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Old 10-24-2008, 10:01 AM
 
Location: Texas
38,859 posts, read 25,550,307 times
Reputation: 24780

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike from back east View Post
Dude, you just said a 10-gallon hat full of truth.

I'm relishing the tidal wave that will sweep out tons of GOP flotsam, hoping for a DEM super-majority in the Senate.

My entire adult life, I've voted Republican. I always thought they were the guys who would watch the purse strings, manage the economy, hold back government intrusion and follow a moderate international policy. I donated to the GOP in the past, feeling confident that they were reasonable and concerned with pursuing the national interest.

Well, I'm no longer asleep.

Now, they're wildly irrepsonsible with spending, taxes, regulation, and foreign policy. They've driven the country into a deep ditch. They've catered to mindless religious freaks. They've betrayed everything they've claimed they stood for. They've stabbed the middle class squarely in the back. And they're trying to shield themselves under a blanket of fear-mongering.

Screw 'em.

Eternally.

I'll never vote GOP again. They've earned decades on the sidelines, as far as I'm concerned.
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Old 10-24-2008, 10:02 AM
 
31,683 posts, read 41,050,316 times
Reputation: 14434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
My entire adult life, I've voted Republican. I always thought they were the guys who would watch the purse strings, manage the economy, hold back government intrusion and follow a moderate international policy. I donated to the GOP in the past, feeling confident that they were reasonable and concerned with pursuing the national interest.

Well, I'm no longer asleep.

Now, they're wildly irrepsonsible with spending, taxes, regulation, and foreign policy. They've driven the country into a deep ditch. They've catered to mindless religious freaks. They've betrayed everything they've claimed they stood for. They've stabbed the middle class squarely in the back. And they're trying to shield themselves under a blanket of fear-mongering.

Screw 'em.

Eternally.

I'll never vote GOP again. They've earned decades on the sidelines, as far as I'm concerned.
Hopefully the party will be reinvented as the Democrats had to do.
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Old 10-24-2008, 10:09 AM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,196,176 times
Reputation: 3696
Quote:
Originally Posted by highdesertmutz View Post
I should write something caustic, incidiary, and degrading, then a moderator will close the thread.
well, it's been apparent that the republican party hasn't exactly been in love with McSame throughout the campaign, McSame slammed bushka yesterday, people must be wondering, how does a republican candidate distance him/her self from a party from which neither has lost any love for? McSame is pretty much between a rock and a hard place. maybe only if McSame hadn't voted with bushka so many times, 90+% of the time, and distanced himself from this administration long ago, maybe he would actually have a chance of winning the election, but now that he has been painted as a bush supporter, the average American is, really trying to figure him out. people like him and respect him, but he's such a flippity-flopper, nobody can say what he might do, once elected, and, this might be possibly why Obama is pulling ahead in the polls? I watched a special about McSame last night, and, he is not fully to blame for the way he voted on some bills, as we all know, many bills have trash attached to them, and the people who should be voting no for something are often forced to vote yes, to try to get the bills passed. as for me, if I were president, I would support line item veto.
Well lets not and say you did.

You make some very good points that I think were mentioned earlier. McCain has had an uphill battle long before the primaries even started.

Seen as an outsider to his own party while at the same time running on a tarnished brand name. If he attacks Bush, then he gains the middle, if he doesn't, then he keeps the right and loses the middle. He was in a no win situation to begin with, and to add to that the economic crisis to which he himself has admitted being weak in his understanding and the fact he is a legislator that has voted on a variety of bills that have come back to bite him, I think he was just doomed from day one.

After almost two years of campaigning, he and his campaign are tired and exhausted, fragmented, and now apparently at odds with itself and looking to lay blame. I bet there is no one on the planet that wants to see this election end sooner than John McCain.

When I issue warnings to Democrats about the dangers of power and believing ones own PR, I just think back to John McCain of 2000 to now, and see what effects this can have on an honorable man saturated in swill and surrounded by hordes of people already wanting to throw him under the bus.

I heard a rumor, yes a rumor! that Palin was overheard saying she would consider a bid for 2012 on the top of the ticket. Now if there is any clearer example of believing ones own BS, then that would be it.
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Old 10-24-2008, 10:12 AM
 
22,278 posts, read 21,737,640 times
Reputation: 54735
Quote:
Originally Posted by domergurl View Post
Has it ever been brought to light who, in fact, forced McCain to take on Sarah Palin????
"The Insiders: How John McCain Came to Pick Sarah Palin"

It appears the idea was first floated by right wing pundits (Barnes, Kristol) then taken up by Dick Morris and the lobbyists inside the Mccain campaign.

Quote:
Finally, McCain’s top aides, including Steve Schmidt and Rick Davis, converged on Palin. Ed Rogers, the chairman of B.G.R., a well-connected, largely Republican lobbying firm, said, “Her criteria kept popping out. She was a governor—that’s good. The shorter the Washington résumé the better. A female is better still. And then there was her story.†He admitted, “There was concern that she was a novice.†In addition to Schmidt and Davis, Charles R. Black, Jr., the lobbyist and political operative who is McCain’s chief campaign adviser, reportedly favored Palin. Keene said, “I’m told that Charlie Black told McCain, ‘If you pick anyone else, you’re going to lose. But if you pick Palin you may win.’ †(Black did not return calls for comment.) Meanwhile, McCain’s longtime friend said, “Kristol was out there shaking the pom-poms.â€
Rove wanted Romney. McCain really wanted Lieberman, but was told by this crew that there would be a floor fight at the GOP convention if a social conservative was not chosen.
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Old 10-24-2008, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Home is where the heart is
15,402 posts, read 28,954,632 times
Reputation: 19090
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post

When I issue warnings to Democrats about the dangers of power and believing ones own PR, I just think back to John McCain of 2000 to now, and see what effects this can have on an honorable man saturated in swill and surrounded by hordes of people already wanting to throw him under the bus.
Yet another great post from you Tn. I especially liked this paragraph. Yes indeed, this same fate can happen to the dems. Believing your own PR is a particularly fatal trap. I sincerely hope we can avoid it.
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Old 10-24-2008, 11:00 AM
 
Location: alt reality
1,085 posts, read 2,233,912 times
Reputation: 937
Quote:
Originally Posted by zentropa View Post
"The Insiders: How John McCain Came to Pick Sarah Palin"

It appears the idea was first floated by right wing pundits (Barnes, Kristol) then taken up by Dick Morris and the lobbyists inside the Mccain campaign.



Rove wanted Romney. McCain really wanted Lieberman, but was told by this crew that there would be a floor fight at the GOP convention if a social conservative was not chosen.
That's pretty interesting. But doesn't McCain have the absolute final say so?...or does he? I mean, everybody was on Barack's ass about choosing Hillary and he didn't and as it turns out, he didn't need to. LOL at Charlie Black. McCain should have told him where to go.
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Old 10-24-2008, 11:09 AM
 
Location: Home is where the heart is
15,402 posts, read 28,954,632 times
Reputation: 19090
Quote:
Originally Posted by ParkerP View Post
That's pretty interesting. But doesn't McCain have the absolute final say so?...or does he?
Well, that's the way it's supposed to work. But I personally believe he was strongarmed by the GOP, just like he was for a number of other choices.

The most telling moment in McCain's campaign, IMO, came early on when the GOP pushed him to vote the party line... even if it meant voting against a bill prohibiting waterboarding. Before that day he was well known for taking a public stand against torturing prisoners. But he was told that if he wanted a chance at POTUS he'd better be a good boy and follow orders... and he obeyed. Like a good doggie.

It's hard to believe, as he was a torture victim himself.

On the day the Intelligence Authorization Bill came to the floor, McCain sneaked into the chamber, voted with his party against it, and sneaked back out. I almost felt sorry for him. Except I didn't.
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Old 10-24-2008, 11:12 AM
 
31,683 posts, read 41,050,316 times
Reputation: 14434
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Well lets not and say you did.

You make some very good points that I think were mentioned earlier. McCain has had an uphill battle long before the primaries even started.

Seen as an outsider to his own party while at the same time running on a tarnished brand name. If he attacks Bush, then he gains the middle, if he doesn't, then he keeps the right and loses the middle. He was in a no win situation to begin with, and to add to that the economic crisis to which he himself has admitted being weak in his understanding and the fact he is a legislator that has voted on a variety of bills that have come back to bite him, I think he was just doomed from day one.

After almost two years of campaigning, he and his campaign are tired and exhausted, fragmented, and now apparently at odds with itself and looking to lay blame. I bet there is no one on the planet that wants to see this election end sooner than John McCain.

When I issue warnings to Democrats about the dangers of power and believing ones own PR, I just think back to John McCain of 2000 to now, and see what effects this can have on an honorable man saturated in swill and surrounded by hordes of people already wanting to throw him under the bus.

I heard a rumor, yes a rumor! that Palin was overheard saying she would consider a bid for 2012 on the top of the ticket. Now if there is any clearer example of believing ones own BS, then that would be it.
John has not been surrounded by loyal people. At least with Lieberman he would have had that. I was a big supporter of his in 2000 and a year ago he was still my choice for this time around. Had it been Clinton v McCain not sure what I would have done. I would probably eventually of come around for Hillary as McCain sold his soul to the children of Karl Rove. The Democrats as you point out will learn the burden of power in horrible times. Hillary in the Senate and Barack in the White House will hopefully steer them down the middle of the road. Time will tell
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Old 10-24-2008, 11:38 AM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,337,717 times
Reputation: 7627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
Relax, everyone...

McCain's upcoming defeat isn't really the "fault" of anyone working in his campaign. The Republican label is to blame. It's become toxic. I doubt that there's anything Mack & Co could have done to achieve a better result. The numerous failed and highly damaging Republican policies of recent years are now bearing bitter fruit:

1. encouraging illegal immigration
2. deregulating the economy
3. outsourcing US jobs
4. "preemptive" wars
5. anti-science/anti-education

The great mass of the American public, who in the past were willing to trust elected officials to act in their best interests are now fully aware of the depth of the GOP betrayal.

Look for a huge tsunami to sweep the electoral landscape in a week and a half, folks. It's turning grim. very grim.

And no political party has ever earned such a fate as the GOP has currently.
Ain't THAT the truth.
A great post - accurate and to the point.

Ken
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Old 10-24-2008, 12:37 PM
 
Location: Texas
8,064 posts, read 18,013,272 times
Reputation: 3730
Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Gringo View Post
My entire adult life, I've voted Republican. I always thought they were the guys who would watch the purse strings, manage the economy, hold back government intrusion and follow a moderate international policy. I donated to the GOP in the past, feeling confident that they were reasonable and concerned with pursuing the national interest.

Well, I'm no longer asleep.

Now, they're wildly irrepsonsible with spending, taxes, regulation, and foreign policy. They've driven the country into a deep ditch. They've catered to mindless religious freaks. They've betrayed everything they've claimed they stood for. They've stabbed the middle class squarely in the back. And they're trying to shield themselves under a blanket of fear-mongering.

Screw 'em.

Eternally.

I'll never vote GOP again. They've earned decades on the sidelines, as far as I'm concerned.
If this is true, how could you possibly justify turning our whole government over to the Dems??? They're not shy about expressing all of their plans for increased spending and loads of programs.

You may be saying "screw 'em" to the GOP but you do realize that an expensive Dem. government without checks and balances basically means "screw America," right?
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