[Weird Tolkienish Figure]

I read that CT hasn't created a single net job since 1990. (Coincidentally the same year the income tax was enacted).

[JayCT]

Originally Posted by bobtn

A leader would turn down a project without a good ROI. Malloy didn't; therefore DM is not a leader. Why would you not expect your governor to lead?

CC didn't exactly assist his 2016 Presidential aspirations by being friendly with Obama post Sandy, but his state needed aid fast, Obama acted fast, and CC threw politics out the window by leading.

Danny followed-he didn't lead. Expect more.

You can only say this because you feel that they project does not have a "good return on investment". That is highly subjective. If you go strictly by numbers, no mass transit project would be a good return on investment. It has to be looked at on a very long term basis. A good example of this here in Connecticut is Shoreline East serving New Haven. 10 years ago Rowland was ready to scrap the service but could not because of obligations relating to the Q Bridge which actually forced the state to improve service. Today ridership is growing as more people are changing their commuting habits and using it. The same will happen in Hartford.

It is also kind of funny that you use Chris Cristy as an example. He killed a major transportation project that also did not have a good short term return on investment, the new Hudson River train tunnel. That project would have allowed direct train access into Manhattan for thousands of northern New Jersey commuters everyday who now must change trains. On paper the project was expensive and in the short term made little sense but now think about the long term future and the thousands of people everyday impacted by this. 50 years from now it will be looked back on as a very bad decision.

Transportation projects are very long term commitments and take years to realize their true worth and "bean counters" cannot see that. It is truly frustrating and downright stupid. This is a major flaw in the thinking of our generation. Everything must be an instant return on investment. Very sad. Jay

[DarkWolf]

Originally Posted by MikefromCT

Agreed. This would have gotten far more usage and, therefore, been more economically sustainable. Apparently we're supposed to be included as a stop on the Springfield-New Haven rail but I Haven't really heard this as a definite, which is a shame.

They decided to go Half build on the Knowledge Corridor project , so instead of the New Stations in North Haven , Newington , and Enfield you will only be getting Flatbush Ave or West Hartford. The Full double track , Connecticut River Bridge replacement and Electrification will not happen for another 10 years along with New Haven Line style service. The Full build for entire Knowledge Corridor from New Haven to Brattleboro will cost about 1.4 billion and include all those stations in CT that are not being built along with relocated stations in Windsor Locks. New Stations have been proposed in the North End of Hartford , Fair Haven , Longmeadow ,Springfield Riverfront , Chicopee , South Deerfield and Deerfield. The Massachusetts and Vermont section full build are full funded , that includes station or transportation center construction , track and bridge replacement and rolling stock. Until CT goes full build , North of Springfield will be a few round trips a day which is a disservice to those towns. CT seems to pushing the 1.4 Billion in MNRR upgrades , full build and with extensions , same with Shore Line East. I think they'll eventually go Full build on the Knowledge Corridor.

[HeadedWest]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

The Full build for entire Knowledge Corridor from New Haven to Brattleboro ...

Okay, I get Knowledge and New Haven. But Brattleboro???

[7 Wishes]

Originally Posted by JayCT

You can only say this because you feel that they project does not have a "good return on investment". That is highly subjective. If you go strictly by numbers, no mass transit project would be a good return on investment. It has to be looked at on a very long term basis. A good example of this here in Connecticut is Shoreline East serving New Haven. 10 years ago Rowland was ready to scrap the service but could not because of obligations relating to the Q Bridge which actually forced the state to improve service. Today ridership is growing as more people are changing their commuting habits and using it. The same will happen in Hartford.

It is also kind of funny that you use Chris Cristy as an example. He killed a major transportation project that also did not have a good short term return on investment, the new Hudson River train tunnel. That project would have allowed direct train access into Manhattan for thousands of northern New Jersey commuters everyday who now must change trains. On paper the project was expensive and in the short term made little sense but now think about the long term future and the thousands of people everyday impacted by this. 50 years from now it will be looked back on as a very bad decision.

Transportation projects are very long term commitments and take years to realize their true worth and "bean counters" cannot see that. It is truly frustrating and downright stupid. This is a major flaw in the thinking of our generation. Everything must be an instant return on investment. Very sad. Jay

Well said, if I could rep you on this one (again it wants me to spread it around), I would.

There is hope with NJ though.....CC said he would approve a cheaper plan to bring the 7 train subway under the Hudson to the NJ Transit terminus in Hoboken. Not as good a solution as the original plan since it's still 2 trains, but much better than the status quo.

I don't know if having the subway go out of the NYC borders would mean more government bodies involved to cause hassles, (there was a plan I think in the 1920s and 30s to possibly extend some of the Bronx subways into lower Westchester, and part of why it didn't happen was a fear that it would mean more "cooks to ruin the broth" in terms of more gov't agencies coming into play), but it wouldn't be unprecedented; the Washington DC subway goes through parts of both Maryland and Virginia......and of course the PATH already crosses NY and NJ as a "subway".

[bobtn]

Originally Posted by JayCT

You can only say this because you feel that they project does not have a "good return on investment". That is highly subjective

ROI is objective, and while mass transit is always subsidized, the percentage on some projects paid by itself greatly exceeds others. Malloy messed up.

[htfdcolt]

Originally Posted by JayCT

You can only say this because you feel that they project does not have a "good return on investment". That is highly subjective. If you go strictly by numbers, no mass transit project would be a good return on investment. It has to be looked at on a very long term basis. A good example of this here in Connecticut is Shoreline East serving New Haven. 10 years ago Rowland was ready to scrap the service but could not because of obligations relating to the Q Bridge which actually forced the state to improve service. Today ridership is growing as more people are changing their commuting habits and using it. The same will happen in Hartford.

It is also kind of funny that you use Chris Cristy as an example. He killed a major transportation project that also did not have a good short term return on investment, the new Hudson River train tunnel. That project would have allowed direct train access into Manhattan for thousands of northern New Jersey commuters everyday who now must change trains. On paper the project was expensive and in the short term made little sense but now think about the long term future and the thousands of people everyday impacted by this. 50 years from now it will be looked back on as a very bad decision.

Transportation projects are very long term commitments and take years to realize their true worth and "bean counters" cannot see that. It is truly frustrating and downright stupid. This is a major flaw in the thinking of our generation. Everything must be an instant return on investment. Very sad. Jay

Jay--I agree that ROI is subjective, but one can and should question the underlying project assumptions in terms of ridership, and where the rest of the country/world is going. What has succeeded in terms of changing commuter behavior is light rail (Portland, Minneapolis, San Jose) or other forms of train service. The Euclid Av corridor in Cleveland is often cited as an example for the CT busway, which is truly an apples to oranges comparison. The Cleveland busway was built by modifying an existing major road, between University Circle and downtown, with multiple employment centers at either terminus.

I hope for the taxpayers' sake that the busway proves even halfway successful, but I remain extremely skeptical. Even the WH mayor Slifka has gone on record as not being in favor of it.

[hartford_renter]

Originally Posted by JayCT

You can only say this because you feel that they project does not have a "good return on investment". That is highly subjective. If you go strictly by numbers, no mass transit project would be a good return on investment. It has to be looked at on a very long term basis. A good example of this here in Connecticut is Shoreline East serving New Haven. 10 years ago Rowland was ready to scrap the service but could not because of obligations relating to the Q Bridge which actually forced the state to improve service. Today ridership is growing as more people are changing their commuting habits and using it. The same will happen in Hartford.

It is also kind of funny that you use Chris Cristy as an example. He killed a major transportation project that also did not have a good short term return on investment, the new Hudson River train tunnel. That project would have allowed direct train access into Manhattan for thousands of northern New Jersey commuters everyday who now must change trains. On paper the project was expensive and in the short term made little sense but now think about the long term future and the thousands of people everyday impacted by this. 50 years from now it will be looked back on as a very bad decision.

Transportation projects are very long term commitments and take years to realize their true worth and "bean counters" cannot see that. It is truly frustrating and downright stupid. This is a major flaw in the thinking of our generation. Everything must be an instant return on investment. Very sad. Jay

Jay,

Everyone knows that the transit along I95 needs to be improved and that is a worthy project. The bus from New Britain to Hartford, not so much.

However our government is inefficient and political. Malloy has raised taxes increased spending 20% and added more debt than any other governor in state history.

[waccamatt]

Connecticut is a beautiful state and one of the wealthiest in the country. Texas has nothing; NOTHING on you.

[MikefromCT]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

They decided to go Half build on the Knowledge Corridor project , so instead of the New Stations in North Haven , Newington , and Enfield you will only be getting Flatbush Ave or West Hartford. The Full double track , Connecticut River Bridge replacement and Electrification will not happen for another 10 years along with New Haven Line style service. The Full build for entire Knowledge Corridor from New Haven to Brattleboro will cost about 1.4 billion and include all those stations in CT that are not being built along with relocated stations in Windsor Locks. New Stations have been proposed in the North End of Hartford , Fair Haven , Longmeadow ,Springfield Riverfront , Chicopee , South Deerfield and Deerfield. The Massachusetts and Vermont section full build are full funded , that includes station or transportation center construction , track and bridge replacement and rolling stock. Until CT goes full build , North of Springfield will be a few round trips a day which is a disservice to those towns. CT seems to pushing the 1.4 Billion in MNRR upgrades , full build and with extensions , same with Shore Line East. I think they'll eventually go Full build on the Knowledge Corridor.

Go figure. I knew this would happen.