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So why was Jesus accused of being a drunk and a glutton and a friend of sinners? Luke7:34 if you need to look it up.
And no, I don't think Jesus is OK with prostitution. How do you get that? I do know he loves prostitutes and does not condemn them. He said so. It's in red in your bible.
You ever thought about Jesus' first public miracle? He served good wine to people that were already drunk. Read that story again too.
I don't think he would be welcome in your church doing that.
Then why do you think it's impossible for us to not love gay people while hating their sinful lifestyle? You seem to suggest the example of Christ is to embrace their sin.
You can lead a horse/mule to water, but you can't make him drink!
Wardendresden spews his venom almost exclusively at me. It angers him because I expose the phoniness of his brand of Christianity. For those who don't know the history, this is a man claiming to be on the right side of Christianity who:
1. Regularly Praises and supports atheists in their assault and trashing of Christians
2. Told me to burn in hell.
3. Regularly rejects the Bible as the Word of God
4. Uses profanity and personally attacks anyone who doesn't buy into his nonsense.
And I will continue to NEVER respond to his posts until he apologizes. NEVER.
Everybody have a choice of attraction, preference, and the physical activity in which you choose to engage.
Just because your decision is not a struggle does not eliminate the fact that it's a choice.
If you were to admit that one's (sexual) attraction to someone is (highly likely) innate as per medical science - i.e. homosexuality is unlearned, inborn - while their (therefore natural) inclination to act on this innate desire is a choice, then you would have a point. Of course 'choice' is open to both gay and straight people even though their 'natural' or 'instinctive' attraction is not.
That said, for me, while I would argue the case for attraction for same gender or opposite gender being an inborn feature, it would hardly matter at the end of the day. Even if one's sexual identity IS a choice, who are you or who is anyone else to tell adults who they can and cannot be intimate with?
Then why do you think it's impossible for us to not love gay people while hating their sinful lifestyle? You seem to suggest the example of Christ is to embrace their sin.
How have you loved gay people? The example you give is to condemn them and tell them they are going to hell if they don't repent. Jesus didn't show this. He did not condemn the woman caught in adultery. He said nothing about adultery. He loved her where she was and pointed her to the cross. No sermon on adultery, no condemning her choice or in depth discussion on why she chose that particular sin. No rating of her sin against other sins. Nothing of the sort.
He treated her just like he treated his disciples. Lost humanity that needed a Savior. Why don't you treat others like this? Why do you codify them based on their sin or lifestyle or behavior? Why don't you point anyone to Jesus and not give a care about their past? That is what Jesus did.
You can do that without condemning OR condoning behavior or labels or groups. Each individual is a prized creation that Jesus died for. Bring them to him and leave the rest to him to figure out.
You add to the gospel and that is sad. Jesus is enough.
Then why do you think it's impossible for us to not love gay people while hating their sinful lifestyle? You seem to suggest the example of Christ is to embrace their sin.
Regarding eating... it's not in God's character to have a law without a means to sustain yourself. So that's a bad example. There are people who are anorexic who choose not to eat.
God said it is not good to be alone, yet Jesus chose to not have a spouse or sexual partner while on the earth.
If people are attracted to the same sex, there is a choice to not have sexual relations if they desire to please God. Just like a heterosexual has a choice to not have sexual relations with someone of the opposite sex outside of marriage. You can have relationships without sexual relations. God allows that in case you are not aware.
Yet you haven’t an iota of scientific data showing sexual attraction is voluntary. Not a shred. And from your own experience I’m sure you have seen half a dozen good looking women come into a room but your eye is primarily attracted to just one. You don’t know why, you just know the attraction.
Food is an excellent example. It is something we cannot live without in the same way intimate companionship was decreed by God to be necessary. And there are a few who do live isolated, unfulfilled lives, exactly as you are decreeing for homosexuals.
But your view is that you yourself “decide” who you are attracted to. That’s a load of hogwash and you know it is.
Quote:
There's nothing like that first spark of chemistry, when you see someone from across the room and your body shudders. It's almost as if some sort of magic is in the air, drawing you toward them. You immediately know that you need to talk to them, even if it's about something as silly as their drink of choice or the book they're reading. This is a sign of sexual attraction, as is the constant desire to want to jump your partner's bones every time you see them.
We can't force ourselves to be attracted to someone we’re not attracted to, just because that person is good for us, it doesn't work, and if we try, it's going to put us and our partner through hell. We can't force our sexual attraction. Most of us have learned that the hard way. But, there's something profound that most of us have never been taught. Even though our sexual attraction cannot be forced, and cannot be controlled, they can be educated.
http://deeperdatingpodcast.com/sexual-attraction/
Thousands of homosexuals have tried to force attraction for the opposite sex. Mel White, in his book Stranger at the Gate: To Be Gay And Christian In America, stated he loved his wife of many years but could not have sex with her without thinking about a man. He went to every kind of gay conversion therapy including electric shock, and ultimately could not reject his homosexuality nor his love for God (several books attributed to Billy Graham, Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell were ghostwritten for them by Mel).
You are so in love with your bigotry that you have told yourself a lie over and over so many times that you’ve come to believe it without ever experiencing it.
Quote:
If you repeat a lie often enough people will begin to believe it and you will come to believe it yourself.
Joseph Goebbels, Chief Propagandist for the Third Reich
Last edited by Wardendresden; 06-20-2019 at 09:04 PM..
Tell that to the numerous men I know that grew up in church and hated themselves for desiring other males. Do you know how many have knelt at an alter in silent agony praying with everything in their power for God to take those desires away? Most men I know that grew up in church and find themselves with same sex attraction have done everything possible to choose to be straight including marrying women to make it so.
How totally off base your comments are in the real world.
Not off base...
Dealing with sin is never easy or fun, and sexual sins are a different breed than other sins. I don't envy anyone who has to go through that. Especially when it stems from children being abused and it takes root in one's adult life.
I don't have a good response as far as making it easier, but the Bible is clear on homosexual activity.
Dealing with sin is never easy or fun, and sexual sins are a different breed than other sins. I don't envy anyone who has to go through that. Especially when it stems from children being abused and it takes root in one's adult life.
I don't have a good response as far as making it easier, but the Bible is clear on homosexual activity.
To those whose lips get tired if they read more than five paragraphs.
Wardendresden spews his venom almost exclusively at me. It angers him because I expose the phoniness of his brand of Christianity. For those who don't know the history, this is a man claiming to be on the right side of Christianity who:
1. Regularly Praises and supports atheists in their assault and trashing of Christians
Warden can handle himself in the manner that he normally does so admirably. I'm just responding to this post generally as I don't have a whole lot on my plate today. I just know from MY reading of scripture that Jesus would also support atheists and their assault on trashing 'Fundie' Christians. Jesus had a tendency to do that kind of thing all the time. Have you ever actually read about Jesus in your Bible, Jeff?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
2. Told me to burn in hell.
Well, I don't know about that but you DID recently cast your admiration on that Israel Folau fellow for having the courage to stick to his guns, did you not? And, what was it, precisely, that you admired about this guy? Hmmmm ...ah yes, you admire this guy's tenacity to stick by his message that gay people are condemned to burn in hell! Okay for them but not for you, eh, Jeff?
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
3. Regularly rejects the Bible as the Word of God
According to you, everyone who disagrees with Jeff rejects the Bible as the Word of God.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
4. Uses profanity and personally attacks anyone who doesn't buy into his nonsense.
Well, I don't know about the profanity but I believe Jesus (according to what I read of Him in the Bible) would have a field day with the 'fundie' Christians of today if He were here. He would possibly refer to them as 'whitewashed sepulchres'. Ouch!
Wardendresden spews his venom almost exclusively at me. It angers him because I expose the phoniness of his brand of Christianity. For those who don't know the history, this is a man claiming to be on the right side of Christianity who:
1. Regularly Praises and supports atheists in their assault and trashing of Christians
2. Told me to burn in hell.
3. Regularly rejects the Bible as the Word of God
4. Uses profanity and personally attacks anyone who doesn't buy into his nonsense.
And I will continue to NEVER respond to his posts until he apologizes. NEVER.
Sounds more anti-Christian than Christian to me!
GOOD!!! I have no desire for you to respond. I don’t post for the benefit of lost causes such as yourself, I post for poor souls reading your hate and comparing who they are to pedophilia, bestiality, kleptomania, and bank robbery.
1. You regularly support the Pharisees of the Bible in your effort to trash people
2. You will burn in Hell and I will be right beside you in the flames (God’s punishment is remedial)
3. You regularly reject Jesus and His words found in Scripture
4. What is profane to some is not for others as you bloody well know. And I confine my attacks to those attacking others—-frequently you who constantly see homosexuals as pedophiles. Jesus would and did attack you as well as a “whited sepulchre” so aptly quoted by Romulus. A million atheists will stand in heaven before you and you will cry, “when did we see you hungry and not feed you, or thirsty and not give you drink, or naked and not clothe you?”
Never has anyone appeared to so hate Jesus as do you.
And you are not only biblically ignorant but willfully ignore the Bible when it doesn’t suit you. I still haven’t seen why your unchangeable god who hates incest was more than willing to make exceptions to all his Levitical and Deutoronomic rules with regard to his most favored servants—-Abram and his sister Sara (whom after marrying her Abram instructed to lie about by telling strangers they were but brother and sister); Jacob marries two sisters (although a Jewish scholar insists it was four, all fathered by Laban); nor why the union of Judah and Tamar whom Judah thought was a prostitute should bring about lineage to Jesus.
You are a mixed up soul, exhibit some quite interesting psychological profiles recognized by many on this thread (I estimate pms about it from half dozen other posters including a couple of gay ones) and are a remarkably self-centered individual concerned about YOUR rights when the New Testament over and over calls for esteeming others over self.
But here is a promise—-I will ask God to place us side by side in hell and will apologize to you every time you apologize to God and the LGBTQ community.
Have a happy day!!
Last edited by Wardendresden; 06-20-2019 at 09:56 PM..
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