic kind of balance in his life is created and that is true in all ways.. life is created.. spiritual and physical life is created.. nothing in the relationship between a husband and wife is wasted or useless.
so Now you all need to prove any form of perversion is healthy and whole and truth and in anyway an alternitive lifestyle choice .. to the only way... Christ and his church..... ! you can't do it.
because it is not healthy and it certainly will never merit His LIFE.. His breath.. His blessings !
he will forgive it .. but it will not recieve his blessing and his blessing is important in the next age..
so I love lots of HOmo and ex homo's and I want them to be blessed and made whole one day and find Him and His Peace one day. and to become healed allow the Lord to find their Bere****, the one planned for them from the beginning of time.. there is such a thing.
no human has gone through this world and not been beat by the demonic and by mankind at least once and left for dead..
only the Lord can heal us from that kind of woundings.. but the time of healing will be worth every bit of that investment for their eternal partners.
Last edited by n..Xuipa; 05-17-2019 at 10:27 AM..
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