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Old 07-17-2012, 11:10 AM
 
9,243 posts, read 7,100,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
Why? What is the correlation? Current census number put the total Hispanic population of the United States at 50 million.

With your earlier range of numbers ("50 - 60 million"), you would have to consider most of them as illegal aliens...
Most of them are.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:12 AM
 
9,243 posts, read 7,100,483 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBMMuseum View Post
What I am saying is that you originally gave a range of "50 - 60 million", then later said "10 - 20 million". How can you arrive at a difference 40 million people within a few posts on the same day? Which of the two ranges of numbers do you want to go with?:
Doesn't matter.

there are too many illegals from one side of our border & its destroying our country.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:22 AM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,712,131 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank_Knight View Post
Both executive orders, and 'policy discretion' are legal fiction without basis in the Constitution. Both are as such unconstitutional. The only time the executive would have a legal basis for using discretion in this degree is if he believed that an act of Congress was unconstitutional. I don't agree with the migration policy, but Congress is specifically granted the power to regulate naturalization laws.

We can call it a memo if you insist though.
Neither is unconstitutional, legal fiction or not. Both have been allowed by Congress/SCOTUS in certain instances. It is not the executive using discretion, it is DHS that is doing so through policy as allowed already by congress, prosecutorial discretion, POTUS is simply taking credit for the work around. I am firmly against illegal aliens receiving anything, but what this admin did was not unconstitutional at all with this prosecutorial discretion.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:29 AM
 
Location: Jacurutu
5,302 posts, read 4,011,547 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
Most of them are.
So now we have a number of at least 25 million, but less than half of the range ("50 - 60 million") you provided before. I think the big problem you have with defining how many illegal aliens is defining who is an illegal alien. You are also excluding "Anchor Babies" from your identification of those that are specifically "illegal aliens".

Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
Doesn't matter.

there are too many illegals from one side of our border & its destroying our country.
To be defined as an "illegal alien" from the perspective of the United States, they can only be on one side of the border: The inside...
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:31 AM
 
33,141 posts, read 39,103,690 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by All American NYC View Post
Doesn't matter.

there are too many illegals from one side of our border & its destroying our country.
If you have 50-60 million illegals in the country and they are pouring over the border by the millions unimpeded supposedly with the governments blessing, i'd say give it up,its over. you've lost,your country is destroyed and no Mr Romney aint gonna be able to fix it.. in fact you might do well to move to Mexico as theres probably a major manpower shortage down there.
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Old 07-17-2012, 11:55 AM
 
153 posts, read 108,601 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
Neither is unconstitutional, legal fiction or not. Both have been allowed by Congress/SCOTUS in certain instances. It is not the executive using discretion, it is DHS that is doing so through policy as allowed already by congress, prosecutorial discretion, POTUS is simply taking credit for the work around. I am firmly against illegal aliens receiving anything, but what this admin did was not unconstitutional at all with this prosecutorial discretion.
Congress has also allowed several wars to be waged without a formal declaration and the Supreme Court has a long healthy tradition of upholding unconstitutional actions. My personal favorite being the wheat farmer case that extended the interstate commerce act beyond its intended scope. Their consent for the memo, implied or explicit, is not sufficient to consider something constitutional.

Now if there was a specific article in the Constitution that stated the executive branch having the power of discretion..
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Old 07-17-2012, 01:30 PM
 
Location: California
2,477 posts, read 1,712,131 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank_Knight View Post
Congress has also allowed several wars to be waged without a formal declaration and the Supreme Court has a long healthy tradition of upholding unconstitutional actions. My personal favorite being the wheat farmer case that extended the interstate commerce act beyond its intended scope. Their consent for the memo, implied or explicit, is not sufficient to consider something constitutional.

Now if there was a specific article in the Constitution that stated the executive branch having the power of discretion..
The last few "wars" were granted by Congressional resolution, which is entirely legal. The issue with Wickard was that of Federal regulation (limiting a production of a certain crop, which still goes on today by the way), which Libertarian ideology is strongly against, it falls back to their mis-understanding of Liberty and Freedom.

The executive branch doesn't need the power of discretion, as it was granted already by congress in prior immigration bills. As for the USC, it provides for both negative and positive rights to include limitations and exercise of full authority by the Feds.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:16 PM
 
3,186 posts, read 5,454,537 times
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Friends. In 1776 a NEW country was formed. Until we have another war to change that what happened before 1776 dont make a rats ass......
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:28 PM
 
153 posts, read 108,601 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquid Reigns View Post
The last few "wars" were granted by Congressional resolution, which is entirely legal. The issue with Wickard was that of Federal regulation (limiting a production of a certain crop, which still goes on today by the way), which Libertarian ideology is strongly against, it falls back to their mis-understanding of Liberty and Freedom.

The executive branch doesn't need the power of discretion, as it was granted already by congress in prior immigration bills. As for the USC, it provides for both negative and positive rights to include limitations and exercise of full authority by the Feds.
Can you cite which portions of past immigration bills specifically grant the executive this discretion? If it exists then it is constitutional, and I apologize for claiming otherwise.
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Old 07-17-2012, 07:28 PM
 
11,961 posts, read 12,435,936 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
I keep seeing references to an invasion of illegals into America, however i see very little mention on where the data for this invasion actually comes from and how many illegals are we actually talking about?and where are they coming from? A couple of million is hardly worth the effort to bother with, 50-60 million? ya might have a problem..
Why bother counting? At the rate white men keep murdering white women and children, it all evens out in the end.
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