Indians excel with 11-0 June record at home; next Cleveland champion? (Columbus: vs, farm)

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Clevelanders, I hate to say it, are bandwagoners nowadays. At least when it comes to Cavs and Indians. In a month from now, if the Indians are still first place, the stadium will sell out. Yes, it takes an entire season practically of great baseball to get people to show up and buy 15 dollar tickets consistently. Then if they don't win the World Series, a large portion of people will complain about it, despite having not attended a game until September.
Many teams with no playoff hopes whatsoever still draw 5-10 k more per night. This has been a source of Cleveland embarrassment for me. Personally, an Indians world series would be the greatest sports event that I can imagine (above NBA championship and Super Bowl for me, though I will acknowledge that the Super Bowl party would be insane).

Wow I was actually wrong with this post back on August 19! I gave Clevelanders too much credit!

I listen to the games on my MLB app when I can, so I never really see the stadium much. I think I am going to keep it that way. Just depressing. I was cruising box scores the other day and looked at the Indians win over the Royals from I think Wednesday night. I typically only look at the actual stats, but this time I scrolled all the way to the bottom. Weather: 75, clear. Start time: 7:10 pm. Attendance: 13,888.

Under 14k for a team with a single digits magic number on a beautiful September night.

To compare, on that same day, the 76-75 Pirates went to fresh-off-race-riot Milwaukee to play the 68-84 Brewers. Neither have a sniff of the playoffs. Attendance? 25,482.

That same night, the Phillies had 21k. The Marlins had 18k. Rockies, 26k. Padres 22k. To say nothing about teams actually in the playoff pictures, like the Red Sox. Fenway (which I think is an inferior stadium and experience to be completely honest) is just packed with fans. Those are fun games to watch right now. Indians games? The atmosphere just isn't there.

A couple friends went to the game last night and posted some photos of the right field district at 7 pm. There was virtually nobody there. Meanwhile, 67 thousand suckers packed it in for the Browns on Sunday, paying much higher prices to do so.

Have things really changed so much? WHen I was growing up, it was the era of Albert Belle, Jim Thome, Manny Ramirez and those teams that just steamrolled people. Don't Clevelanders remember how fun that was? I just don't get why nobody goes. It's not just that they only get like 25 thousand a night, they are barely getting into the 10k's within a week of probably clinching the division for the first time since 2007.

[bjimmy24]

^ I guess I should also say that last night, the worst team in baseball by a long shot, Minnesota Twins, drew 21,599 to a game with a 64 degree high. The Twins had lost their previous 5 games too before last night. Now it's 6.

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Have things really changed so much? WHen I was growing up, it was the era of Albert Belle, Jim Thome, Manny Ramirez and those teams that just steamrolled people. Don't Clevelanders remember how fun that was? I just don't get why nobody goes. It's not just that they only get like 25 thousand a night, they are barely getting into the 10k's within a week of probably clinching the division for the first time since 2007.

In hindsight, the Dolans killed the Indians fan base with their penny-pinching, compounded by weak scouting/draft choices in the early 21st century. The Haslams are playing a similar, fan base-destroying game with the Browns, but the Haslams may have St. Louis Cardinals-like aspirations to cash in by selling/moving the Browns down the road.

By contrast, the Dolans have deep Cleveland roots and really want the Indians to succeed. IMO, the recent sale of a minority interest to a non-Clevelander does raise concerns.

I also think that your Pittsburgh statistics reflect Pittsburgh's superior economy. E.g., manufacturing, still a key component of the Greater Cleveland economy, has been weakening sharply for the last several months.

https://www.advisorperspectives.com/...to-contraction

A real test will be whether the Indians can sell out their play-off dates. If not, given the sharply reduced capacity of Progressive Field, it will not bode well for Greater Cleveland's interest in the MLB product. However, it appears that remaining inventories are very limited.

Cleveland Indians American League Division Series tickets go on sale to the public Monday | cleveland.com

Also, it will be interesting to see what happens to season ticket sales for 2017 if the Indians can make a deep run into the play-offs this year.

The Cavaliers also are consuming a lion's share of the Cleveland sports dollar. It will be interesting to see how Indians ticket sales fare if the Cavaliers falter.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by WRnative

I also think that your Pittsburgh statistics reflect Pittsburgh's superior economy. E.g., manufacturing, still a key component of the Greater Cleveland economy, has been weakening sharply for the last several months.

https://www.advisorperspectives.com/...to-contraction

A real test will be whether the Indians can sell out their play-off dates. If not, given the sharply reduced capacity of Progressive Field, it will not bode well for Greater Cleveland's interest in the MLB product. However, it appears that remaining inventories are very limited.

Cleveland Indians American League Division Series tickets go on sale to the public Monday | cleveland.com

Also, it will be interesting to see what happens to season ticket sales for 2017 if the Indians can make a deep run into the play-offs this year.

The Cavaliers also are consuming a lion's share of the Cleveland sports dollar. It will be interesting to see how Indians ticket sales fare if the Cavaliers falter.

However, the Pirates game was in Milwaukee, not Pittsburgh. Milwaukee of all places, doesn't exactly have the greatest rep either.

A month ago I would have said "of course the playoffs will sell out" but now I'm not convinced. I think it's likely, but I'm still shocked they only get 13k on September 21. My hope is that the Indians play the Red Sox and I can go to a game in each city, so at least the tickets would still be available for the Cleveland games, and probably cheap. If I want to go to Fenway, I will have to stand in line for 3-4 hours to grab a single standing room ticket for the playoffs, for like $75.

[WRnative]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

However, the Pirates game was in Milwaukee, not Pittsburgh. Milwaukee of all places, doesn't exactly have the greatest rep either.

A month ago I would have said "of course the playoffs will sell out" but now I'm not convinced. I think it's likely, but I'm still shocked they only get 13k on September 21. My hope is that the Indians play the Red Sox and I can go to a game in each city, so at least the tickets would still be available for the Cleveland games, and probably cheap. If I want to go to Fenway, I will have to stand in line for 3-4 hours to grab a single standing room ticket for the playoffs, for like $75.

An advantage to living in Cleveland for baseball fans.

[teacherdad]

Seats for $10! 2nd row behind home plate $45-75 at times. Great park! You guys are LUCKY!!!! Hoping for a playoff game Oct. 7th as I'll land about 4:30.

[Urban Peasant]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

My hope is that the Indians play the Red Sox and I can go to a game in each city, so at least the tickets would still be available for the Cleveland games, and probably cheap.

That is one matchup I dread to even think about but perhaps not for the reasons someone would think of. The Red Sox are a truly formidable team and even more so in the postseason. They have the pitching, the offense, the fanbase, and most importantly the leadership and experience, especially in Ortiz and Pedroia, that many other teams lack which gives them the edge in so many ways. That latter part is especially important because too many teams take too many chances with the Sox and fall flat on their faces for it. It's too late to wish that the Sox would not make the playoffs because right now they obviously will but my hope would be they get dispatched by some other team like Texas who in turn will get dispatched by the Indians. Good wishing but there is always hope. If the Tribe does end up facing the Sox, they have the chance to defeat them but they had better know what they are doing because I do not ever want to see a repeat of the 2007 ALCS again .

[tgbwc]

Originally Posted by WRnative

In hindsight, the Dolans killed the Indians fan base with their penny-pinching, compounded by weak scouting/draft choices in the early 21st century. The Haslams are playing a similar, fan base-destroying game with the Browns, but the Haslams may have St. Louis Cardinals-like aspirations to cash in by selling/moving the Browns down the road.

By contrast, the Dolans have deep Cleveland roots and really want the Indians to succeed. IMO, the recent sale of a minority interest to a non-Clevelander does raise concerns.

I also think that your Pittsburgh statistics reflect Pittsburgh's superior economy. E.g., manufacturing, still a key component of the Greater Cleveland economy, has been weakening sharply for the last several months.

https://www.advisorperspectives.com/...to-contraction

A real test will be whether the Indians can sell out their play-off dates. If not, given the sharply reduced capacity of Progressive Field, it will not bode well for Greater Cleveland's interest in the MLB product. However, it appears that remaining inventories are very limited.

Cleveland Indians American League Division Series tickets go on sale to the public Monday | cleveland.com

Also, it will be interesting to see what happens to season ticket sales for 2017 if the Indians can make a deep run into the play-offs this year.

The Cavaliers also are consuming a lion's share of the Cleveland sports dollar. It will be interesting to see how Indians ticket sales fare if the Cavaliers falter.

I am also interested to see what this season does for next year's sales.

While this year's totals are still well below most teams in the league, 18 teams have seen a drop in attendance so far this year. Cleveland has an increased average of over 2,000 per game. It is up about 165,000 overall. I agree crowds have been smaller than I expected at this point but I expect the uptick to continue into next season.

[Cleveland_Collector]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

^ I guess I should also say that last night, the worst team in baseball by a long shot, Minnesota Twins, drew 21,599 to a game with a 64 degree high. The Twins had lost their previous 5 games too before last night. Now it's 6.

I must have posted this at least 10 times, but her I go again -- pro sports attendance is completely predicated on the sale of season tickets. This goes double for baseball, due to the sheer number of games. The Dolans and their "moneyball"/"catch lightning in a bottle approach" over the past 15 seasons has virtually killed off any desire the average fan might have had for laying down a couple of grand every season for, let's face it, a team that had sunk to AAA status in very recent history - i.e., Manny Acta as manager, Shelley Duncan, a couple of prospects and a couple of re-treads as everyday players doesn't exactly make fans giddy with excitement. Neither do 90+ loss seasons -- and, don't even get me started on dynamic ticket pricing. So, what you see is what you would expect in any medium market; the actual baseball fans (like myself) go to 20+ games per year. If they're good, the weekends add a 10,000 casual fan and family premium with the promo days being virtual sell outs. If they suck, they're only hope for a sell out is opening day because nobody feels obliged to go to the games. I recently heard that the Tribe has already sold 3,000 more season ticket packages than they did all of last season. With a deep run in the post-season and IF they keep the team more-or-less intact, my guess is they'll easily average 25k per game next season.

The Twins are right where the Indians were about 10 years ago. The novelty of Target field is wearing off, they're going on their fifth in six seasons of 90+ losses. Their attendance has seen a precipitous drop from 2011 (-14,000 per game) to today. If they keep up the cellar-dweller routine, they'll lose their season ticket base as well because the new ballpark premium is all but dead. Then, they can start multiple threads about it in the Minneapolis forum.

[bjimmy24]

Indians have been over 500 every year with Francona, who is the biggest names manager they could have gotten. We can blame the Dolans for a lot, but they got the best manager and had the people in place to assemble a fantastic pitching staff too. What a pick up Mike Napoli was as well.

The lack of season ticket holders also shows how it's just not a baseball town.