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Thanks for sharing your personal opinion on it. People can go with what the Bible teaches, or they can go with personal opinions and/or feelings.
Not sure which verses are directed exclusively for heterosexuals, but many unrepenting sexually immoral heterosexual pastors and/or members have been asked to leave. Even the Bible gives an example of such instance.
Yes, He told them to go and sin no more.
Like you, Finn? Do you sin "no more" and thereby work your way to heaven?
That was the entire message of Jesus story regarding WHO commits adultery. It was even those who merely looked and contemplated. I'm sure you look but have never "contemplated."
Everybody is struggling with something — and if you are not, you are dead.
I prefer to go with the Love of God that the Bible teaches consistently as demonstrated in Jesus. You can stick with that "old time" Bible that taught slaves were an acceptable property.
And there are those who disagree with your interpretations of various passages. So, your view that you are correct is not the only view that should be considered. Obviously, people disagree, therefore you have division and separation, especially among the churches - but that does not give anyone the right to discriminate against another human being, irregardless of what it is you personally believe.
Amazing how we all agree that certain behaviors are bad, like murder, theft, adultery, etc....but it's always the ones that people like to do, and they like to hold on to that we have issue with condemning, and we argue over "interpretation".
The reading of those passages is clear, if you care to read them. But I get it--you'd rather just take the scissors and cut them out of your Bible than to heed them. You're hardly the first person to ever do that.
Amazing how we all agree that certain behaviors are bad, like murder, theft, adultery, etc....but it's always the ones that people like to do, and they like to hold on to that we have issue with condemning, and we argue over "interpretation".
The reading of those passages is clear, if you care to read them. But I get it--you'd rather just take the scissors and cut them out of your Bible than to heed them. You're hardly the first person to ever do that.
Murder is the unforgivable and has no place in a conversation in oil.
Repent, speak life, and "let the dead bury the dead"...
Amazing how we all agree that certain behaviors are bad, like murder, theft, adultery, etc....but it's always the ones that people like to do, and they like to hold on to that we have issue with condemning, and we argue over "interpretation".
The reading of those passages is clear, if you care to read them. But I get it--you'd rather just take the scissors and cut them out of your Bible than to heed them. You're hardly the first person to ever do that.
No, every bit of the Bible needs contextual interpretation.
But guess what, most morality is within both Christians and non-Christians. Can you name a civilization that supports its citizens murdering one another? Or one that has no punishment for thieves?
I've known a gay Christian who would put us both to shame. Yet in your heart you know he couldn't be Christian because you've interpreted it that way.
From Scott McQueen's book, Reasonable Doubt: A Case for LGBTQ Inclusion in the Institutions of Marriage and Church:
Quote:
I have never felt condemnation from the Holy Spirit about being gay. God continues to work in my life and convict on other matters like self-sufficiency and pride. I know the voice and working of the Holy Spirit in my life but there has been no condemnation at all from God on this matter. I am frightened for Christians, who, in their own pride, try to become the Holy Spirit in my life. They contradict what the still small voice of God has already told me, which is: this is not a problem and you were created as you are for a purpose. What does God think of someone who tries to become the Holy Spirit in someone else's life? We as individuals must always listen to the voice of God in our lives above all others.
As a gay person I have some hopes, prayers, and wishes for the church. I wish the church would understand the Holy Spirit can and does speak directly to the hearts of gay Christians. LGBT Christians are not from another planet. We pray, and fast, and read the inspired Word of God just like other Christians do. As we do, God speaks directly to us just as we are.
--------
If the church treated this like a disputable matter (like eating meat offered to idols in the New Testament) we could move forward and learn to appreciated those honest differences without scaring each other so much. Many younger Christians are already there. We need to get on with the task of winning others to Christ.
Last, I wish the church would be aware GBT people do not expect the church to understand them. Unless you're gay or transgender yourself, it will be impossible to fully understand. And to everyone reading this: give yourself a break because no one is expecting this of you. What the church should do is LOVE gay and transgender people because that is what God has asked Christians to do for each other. He has even asked us to do that for our enemies.
Chapter 12, Exhibit L: Beauty and Beast
So this young gay man claims Christ as Lord and hears God speak to him. Yet you wish to be the Holy Spirit in his life and condemn him. Not surprising, unsaved man is always trying to make himself a god towards other people.
Amazing how we all agree that certain behaviors are bad, like murder, theft, adultery, etc....but it's always the ones that people like to do, and they like to hold on to that we have issue with condemning, and we argue over "interpretation".
For me, there is NO arguing over 'interpretation' of certain Bible texts pertaining to the topic of homosexuality. I'm pretty sure that I know what these passages of scripture are referring to and, more importantly, what they ARE NOT referring to. Many Christians are not only inept when it comes to the very book they claim to uphold, they don't even have the mind or the intellect to question what they've heard regurgitated from the pulpit since day one. They are like sponges that soak up whatever their minister has to tell them as 'the Bible truth'. I mean, after all, these people are ordained ministers. They MUST know what they're talking about. Right? Clearly, these ministers are just as brainwashed and as biblically inept as the ones they preach to ...it's a vicious cycle.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
The reading of those passages is clear, if you care to read them.
That question was not aimed at me but I can assure you that "I" HAVE both read AND comprehended the scriptures to which you refer. AND, quite clearly, those scriptures ARE NOT clear to you, BaptistFundie. You perhaps need to go back to them and use some critical thought processing technique this time. Yes, I realize that your previous cherished interpretation of said texts will be sorely affected but if it's the truth you really want then it's worth it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
But I get it--you'd rather just take the scissors and cut them out of your Bible than to heed them. You're hardly the first person to ever do that.
Again, not addressed to me but no one should be taking any criticism or advice from you, BF, until you have an understanding of what you're talking about. I personally can't take anything you have to say seriously.
It's a shame, isn't it? If people would just read what God's Word says and go with it....none of this would happen. Stand on the Bible, not our own opinions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade
It depends on how you interpret things that have been said?
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
I'm sorry, but there is no verse in the Bible that affirms that sin is good, or that our churches should affirm it. Nor is there even a passage or verse that can be reasonably "interpreted" to mean that. It clearly states homosexual acts are sin, and it condemns those that turn from the natural to lust for the unnatural in Romans 1.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerwade
And there are those who disagree with your interpretations of various passages. So, your view that you are correct is not the only view that should be considered. Obviously, people disagree, therefore you have division and separation, especially among the churches - but that does not give anyone the right to discriminate against another human being, irregardless of what it is you personally believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BaptistFundie
Amazing how we all agree that certain behaviors are bad, like murder, theft, adultery, etc....but it's always the ones that people like to do, and they like to hold on to that we have issue with condemning, and we argue over "interpretation".
The reading of those passages is clear, if you care to read them. But I get it--you'd rather just take the scissors and cut them out of your Bible than to heed them. You're hardly the first person to ever do that.
Apparently, you would rather justify discrimination, than understand that those passages don't equate to your twenty-first century way of thinking and the degradation of another person through that of an unjustified or prejudice attitude. You should ask yourself who it is that are being morally abusive; the rapist or the one who is being raped. Moral abusers are bullies and control freaks. Often times, they try to impose themselves upon others and shield themselves from criticism while presenting themselves as having the morally high ground. Remember, Sodom and Gomorrah was about abusing strangers, not homosexuality or consensual relationships.
Apparently, you would rather justify discrimination, than understand that those passages don't equate to your twenty-first century way of thinking and the degradation of another person through that of an unjustified or prejudice attitude. You should ask yourself who it is that are being morally abusive; the rapist or the one who is being raped. Moral abusers are bullies and control freaks. Often times, they try to impose themselves upon others and shield themselves from criticism while presenting themselves as having the morally high ground. Remember, Sodom and Gomorrah was about abusing strangers, not homosexuality or consensual relationships.
Fundies aren't into the whole "doing good" thing. They're into saying the Magic Words To Jesus which is all they believe needs doing in order to pave their way to heaven.
It's hard to be like Jesus but it's dead-easy to be a fundie.
I am a Wisconsin synod Lutheran. We are a conservative Lutheran church body that believes everything God has told us in the Bible. Certainly homosexuality is sinful and the idea of allowing gay marriage, gay clergy or gay church members is an affront fo God. I am shocked anyone would rub their sin in Gods face. Your comments about “doing good” are disturbing as well. No good works can get you into heaven, we are not capable of making up for our sinful behavior. What we deserve is eternal death in hell. The gift of salvation is just that....a free gift. It is an undeserved gift. Any good works we do are done in thankfulness to the Lord. This is all the work of God. There are no “magic words”. I am sure my beliefs will confirm to you that I am a fundie. Leftists and atheists love to insult us by calling us fundies, but what I really am is a Christian saved by grace and grace alone.
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