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The Supremes need to get off their rear ends and finally put an end to this "Misinterpretation" of the 14th. "Subject to the jurisdiction Thereof". If I went to Thailand on a tourist visa and had sex with a under aged girl in Thailand I have technically committed a felony because as a U.S. citizen I am bounded by U.S. law and my citizen allegiance is under the U.S. even though I am overseas when I commited the act.
Illegal immigrants are not U.S. citizens and are not under our jurisdiction. Their allegiance is bounded to their country. This seems like a no brainer that should be corrected by SCOTUS.
"The intent of the 14th amendment is to prevent the creation of second-class citizens via legal obfuscations that pretend that some of the people in the United States are not the full kind of "person" who is entitled to the rights it guarantees."
When the child born in u.s is taken back to their country of origin and later in life gets a job and becomes a taxpayer, do you want to guess what happens, or should I tell you, because I know that is going to be one unhappy child ... The child is subject to the jurisdiction of the u.s. and all laws apply.
"Amendment XIV, Section 1, Clause 1 of the U.S. Constitution directs that all persons born in the United States are U.S. citizens. This is the case regardless of the tax or immigration status of a person’s parents."
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There is a common sense no brainer here, well several of them, that keeps popping up, ignoring them is not going to make them go away ... the government will get their money, or not, if you all keep it up.
Like I said, creating a Stateless society, may not be a bad idea. However, the Jews didn't like it, so idk ... ps: lot of Russian babies are going to be upset with their mama's when they become adults and have to pay taxes in Russian and the u.s.
One parent would have to present a Real ID qualified identification, a passport or a birth certificate when applying for newborns birth certificate. Same amount of work it takes to fly on a plane. What are you talking about?
I know, what's the big deal? I prefer the mother be the qualifying citizen as baby daddy might not be around as in the case of the parents not being married. She would undeniably be the mother by giving birth to the baby.
The Supremes need to get off their rear ends and finally put an end to this "Misinterpretation" of the 14th. "Subject to the jurisdiction Thereof". If I went to Thailand on a tourist visa and had sex with a under aged girl in Thailand I have technically committed a felony because as a U.S. citizen I am bounded by U.S. law and my citizen allegiance is under the U.S. even though I am overseas when I commited the act.
Illegal immigrants are not U.S. citizens and are not under our jurisdiction. Their allegiance is bounded to their country. This seems like a no brainer that should be corrected by SCOTUS.
thats a very moronic way of thinking, are you even thinking what you are writing?.
Thats not the way the law works. you are not bound by US law when you are abroad. the conspiracy to travel to engage in sex abuse of minors is a crime under US law. the same applies to terrorists, that have never been in the US but can be extradited here to be punished because the conspiracy to harm the US violates us law. Or drug lords like el chapo. ect. that dosent mean you are under US jurisdiction while abroad. any country can do that.
when you travel abroad to engage in sex with a minor you are committing a sex trafficking offence. it dosent matter if the victim goes to you or you go to the victim, it is sex trafficking anyways. reason is that those crime involve the US, at least partially, and make the US part of the criminal activity. an international conspiracy can be prosecuted by any of the countries involved. if you travel to Thailand from the US, to engage in sex with minors , then the US is involved as part of the crime was committed here. hence traveling abroad implies an origin and a destination. (the crime is traveling abroad with the intent to comit the crime, not the crime it self)
Section 2423(b) of Title 18, United States Code, Section 2423(b) makes it a crime for United States citizens or legal permanent residents to travel from the United States to a foreign country with the intent to engage in illegal sexual conduct with a child such as rape, molestation, or prostitution.
Sections 2251(c) and 2260(a) of Title 18, United States Code both make it a crime for anyone to produce child pornography in foreign countries if they import the child abuse images into the United States, or if they intend to do so.
as you can see both of those crime involve the US, and make the US part of the criminal activity, by ether traveling from the US to commit the crime or by sending the child pornography to the US.
Last edited by Grabandgo; 08-30-2019 at 08:16 AM..
Quick quiz... Ponder this... CURRENT US Nationality Law... Read subsections (a) and (b). If everyone born in the US were actually automatically US citizens, subsection (b) would be redundant and would be neither included nor necessary:
The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth: (a) a person born in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof (b) a person born in the United States to a member of an Indian, Eskimo, Aleutian, or other aboriginal tribe: Provided, That the granting of citizenship under this subsection shall not in any manner impair or otherwise affect the right of such person to tribal or other property
Also ask yourself why US-born aboriginal tribe members weren't birthright US citizens until 1924, 56 years AFTER the ratification of the 14th Amendment, when a special Legislative Act granted them an exception (Indian Citizenship Act).
Hint: They owed allegiance to a foreign sovereign (their respective US tribes/nations), at birth, and therefore were not subject to US jurisdiction.
Similarly, those born to illegal aliens are also born owing allegiance to a foreign sovereign but Congress has never passed an exception for them.
Did the two of you bother to read the rest of the page, or just read my excerpt then stop there, because there is more to that ... "Birthright citizenship is not what drives illegal immigration. Surveys have found that people come for jobs and to better their lives. Where problems arise, such as birth tourism by foreigners who come solely to give birth and then leave, existing policy and law enforcement offer the right solution.
So why would we alter a hard-fought, 147-year-old constitutional principle that addressed one of the darkest chapters in our history and has served the country so well?" (I'd like to know)
Here's the other part that I post about and every one chooses to ignore:
"Our birth certificates are proof of our citizenship. If birthright citizenship were eliminated, U.S. citizens could no longer use their birth certificates as proof of citizenship."
Have you all stopped to think about how hard it would be to move from one state to the next, or buy a house, a car, open a bank account ...
"The U.S. government would have to create a large new bureaucracy responsible for determining the citizenship of all children born in the U.S., and would have to create a national registry of citizens and some sort of identification document to be used as proof of citizenship. This would be expensive." (my bold to say, Germany here we come, to be just like you 87 years ago)
We don't have an immigration problem in this country, we have a human rights issue in this country; when the lack of human rights hit you people close to home, then you'll say --- oh wait, we didn't intend that ... by then it will be too late. Which countries grant unconditional birthright citizenship?
"Along with the US, 29 other countries currently bestow automatic citizenship to any individual born within its borders, excluding the children of foreign diplomats or of enemy forces occupying the country. They are:
Antigua and Barbuda, Argentina, Barbados, Belize, Brazil, Canada, Chad, Chile, Cuba, Dominica, Ecuador, El Salvador, Fiji, Grenada, Guatemala, Guyana, Honduras, Jamaica, Lesotho, Mexico, Pakistan, Panama, Paraguay, Peru, Saint Kitts and Nevis, Saint Lucia, Saint Vincent and the Grenadines, Uruguay and Venezuela.
These countries either have legal systems derived from English common law, where the practice of jus soli developed, or instituted the citizenship measure in order to attract people to their countries, such as in Central and South American nations.
<snip>
Have any countries changed their birthright citizenship laws?
Germany, however, has liberalized its citizenship laws slightly in recent years. Whereas citizenship used to be based exclusively on parents' nationality, since 2000 the children of nonethnic German parents may acquire citizenship at birth if at least one of their parents has held permanent residence for at least three years and resided in Germany for at least eight years."
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We will have to like Germany, go through it, before we understand, it was the wrong thing to do. Our rights, is like that of receiving an A in a college course that by the end of the semester an F is scored, because we don't know how to keep the A.
I recently had to get a new copy of my BC for Social Security. It does not say where my parents were born. I would have no way to prove they were legal US Citizens. Understand what you are saying. My Mom was born at home, as was my Grandma. This could create a very big Pandora's box.
Just came across this doing my genealogy. Claiming Citizenship "through blood". No, you don't have to be born on Italian soil, and it can be through a great-grandparent.
My Great-grandfather (born in Italy) never was Naturalized; therefore never renounced his Italian citizenship. Grandma (born in the US) would have been considered a dual citizen with Italy. Same for my Mom, and even me. None of us ever knew this.
I recently had to get a new copy of my BC for Social Security. It does not say where my parents were born. I would have no way to prove they were legal US Citizens. Understand what you are saying. My Mom was born at home, as was my Grandma. This could create a very big Pandora's box.
Re-interpreting birthright citizenship as it was intended to be would not be retroactive. It would only effect those babies born on our soil going forward. Much ado ado about nothing. Only 30 countries in the world allow for birthright citizenship for any baby born on their soil regardless of their parent's status in their country. The rest do not and there doesn't seem to be any issues from it.
The person's birth certificate will mean squat. btw: if something is wrong with your chip, your sol.
Stateless ... which may not be a bad idea.
It will if you need Identification to get it in the first place. I needed it to get a passport.
If something’s wrong with the chip, manually enter the numbers like Wal Mart would.
There is NO such thing as Stateless. You would always have the citizenship of your parents, NO country forbids this.
Native Americans or the Slaves had one thing in common; their parents where born here, ad hoc.
I guarantee the Supremes would never conclude that the writers intended to protect the children of unauthorized migrants. The entire practice in fact precludes that US citizenship is a useless designation based on dirt. I don’t own your tv because I was able to get into your house and take it with my own bare hands.
There are a lot of kids on this planet that would be better off born in the US. Does the mere fact of that injustice imply the entire world order should be disregarded or vilified? You want to start over go find an available island. Oh wait, that wouldn’t be possible, so get a gun, wait that would be barbaric, so beg, oh wait that wouldn’t be dignified. You need to be careful about going down your crazy road, not us.
Re-interpreting birthright citizenship as it was intended to be would not be retroactive. It would only effect those babies born on our soil going forward. Much ado ado about nothing. Only 30 countries in the world allow for birthright citizenship for any baby born on their soil regardless of their parent's status in their country. The rest do not and there doesn't seem to be any issues from it.
You have no issues with creating a Stateless Society? I know I don't, but I think there are others that will. A true libertarian society and all they had to do was wait, until someone pushed the envelope.
Not subject to the jurisdiction means no automatic allegiance to the country. Free to go ...
I recently had to get a new copy of my BC for Social Security. It does not say where my parents were born. I would have no way to prove they were legal US Citizens. Understand what you are saying. My Mom was born at home, as was my Grandma. This could create a very big Pandora's box.
I'm having to do the same for same reason as you. I haven't followed through yet. My father though, (many years back) sent for his and his was not not signed the drunk doctor who slapped him on the butt. Served in the military, but he was never born. PS: which meant he would be unable to collect his SS retirement.
Just came across this doing my genealogy. Claiming Citizenship "through blood". No, you don't have to be born on Italian soil, and it can be through a great-grandparent.
My Great-grandfather (born in Italy) never was Naturalized; therefore never renounced his Italian citizenship. Grandma (born in the US) would have been considered a dual citizen with Italy. Same for my Mom, and even me. None of us ever knew this.
Different countries have different rules.
My blood line is German. When they get even more stupid in this country, I would have a place to go.
Last edited by Ellis Bell; 08-31-2019 at 01:02 PM..
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The child is subject to the jurisdiction of the u.s. and all laws apply.
