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A determined person is going to do what they're going to do. I get that. If those CT laws had been in place and Adam Lanza was determined enough he could have just made the 2 hour round trip to New Hampshire to get magazines.
Massacres in schools and in public have skyrocketed relative to what they were 40 years ago. They used to NEVER happen, or happen once a decade. Now they happen every year, sometimes several times a year and it's been that way since the 1990s. A school shooting will not even make news anymore unless double digits are killed.
We can't attack the problem if we completely disregard the tool. Maybe if we make large capacity magazines a little more difficult to acquire, then it will be that much more difficult to engage these killings. I'm not saying gun control is the only solution but I'm at least willing to have the conversation to deal with the larger problem which are these massacres.
There is also media coverage - which should be addressed.
There is also mental health & depression - which should be addressed.
There are improvements that can be made in security procedures - which should happen.
There are also legal changes we can make on the liability side - which should be addressed.
There are also gun regulations - which need to be part of the solution.
There are also a cultural shift that should happen so depressed or crazy kids don't think the answer to their problem is going out in a blaze of violence.
I'm not saying gun regulations alone are the solution that balance the equation but they are PART of it. I'm also saying that I don't understand what the hell the fear is. Our rights are very well protected even under Connecticut's scenario. Heck, I have a relative that lives in Austria - and they have VERY strict gun regulations although you CAN still own one. They make you take a psychological test before issuing a concealed carry license.
It's an insult to the victims to do nothing. It would be as if a preventable fire consumed a building and we said... we don't need to look at building safety codes. Property owners have a right to keep their building as they see fit!
These mass shooting occurrences are preventable and used to rarely happen.
Obviously we are doing something. Take a look at the violent crime statistics provided by the CDC for the last 20-30 years. Violent crime is on a downward slide, and can you believe it, with more firearms in the general populace.
What do large capacity mags have to do with it ? Limit it to a 10 round mag and someone will just duct tape them together ...bam instant 20 rounder. Limit it to 5 round mag and bam they are small and easy to carry a bunch of them. A mag change is mili seconds... someone can do it while running , walking or re aquireing a target.
And please, do tell. How are mass shootings preventable ? Maybe you are on to something...please share. And I'm sure you meant mass murders, because regardless of the tool used it still is a tragic thing.
Obviously we are doing something. Take a look at the violent crime statistics provided by the CDC for the last 20-30 years. Violent crime is on a downward slide, and can you believe it, with more firearms in the general populace.
What do large capacity mags have to do with it ? Limit it to a 10 round mag and someone will just duct tape them together ...bam instant 20 rounder. Limit it to 5 round mag and bam they are small and easy to carry a bunch of them. A mag change is mili seconds... someone can do it while running , walking or re aquireing a target.
And please, do tell. How are mass shootings preventable ? Maybe you are on to something...please share. And I'm sure you meant mass murders, because regardless of the tool used it still is a tragic thing.
Yes, violent crime is down, but these spree shooting massacres like the Washington Navy Yard, UC Santa Barbara shooting, Newtown, etc... are up exponentially - from 1 every 5 years to several annually. Charles Whitman sniped people from the UT Tower, but there were no copycats of that. Columbine happens and there are dozens of copycats. Something's going on.
I listed the various factors which all need to be looked at. I don't have all the answers but acting as if the guns don't matter is ridiculous.
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with more firearms in the general populace.
I think the number of households with guns is actually down, from around 50% to 40%, but there are more guns per capita which indicates the same people are just buying more guns.
Like I said before, guns are not the total problem nor are they the total solution, but they are obviously a factor and need to be part of the solution.
A determined person is going to do what they're going to do. I get that. If those CT laws had been in place and Adam Lanza was determined enough he could have just made the 2 hour round trip to New Hampshire to get magazines.
Massacres in schools and in public have skyrocketed relative to what they were 40 years ago. They used to NEVER happen, or happen once a decade. Now they happen every year, sometimes several times a year and it's been that way since the 1990s. A school shooting will not even make news anymore unless double digits are killed.
We can't attack the problem if we completely disregard the tool. Maybe if we make large capacity magazines a little more difficult to acquire, then it will be that much more difficult to engage these killings. I'm not saying gun control is the only solution but I'm at least willing to have the conversation to deal with the larger problem which are these massacres.
There is also media coverage - which should be addressed.
There is also mental health & depression - which should be addressed.
There are improvements that can be made in security procedures - which should happen.
There are also legal changes we can make on the liability side - which should be addressed.
There are also gun regulations - which need to be part of the solution.
There are also a cultural shift that should happen so depressed or crazy kids don't think the answer to their problem is going out in a blaze of violence.
I'm not saying gun regulations alone are the solution that balance the equation but they are PART of it. I'm also saying that I don't understand what the hell the fear is. Our rights are very well protected even under Connecticut's scenario. Heck, I have a relative that lives in Austria - and they have VERY strict gun regulations although you CAN still own one. They make you take a psychological test before issuing a concealed carry license.
It's an insult to the victims to do nothing. It would be as if a preventable fire consumed a building and we said... we don't need to look at building safety codes. Property owners have a right to keep their building as they see fit!
These mass shooting occurrences are preventable and used to rarely happen. Some of you are taking the line of logic as if bad, illegal things happen so we should not have laws at at all. Murders still happen. Does that mean we should just abolish laws against murder because some people still murder? I don't think you guys are anarchists. For whatever reason, though, the gun issue makes Americans unreasonable. It's really hard to understand, I don't have the attachment to weapons and don't have the emotional connection between a weapon and freedom. Other countries have freedom too and at least a psych eval before you buy a weapon. It doesn't make them un-free. People here are making a leap from gun safety codes to totalitarian dictatorships.
It looks like I'll have to address this post twice since you edited it while I was in the middle of responding previously. As I look at it again though this really stood out:
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Like I said before, do you prefer we do nothing?
We've go to do something- even if it accomplishes nothing. At least we'll be able to say we did something- right? The sheeple really eat that up, eh?
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I'm also saying that I don't understand what the hell the fear is.
The fear is quite obvious really. Newton happened and there was a massive cry for gun control. Lanza violated something like 20 laws before he even pulled the trigger. Maybe the 21st law would have stopped him, right? So all the gun laws we had already didn't stop that shooting so of course the answer is we need more similar laws. Then we add those new post Newton laws and another shooting takes place. Then the liberals come back with....guess what...we need more laws. Then when those new laws are proven to be ineffective we then of course need more new laws. It's obvious and well documented that every time gun control is shown to be ineffective the "solution" is more laws.
We law abiding gun owners have given up a ton over the years and when gun control is proven to be ineffective they still come back for more. It's obvious that this will never stop.
It looks like I'll have to address this post twice since you edited it while I was in the middle of responding previously. As I look at it again though this really stood out:
We've go to do something- even if it accomplishes nothing. At least we'll be able to say we did something- right? The sheeple really eat that up, eh?
The fear is quite obvious really. Newton happened and there was a massive cry for gun control. Lanza violated something like 20 laws before he even pulled the trigger. Maybe the 21st law would have stopped him, right? So all the gun laws we had already didn't stop that shooting so of course the answer is we need more similar laws. Then we add those new post Newton laws and another shooting takes place. Then the liberals come back with....guess what...we need more laws. Then when those new laws are proven to be ineffective we then of course need more new laws. It's obvious and well documented that every time gun control is shown to be ineffective the "solution" is more laws.
We law abiding gun owners have given up a ton over the years and when gun control is proven to be ineffective they still come back for more. It's obvious that this will never stop.
Yeah, that's why I don't agree with everything liberals say on the subject because guns are not the sole factor. Most of the guns used in these massacres would have been legal purchases even in strict gun control counties, so it needs to be a more comprehensive approach that looks at mental health, media coverage, etc... and legislative acts alone are probably enough, although political leaders could provide the leadership.
I don't really see what gun owners have "given up." My grandparents owned hunting rifles and I can still buy those but now I have a lot more choices. Military-style weapons were not really a big part of the civilian weapons market until the past few decades. Even the NRA was not always a political organization more of a sports enthusiast organization not that much different then a skiing lobby not that long ago. They perceive this assault when it seems to me the small arms market has greatly increased in size and scope, not become more restrictive.
Yes, violent crime is down, but these spree shooting massacres like the Washington Navy Yard, UC Santa Barbara shooting, Newtown, etc... are up exponentially - from 1 every 5 years to several annually. Charles Whitman sniped people from the UT Tower, but there were no copycats of that. Columbine happens and there are dozens of copycats. Something's going on.
I listed the various factors which all need to be looked at. I don't have all the answers but acting as if the guns don't matter is ridiculous.
I think the number of households with guns is actually down, from around 50% to 40%, but there are more guns per capita which indicates the same people are just buying more guns.
Like I said before, guns are not the total problem nor are they the total solution, but they are obviously a factor and need to be part of the solution.
I absolutely agree somethings going on. I've said it many times before, why are people not coping ? What is causing them to snap. You can't fix the problem without addressing the root cause.
As far as gun ownership down, I'll have to disagree with you on that one as well. Just going on the CPL permit spike in Michigan that past few years proves that. Sure some might have been firearms owners all along but not all. I know I've introduced at least 10 people in my circle of friends to firearms ownership and a permit to carry. Michigan can't be the only state that this has happened in. In Michigan, gun seekers line up for permits
I agree, something has to be done. But until there is a solid common sense solution that actually does something, that will not violate the rights of the law abiding , I will fight it tooth and nail.
Yeah, that's why I don't agree with everything liberals say on the subject because guns are not the sole factor. Most of the guns used in these massacres would have been legal purchases even in strict gun control counties, so it needs to be a more comprehensive approach that looks at mental health, media coverage, etc... and legislative acts alone are probably enough, although political leaders could provide the leadership.
I don't really see what gun owners have "given up." My grandparents owned hunting rifles and I can still buy those but now I have a lot more choices. Military-style weapons were not really a big part of the civilian weapons market until the past few decades. Even the NRA was not always a political organization more of a sports enthusiast organization not that much different then a skiing lobby not that long ago. They perceive this assault when it seems to me the small arms market has greatly increased in size and scope, not become more restrictive.
You don't see what gun owners have given up? The list is long. You can start with the gun control act of 1968 and go from there. Then you have all the state laws that have been passed.
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Military-style weapons were not really a big part of the civilian weapons market until the past few decades.
You don't see what gun owners have given up? The list is long. You can start with the gun control act of 1968 and go from there. Then you have all the state laws that have been passed.
The biggest issue in the gun control debate is that most people in the debate really have no idea what they're talking about.
There is nothing wrong with marksmanship competitions or encouraging marksmanship as a sport. The gun control act of 1968 prohibits sale to criminals, mentally ill, and created some licensing. Seriously, you have a problem with that?
People start off in such extremes with gun owners acting as if some mass confiscation is next on the agenda so they're unwilling to even discuss any measures. The people who want to confiscate all guns are miniscule in number.
People in other countries do not have this debate and it's incomprehensible to them that we do. In America we argue about such stupid, petty stuff like this, instead of oh, the economy and things that are important. When I bought my rifle it was easy. The hardest part about it was the saving the $800.
DOUGLASVILLE, Ga. — A gunman has shot seven people, killing five of them, in a subdivision west of Atlanta.
Police: 7 people shot, 5 dead in Georgia shooting - The Washington Post
Five people were killed, including several children. And these people were killed not only because this guy was mentally-ill... These people were killed because this guy have a license and gun! I'm not against all weapons, but i'm against weapons in hands of average citizens, which think that they will never use their guns wrong!
People, time to understand, that gun under your pillow will bring more harm than good.
This was a domestic dispute between this guy and his estranged wife and her boyfriend. Nothing to do with a license, nor was mental illness indicated.
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