Illinois - Staying or Moving? (Chicago, Naperville: bankrupt, median income, living)

[numberfive]

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

Right...well better delete your posts that out you! Don't want any potential doxxers knowing you're really hiding out in the suburbs pretending to be from the most affluent part of the city...

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

There are many places with better weather than San Francisco that are nowhere near as expensive. San Francisco is expensive because the employment opportunities pay more. If/when the tech bubble bursts, we'll see a market correction in San Francisco.

Good thing I didn't write "The Best Weather in the Country Company", or that weather is the singular reason the prices are high there.

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

Chicago also has a very high # of high-paying jobs, which is why housing costs are higher here than in neighboring states/less affluent parts of the country. Not everyone is raking in the big dollars obviously, but since so many are the competition for the "best" locations is more intensive. Guess what that does to prices?

Those high-paying jobs didn't just appear out of nowhere. It's a chicken-and-egg problem. That's beside the point though. Not everyone has the highest paying job, yet everybody ends up "paying for it". How is this a good thing?

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

I will also add that there are MANY communities throughout Chicagoland that have very affordable housing costs. They're not always the "best" locations, but they're not uninhabitable ghettos. I would actually say most are very pleasant places to live.

Yep, you have to make more compromises here than other areas though. Either you pay more for less in an expensive area or more for less in a less expensive area. The same problem remains.

[IrishIllini]

Originally Posted by numberfive

What kind of lifestyle can you get in Naperville, IL that you can't get in Alpharetta, GA or Richardson, TX?

You have access to a world-class City with superior employment opportunities and vibrancy. If you don't understand this by this point, you never will.

Originally Posted by numberfive

You can't tie any of these things to an objective value.

Furthermore, sometimes it works in the opposite direction. In my own experience, I made less working for 6 years for a Fortune 100 company in the Chicago area than I did in a small- or medium-sized company. I've far exceeded the earnings of those that remained, so my experience has shown that's a detriment more than an asset.

I agree it's difficult to quantify QOL, but the data speaks for itself. As a whole, Illinois has a higher percentage of millionaire households, superior schools, better transit, and better access to quality job than most other places in the United States. Differences in COL are not arbitrarily set...they fluctuate based on the $$$ flowing in and out of regions...Texas and Atlanta won't be cheap for long, my friends.

[numberfive]

Originally Posted by OyCrumbler

I don't think I was referencing Naperville. I must've ended up in the wrong thread--I was referring to urban neighborhoods in Chicago--maybe urban areas of Evanston can count, too. Sorry if I didn't keep up--I definitely am not for the argument that Naperville is somehow an urban metropolis.

You addressed me, and I've been talking about Chicago proper and surrounding suburbs this entire time. No worries.

Originally Posted by OyCrumbler

What is the objective value? Salaries? You can definitely look around for that. Glass door is a decent site for it, though I find it off sometimes, but that might be an artifact of working in newer industries where job titles are extremely fluid/weird. It's pretty much why I ended up in NYC, which is, uh, a bit pricey.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. You listed subjective examples, but I've been asking all along for objective examples.

Originally Posted by OyCrumbler

And yea, you can earn less or more at a small or medium size company--people have different career tracks, but major international corporate jobs are good because if you rise through its ranks you can get something really cushy and the opportunities available to you after putting in some good/absolutely awful years with those years on the resume in smaller companies become a lot better with that name check.

Yes, this is true -- it can happen both ways. But this is once again subjective. Objective is the name of the game, what percentage of people fall in one category vs the other? We could trade anecdotes all day (I made more at a smaller company, you made more at a bigger company...) but what are the overall trends?

I've read a lot of big claims in this thread about how Chicago is inexpensive with little to no concrete evidence to back it up. I'm just awaiting that evidence.

[numberfive]

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

I agree it's difficult to quantify QOL, but the data speaks for itself. As a whole, Illinois has a higher percentage of millionaire households, superior schools, better transit, and better access to quality job than most other places in the United States. Differences in COL are not arbitrarily set...they fluctuate based on the $$$ flowing in and out of regions...Texas and Atlanta won't be cheap for long, my friends.

Citations needed, especially the bolded.

Show us the data you're claiming "speaks for itself".

I took two seconds to look up your first claim about Illinois having a higher percentage of millionaire households than most other places in the United States, and that isn't true.
Source

Illinois is #20, almost middle-of-the-pack. Looks like the data failed you there.

Besides, that's a really weird metric, you have to be a millionaire to have a good quality of life? Why on earth is that even on the list for comparison?

[IrishIllini]

Originally Posted by numberfive

I've read a lot of big claims in this thread about how Chicago is inexpensive with little to no concrete evidence to back it up. I'm just awaiting that evidence.

You have been shown evidence. You're just choosing to disregard it for whatever reason. You can lead a horse to water...

[numberfive]

Originally Posted by IrishIllini

You have been shown evidence. You're just choosing to disregard it for whatever reason. You can lead a horse to water...

Which posts had objective evidence in them? Can you show even one since I started asking?

[OyCrumbler]

Originally Posted by numberfive

You addressed me, and I've been talking about Chicago proper and surrounding suburbs this entire time. No worries.


I'm not sure what you mean by this. You listed subjective examples, but I've been asking all along for objective examples.


Yes, this is true -- it can happen both ways. But this is once again subjective. Objective is the name of the game, what percentage of people fall in one category vs the other? We could trade anecdotes all day (I made more at a smaller company, you made more at a bigger company...) but what are the overall trends?

I've read a lot of big claims in this thread about how Chicago is inexpensive with little to no concrete evidence to back it up. I'm just awaiting that evidence.

What is the objective example? I think glass door makes sense as a way to gauge though it has its own issues. Are you looking for census bureau stats like number of households making x amount? The problem with that is that I don't think you can drill down with their database to actual occupation and make a cross reference to the same in other cities.

[NC211]

My opinion, Cook County isn't far from following the same path as Orange County (CA) and Jefferson County (AL) have travelled in recent memory (one doing it as we speak) - bankruptcy. It'll reset the financial atmosphere. If lucky, it'll allow Cook to become what Orange has become, and were Jefferson is heading. Both of those got ahead of their skis with debt obligations which pinned them down to the point of having to do a strategic BK filing.


I left 5 years ago. Haven't missed it for a single moment. But, will say that I'm not a native, never wanted to be there in the first place. I have met several Chicago natives all over the country. If you're a native, it's a very hard city to replace in your life, and you seem to find your way back.

[numberfive]

Originally Posted by OyCrumbler

What is the objective example? I think glass door makes sense as a way to gauge though it has its own issues. Are you looking for census bureau stats like number of households making x amount? The problem with that is that I don't think you can drill down with their database to actual occupation and make a cross reference to the same in other cities.

You mean like BLS.gov? That's a good source if you haven't checked it out before.

Edit: I just ran across this site that has a heat map of median income, sourced from census data. It looks like the data shows the Chicago metro area does not -- repeat -- does not have a higher median household income than the other metro areas we've discussed like Dallas, Atlanta, etc.

[My Kind Of Town]

Originally Posted by Bellamouse

I still disagree with you. I think there are a lot of very good paying jobs here in Florida for people with skills. I think Florida suffers from a perception issue, and lots of unskilled workers come here and of course, cannot find good paying jobs. But companies are crying down here for skilled employees. They are hard to find. I think many people don't even bother to search Florida for job opportunities because they assume there are none.

My husband's company is crazy about him and pays him more than he made back home. They are asking him to call his "friends back home" and have them come down too - they need more people like my husband. Florida is now the 2nd or 3rd most populous state in the country (I can't remember which), so just in terms of the medical field alone (which neither my husband nor I are in either), there is tremendous need. Nurses are being given signing bonuses to come here. Research companies are moving down here, and other businesses are relocating here because it is business friendly and people are catching on.

Is Florida for everyone? Well of course not, no place is for everyone. But to dismiss out of hand that "there are very few good paying jobs in Florida" is silly.

When you have a state where a huge chunk of people are in low paying service industry jobs (due to all the tourism), it skews the numbers.

Sure but again I'm not sure what you are disagreeing with? The statistics (i.e. median household income) do not support your claim.