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Mark. Stop it. Seriously. I owned a technology company in CT from 1999 to 2003. I know the game. You are pretty much tax free, and don't have a fraction of the operating costs a brick and mortar business in CT does. So just give it up. Your big dilema is your income tax based on your schedule C.
Deal with local government for permits and license, property tax and insurance and then come talk to me. You don't have a friggin clue what running a business in CT requires. Tell me for one second that you have a DRS ID and file quarterly reports and I'll laugh in your face because you do NO business in CT and if you do it's 1% and tax free.
Your business is NOT in CT, just your mailing address.
I really don't see why you insist on trying to get in a pissing contest with me over my business experience or keep trying to delegitimize what I do. It seems to me I made smart decisions that led to me be unencumbered by the need for permits or licensure. You knew that was part of the business going in... It seems kind of silly to complain about it now. At the same time, these barriers to entry protect you from competition in a way my business is not protected. Everything has its advantages and disadvantages...
And for all of your complaining, Connecticut still seems to have one of the most stable small business climates in the country. I can't count how many businesses have been here and continue to operate successfully since I moved here at age 4 in 1978. My uncle has used the same gas company, dentist, lawn service and home improvement company for over 20 years. Why do so many companies have so much longevity here?
It is important to note that the new economy is here and --once again-- the plant is not reopening. The sooner Connecticut realizes this and adopts its economy AWAY from manufacturing the better. Once this happens things will improve.
Keep in mind, I am on your side. I want your family to have some financial breathing room. We just disagree about how to get there.
I really don't see why you insist on trying to get in a pissing contest with me over my business experience or keep trying to delegitimize what I do.
As you said in previous posts..."it's not about you". However, you make claims about doing business in CT when in reality you don't really DO business in CT. You can't have it both ways.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlassoff
It seems to me I made smart decisions that led to me be unencumbered by the need for permits or licensure.
Wait...here we go again. The rest of us made "stupid" decisons? OMG. So carpenters, plumbers, electricians etc are all "stuipid" because they have to deal with recent government requirements. Yea nevermind that generations of trades have been handed down...don't worry about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlassoff
You knew that was part of the business going in... It seems kind of silly to complain about it now. At the same time, these barriers to entry protect you from competition in a way my business is not protected. Everything has its advantages and disadvantages...
WHAT? You really are clueless and have never dealth with a town inspector. Yes there is code...but then there is "code". They rule. Nevermind ever increasing workers comp, tax code etc etc etc etc puke.
Barriers to entry? WTF are you talking about? Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. Morbi scelerisque. That's what you just said as it makes NO SENSE.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlassoff
My uncle has used the same gas company, dentist, lawn service and home improvement company for over 20 years. Why do so many companies have so much longevity here?
What you call stable, we call stagnant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlassoff
I want your family to have some financial breathing room. We just disagree about how to get there.
Yes you think higher taxes and bigger government are the answer. You seem to think you know better than I do how to best spend MY money.
Wait...so you think that the United States got where it is because they taxed more? Really? I have news for you that they never taught you in the government schools...we prospered and became the best nation on earth because we REJECTED excessive taxation!
What? JV, you're not a historian and just because "it feels right" doesn't make you narrative an attractive one. The country did alright under Eisenhower, race relations aside. Really, the vast majority of the country floundered under Bush despite all the "making it a business friendly nation." To add to that most job creation in the country for nearly 6 years was Retail and Constructing houses no one wanted to buy. Even with any gain, it was ALL lost in 2007-8, these are the cold facts. Hardly seems like a smashing success.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JViello
Mark. Stop it. Seriously. I owned a technology company in CT from 1999 to 2003. I know the game. You are pretty much tax free, and don't have a fraction of the operating costs a brick and mortar business in CT does. So just give it up. Your big dilema is your income tax based on your schedule C.
Deal with local government for permits and license, property tax and insurance and then come talk to me. You don't have a friggin clue what running a business in CT requires. Tell me for one second that you have a DRS ID and file quarterly reports and I'll laugh in your face because you do NO business in CT and if you do it's 1% and tax free.
Your business is NOT in CT, just your mailing address.
Take it from someone who a) has a parent directly dependent on the state of manufacturing and b) has studied many types of business to near excess... you have little clue outside of your ideological framing. You constantly talk about "job growth" elsewhere but the fact is, from reading manufacturing trade magazines, the picture isn't rosy by a long shot. Think taxes are a problem for this industry in CT? Try that demand worldwide cratered, electricity costs, and insurance premiums (the later two within some control of the State, but not by much). Labour costs? At least workers in CT tend to stay on for the long haul, with minimal training costs. Almost every conference I've seen/been to/heard barely touches on taxes or other marginal costs of business. Demand is number one right now and looks like it might be for a long while. In many other parts of the country those x factors add up to cost way more than taxes and premiums do here.
Not only that, but I'm a tradesman (among other professions) and the biggest problem right now is that demand simply evaporated, payments are getting later and later, etc. Not that taxes aren't a pain sometimes but the truth is for many many many many professionals and business owners in the State it is usually sixth or less on the priorities list.
As for town inspectors? Yes, CT's zoning regs are in dire need of an overhaul and more ways to file complaints about unscrupulous inspectors would probably be useful. A deal breaker though I find extremely hard to believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JViello
What you call stable, we call stagnant.
First, who is "we." Second, I take issue with the "dynamism v. stability" framing. Both are important, though stability creates the most predictable outcome. Which, understandably, is what drives bulk of the the economy. No one would want to invest anything if there was only a slim chance you'd make money on anything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JViello
Yes you think higher taxes and bigger government are the answer. You seem to think you know better than I do how to best spend MY money.
And you seem to think you know what's best for MY money. The difference is that I have more supporting my side.
Mlassof,
I disagree with you on one point. I've said it before and I'll say it again: manufacturing in CT is far from dead. It's position as a possible mass employer probably is for the foreseeable future is though. If CT makes serious strides in combating a couple specific problems (brownfield laws, electricity rates, insurance premiums, state permitting red tape) it will become a very attractive place to set up shop despite high taxes and COL. The thing I really believe though is that we should see what is happening in those supposedly high-growth areas of the country earnestly and take the best parts and leave out the worst parts (overly subsidising operations, largely retail, for the hope of any job no matter the quality).
Yankeerose,
Despite you not thinking it's a handout, that's exactly what you're asking for. The suburban boom was and still is nothing short of a massive government handout on many many levels. You want the low taxes and are willing to live in an area that benefits from others hard work to provide the quality of services you expect. That's your right. But to turn around and point you finger at someone else just, who is probably taking in a bit less than yourself, smacks of incredible hypocrisy.
We can go round the block for months. Its really not inportant who finds high taxes acceptable & who doesn't. Whats important is that they keep going up for no apparent reason whatsoever. We had all the govt services & programs needed to run our state for generations. Theres more people now but that shouldn't matter unless its to make the individual burden less. We had poor people 30 years ago in CT but they didn't starve then & we have poor now that dont starve, we had sufficient govt then to run things & we have sufficient govt today to run things.
I'm done with this thread because its obvious that theres two camps set in their ways, one that realizes the state has been acting like a chemically imballanced housewife on a shopping spree for much too long & one that thinks the only problem is her husband isn't giving her enough money.
On a parting note I'll just add that while all of the legislators I'v spoken to continuously stress the NEED for more tax money to balance the budget none has been able to say that their constituents ASKED for more taxes. If we havent asked them to raise taxes then I think its clear that they should find another way to fix the mess they created.
You guys have fun, this debate is as pointless as higher taxes.
"http://www.courant.com/community/hartford/hc-afscme-public-unions-0223-20110223,0,5971725,print.story
"HARTFORD — Hundreds of union members and their allies gathered on the Capitol grounds Wednesday afternoon in an act of solidarity with public employees in Wisconsin.
But most of the men and women at the rally were far more concerned with hard choices in Hartford than with political capers in Madison. Several state workers said they hoped to send a message to Democratic Gov. Dannel P. Malloy that they should not bear the brunt of his call for "shared sacrifice" as he strives to close a budget gap estimated to be as high as $3.7 billion.
Malloy, in addressing the rally, had a message in return: "We may not always agree, you and I ... but we can sit down around a table, we can negotiate agreements, we can ask for compromises"
Lets see 2 bill of 3.5 bill is the majority, but Danny said he can "ask" for compromises. Since his address, has he indicated the alternative to failure to gather said savings? Deadlines for the unions to comply? Potential dates for alternative measures?
He is doing beautifully at increasing his union campaign coffers, up the road, no doubt. By this time, both Christie and Cuomo had started making their demands, and potential counter-measures, clear. By this time, priavte employers would have indicated when the WARN notices would start, barring complete compliance with the modest request from the unions. His comments on morning Joe concerning taxation show Malloy views the tax bar as vs only bordering states, while smart governors know the world is their competitor. When UTC says ABC is their policy and we know its meaning, and brags that Ct based subsidiaries have larger footprints elsewhere, and talks of increasing its percentage of facilities in low cost regions, its showing the competition for UTC Ct jobs is not just Massachusetts, NY, and NJ. Its states such as Georgia, also, where Lou Dobbs on his CNN said, noted a deal during Sikorsky strike where UTc bought tens of thousands of acres..surely just for exec getaway spas and such, right (sar)!
Think of how "well (sarcastic)" Malloy's interviews play when viewed by UTC, AETNA, or CBIA decision makers. Given that DM indicated jobs were his first priority, those 3 very important players, should be his target audience. The two corps are a microcosm no doubt of all other major players, as is the CBIA.
Beeker2211:"I disagree with you on one point. I've said it before and I'll say it again: manufacturing in CT is far from dead. It's position as a possible mass employer probably is for the foreseeable future is though. If CT makes serious strides in combating a couple specific problems (brownfield laws, electricity rates, insurance premiums, state permitting red tape) it will become a very attractive place to set up shop despite high taxes and COL."
Manufacturing in Ct, outboard of government dependent entities, whether direct contract or type of manufacturing involved, has been pretty much Dead for decades. One can count the quantity of triple digit facilities in any metro area serving the private sector (whether commodity or equipment) w/o taxing anyones math ability, and this segment used to do quite well, and still does in many regions. Kilowatt costs per hour, labor costs, workers comp, regulation, etc, all well documented and compared in the previously linked State Competitiveness handbook I posted. Within driving distance of me, high3/low 4 figure facilities (headcount) are actively assembling consumer products (electronics), home water heaters, air conditioning units-both home and commercial, ball valves (the latter hits home well as a deceased aunt worked at Jenkins Valves in Bridgeport several decades, and today its the Baseball Field, with a "slight" (sar) drop in average compensation.
Ct used to compete well in manufacturing even in segments where cost plus was not the basis of revenue. That group is at the heart of the State Competitiveness book. Ct kept a good deal of manufacturing that its two senior Senators could keep work flowing to, but with 2 juniors, that segment is going to take hits, as where things go is very political. That leaves the manufacturing quantity of jobs tied largely to what happens in Cts' non cost plus segment for years to come.
'm done with this thread because its obvious that theres two camps set in their ways, one that realizes the state has been acting like a chemically imballanced housewife on a shopping spree for much too long & one that thinks the only problem is her husband isn't giving her enough money.
This is hilarious and really hits the nail on the head.
Bobtn, you know a lot about our state! I guess you lived here at some point? My parents live in TN and have done well there.
All I can say for me, it doesn't matter what people on the internet think. I have tax receipts that tell me all I need to know. For us, we were doing better in Virginia than here. I would never tell other people not to move to CT or to move away from here. I can only speak for us.
Sure we could live here for the next 10 years and do okay. But I'm seriously scared for our future. I know there is no way we could retire here. My accountant is fantastic and we get every deduction we can which is not much.
I never came here looking to live in a mansion. I just want to know that I'm not going to be in the poor house and struggling.
Another thing to keep in mind with a higher cost of living state, your savings doesn't go as far. Sounds obvious but I didn't realize that until we were here. What 6 months savings now becomes 3-4 months.
We don't have family here. We don't have kids in school. I have two retired parents who I have to worry about who don't want to move here. We are doing worse financially than we were two years ago. It just makes no sense to stay here any more.
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So carpenters, plumbers, electricians etc are all "stuipid" because they have to deal with recent government requirements. Yea nevermind that generations of trades have been handed down...don't worry about that.
