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First of all, how old are you? Nevermind, don't answer. You just summed up 3rd grade science. The video you displayed, dismissed all relevancy when it failed to address, THE ORIGINS OF LIFE.
Second, I'm not that concerned with biological processes. I am primarily interested to learn how and if Evolution makes logical human sense. I'm not concerned with what the fact that offspring of The Terminator and a Jenna Jamison cyberskin playtoy might resemble some of the Evolutionist cyborgs on this board. I know things evolve--not disputed. It makes no logical human sense, however and for example, as to how entire human societies have gone from from barbarism to modernism in such a short period. Humans us have gone from horse and carriage...to the stealth bomber in only 100 or so years. From the barter system to Wall Street. From the cathode ray tube to the micro chip? Do you follow? I mean, can you process that information?
Evolutions states that "Humans have been here forever." Yet it fails to produce. Where is the evidence of the entire societies of the Lucies, the Freds, the Ethels, the Cro Magnons, and all of the other the X men that it suggests, roamed the Earth for billions and billions of years? Why do monkeys and gorillas still exist, to this day, in all of their glory, as they did when they were Created?
Hmmmmm, you know that things evolve but you don't see the logic in evolution. A little contradictory wouldn't you say?
Evolution does not state that humans have been here forever.
Evolution has nothing to do with the origins of life, as has been stated on here many times. That is a different area of study. Try reading through these evolution threads sometime, you find out a whole lot of useful things that way and you just might stop yourself from looking foolish.
Monkeys and gorillas have evolved just like everything else.
Your so clever why don't you enlighten us as to the progress made in the last hundred odd years. I think it might have something to do with increased knowledge through scientific study, don't you? The very thing you, and others like you, are scoffing at in these threads.
This is a great example of why proper science should always be taught in school. This display of complete ignorance of a subject should not be possible in this day and age.
There is an unnecessary arrogant and insulting tone in your post. If you are going to debate a subject, please get a basic knowledge of what you are debating. You find yourself at the risk of becoming a laughing stock when you come in with arguments like that.
First of all, how old are you? Nevermind, don't answer. You just summed up 3rd grade science. The video you displayed, dismissed all relevancy when it failed to address, THE ORIGINS OF LIFE.
Second, I'm not that concerned with biological processes. I am primarily interested to learn how and if Evolution makes logical human sense. I'm not concerned with what the fact that offspring of The Terminator and a Jenna Jamison cyberskin playtoy might resemble some of the Evolutionist cyborgs on this board. I know things evolve--not disputed. It makes no logical human sense, however and for example, as to how entire human societies have gone from from barbarism to modernism in such a short period. Humans us have gone from horse and carriage...to the stealth bomber in only 100 or so years. From the barter system to Wall Street. From the cathode ray tube to the micro chip? Do you follow? I mean, can you process that information?
Evolutions states that "Humans have been here forever." Yet it fails to produce. Where is the evidence of the entire societies of the Lucies, the Freds, the Ethels, the Cro Magnons, and all of the other the X men that it suggests, roamed the Earth for billions and billions of years? Why do monkeys and gorillas still exist, to this day, in all of their glory, as they did when they were Created?
You didn't realize that evolution is a biological process? Do you have any references that show that the ToE actually makes the claims you present here? Where on earth did you get this stuff, or are you just making this up as you go?
Evolutions states that "Humans have been here forever." Yet it fails to produce. Where is the evidence of the entire societies of the Lucies, the Freds, the Ethels, the Cro Magnons, and all of the other the X men that it suggests, roamed the Earth for billions and billions of years? Why do monkeys and gorillas still exist, to this day, in all of their glory, as they did when they were Created?
Funny I have never heard one believer in evolution ever state that they believed that humans have been here forever. Now I have met some that have stated that the materials in the universe have always been here. But even Carl Sagan says that at one time there were no stars, planets, solar systems, galaxies , etc.
Understand that like the many differing opinions on religion, there are equally differing opinions as to exact details among believers in evolution. That's it, nothing more, nothing less.
I have heard in ths forum from some evolutionary posters that humans have been around for 400,000 years, but I highly doubt that. If that were true, we would not any of us be having this conversation because humans would have destroyed this place milleniums upon milleniums ago.
Look what they've done in just the last 100 years.
I may be wrong but it sounds like a person of faith looking for some last branches to hold onto. Doesn't anybody ever notice how religion keeps re-interpreting their God after science proves their previous version to be wrong?? God is just some people's answer to things science has not yet provided a logical and evidentially backed answer for. Science has pushed religion so far back that now they hold onto the idea that he designed it all and set it all in motion, which we cannot disprove... yet.
I may be wrong but it sounds like a person of faith looking for some last branches to hold onto. Doesn't anybody ever notice how religion keeps re-interpreting their God after science proves their previous version to be wrong?? God is just some people's answer to things science has not yet provided a logical and evidentially backed answer for. Science has pushed religion so far back that now they hold onto the idea that he designed it all and set it all in motion, which we cannot disprove... yet.
I'm not a person of faith i'm agnostic, for me religion is black or white just as is a person who is an athiest. Science has not disproven the existence of a god. How do you know someone isn't behind all of this? Maybe its not even a person, maybe it is a force, an idea, a value a way of thinking an essence or maybe it is nothing at all... Are you god oh exalted one who knows all? We don't have all the answers yet, we don't even know how many dimensions there are and we can't definatively prove if there is one or many universes. There could be billions of universes let alone billions of galaxies in one universe. Lets get into String Theory and Quantum Physics and you'll find some real creativity going on there lol. I'm not holding on to any branches, I'm just open to the fact that the tree or trees or forest or multiple forests might be more complex and more wondrous than you choose to believe because everything has to be either black or white.
On the issue of Creationism vs. Evolution, the lines are pretty clearly drawn: The GOP has been labeled the party God, while the Left the "secular", non-religious party. In fact, the Left has introduced dozens of lawsuits to ensure that Creationism is kept out of schools. In the absence of a creator, however, we are left with Evolution - survival of the fittest. It is the ultimate irony, then, that the Left, who denounces a Creator and espouses Darwinism, introduces programs like Affirmative Action, low-income mortgage programs like the CRA, and hundreds of other laws to protect the "weak".
I agree discrimination is wrong. But why is it wrong? By what standards? God's law? The law of the jungle? The Founder's intent? When you try and have a meaningful, rational discussion on this topic with anybody from the Left, their argument breaks down at this fundamental flaw in their thinking.
Many Democrats believe in God. But in general, there is a fundamental flaw in the Left's logic. The Left has done an excellent job of "finding a villain". The villain is anybody who succeeds. This of course is counter to an evolutionary view of survival of the fittest. Their agenda is to use the power of government to circumvent the very same evolutionary factors that they so firmly assert.
Lets examine a few of the Left's inconsistencies:
Keep God out of government. Oh, but I have a God-given right to the same things that you do based on the Founder's assertion that all of us have certain inalienable rights granted by our creator. The Founders did not quote a human right. It is a God-given right. Granted by a Creator. Clearly stated in the Constitution.
All men are created equal. Except for Blacks and Hispanics, who are a little more equal at college admission and hiring time. Affirmative Action, you know.
Creationism is a myth. Think Evolution. Unless we are talking about those God-given rights, in which case God is our best friend. Oh, and survival of the fittest? We'll just pass a law that bans the wolf from eating the sheep. Afterwards, we'll pass a law that forces the wolf to attend sensitivity training to learn why eating the sheep is bad, and then discuss the affects of the wolf's actions on the sheep's self-esteem. Bad wolf!
Abortion is fine. Its not life - just a zygote. Capital punishment is wrong - its immoral and taking a life must be against God's law. After all, in nature, the Alpha male Lion never kills the dumba$$ lion that goes against the rules of the Pride.
The purpose of government is clear, at least according to our founders - to ensure freedom to all according to God's law. Their intent is clear and well documented. The more the Left takes religion out of the picture and marginalize it, the closer we get to a society that they are trying to prevent in the first place.
Final thought: I was debating with a friend a couple years ago about this same topic. She is very liberal. After a few cups of coffee I finally just asked her "...by what laws does the bird have a right to not be eaten by the cat?" What prevents the wolf from eating the sheep?" Because she is agnostic, she has never given me a good answer. The morality in our society today is a function of some religious doctrine. In abscense of that, we Alpha males would have rounded up all you pansy boys and clubbed you out of the gene pool two thousand years ago.
On the issue of Creationism vs. Evolution, the lines are pretty clearly drawn: The GOP has been labeled the party God, while the Left the "secular", non-religious party. In fact, the Left has introduced dozens of lawsuits to ensure that Creationism is kept out of schools. In the absence of a creator, however, we are left with Evolution - survival of the fittest. It is the ultimate irony, then, that the Left, who denounces a Creator and espouses Darwinism, introduces programs like Affirmative Action, low-income mortgage programs like the CRA, and hundreds of other laws to protect the "weak".
I agree discrimination is wrong. But why is it wrong? By what standards? God's law? The law of the jungle? The Founder's intent? When you try and have a meaningful, rational discussion on this topic with anybody from the Left, their argument breaks down at this fundamental flaw in their thinking.
Many Democrats believe in God. But in general, there is a fundamental flaw in the Left's logic. The Left has done an excellent job of "finding a villain". The villain is anybody who succeeds. This of course is counter to an evolutionary view of survival of the fittest. Their agenda is to use the power of government to circumvent the very same evolutionary factors that they so firmly assert.
Lets examine a few of the Left's inconsistencies:
Keep God out of government. Oh, but I have a God-given right to the same things that you do based on the Founder's assertion that all of us have certain inalienable rights granted by our creator. The Founders did not quote a human right. It is a God-given right. Granted by a Creator. Clearly stated in the Constitution.
All men are created equal. Except for Blacks and Hispanics, who are a little more equal at college admission and hiring time. Affirmative Action, you know.
Creationism is a myth. Think Evolution. Unless we are talking about those God-given rights, in which case God is our best friend. Oh, and survival of the fittest? We'll just pass a law that bans the wolf from eating the sheep. Afterwards, we'll pass a law that forces the wolf to attend sensitivity training to learn why eating the sheep is bad, and then discuss the affects of the wolf's actions on the sheep's self-esteem. Bad wolf!
Abortion is fine. Its not life - just a zygote. Capital punishment is wrong - its immoral and taking a life must be against God's law. After all, in nature, the Alpha male Lion never kills the dumba$$ lion that goes against the rules of the Pride.
The purpose of government is clear, at least according to our founders - to ensure freedom to all according to God's law. Their intent is clear and well documented. The more the Left takes religion out of the picture and marginalize it, the closer we get to a society that they are trying to prevent in the first place.
Final thought: I was debating with a friend a couple years ago about this same topic. She is very liberal. After a few cups of coffee I finally just asked her "...by what laws does the bird have a right to not be eaten by the cat?" What prevents the wolf from eating the sheep?" Because she is agnostic, she has never given me a good answer. The morality in our society today is a function of some religious doctrine. In abscense of that, we Alpha males would have rounded up all you pansy boys and clubbed you out of the gene pool two thousand years ago.
LOL Great post! We have laws to draw upon, but yes what do you draw upon in order to derive a set of rules for a society to go by. It is all extraordinarily relative. However, I will say that a successful society will respect the the rights of an individual, have a legal system that is based on equality and safety for all. We humans have a higher order functioning brain than all the other living things you draw a parallel with, so the cat and mouse argument is not the same as a human clubbing a human argument. I'm sure if one were to look at the laws in place in many of the advanced countries in the western world, you will find a harmony in those legal systems that don't need to draw on a religious doctrine.
The United States is not the be all and end all of a great democracy. It had a great start but there are other countries that have more successfully created a system where the citizens live in greater harmony hence studies that show the U.S is generally not in the top 10 list of countries with the greatest standard of living. These countries that are, are places that don't draw upon the laws of the alpha male, yet they don't derive laws from religious dogma either and yet these countries have provided the best conditions for their populace to live than at any time in history.
We can benefit from religious morality if it includes respect for the individual rights and freedoms to live without fear of some lunatic alpha male clubbing him from behind, but it doesn't mean the country has to use the bible or the Quran as its legal source word for word, however, inspiration can be drawn from it if it makes sense and doesn't marginalize or repress an individual/group. In other words, we need a system that preserves the human condition in the best possible way, but that way doesn't have to be relegated to the laws of the jungle or the laws of the Bible either. I think we have risen above that and its time that groups of people like the Taliban for instance, to shed the fundmentalism that is destroying the harmony and progression of their society. Imagine how much it sucks being a woman there, they are not respecting the woman as an individual. If I were the taliban, i'd use as a model system in a part of the world where its people are in harmony and copy that system - say Denmark or Sweden for instance, but it would require that higher functioning brain to shed the past and evolve. Does this mean they have to proclaim god doesn't exist? No, but it does mean that their interpretation of whatever they think god wants of them, will have to change.
BTW: the alpha male can still pass along a recessive pansy gene as offspring because during early human history, the alpha male was king, but the pansies kept coming back and eventually put the alpha in his place....the evolution continues
Last edited by mississauga75; 04-19-2009 at 03:38 PM..
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From the cathode ray tube to the micro chip? Do you follow? I mean, can you process that information? 
I don't even understand that one. 
