How to NOT ruin Montana if you move here (Missoula: restaurants, legal)

[Heart]

I don't have a problem with open carry. Since coming here I have seen it so often I'm used to it now.
I can see where it makes others nervous though, depending on where they come from. The first time I went to the store and encountered a gentleman with his gun sitting in a holster, my heart started pounding and I did for a moment feel quite nervous. You have to understand though, the last time I saw someone with a gun, they were shooting someone down in a parking lot in California.

I grew up where my father kept his shot guns in his bedroom closet, and we just knew not to go in and touch them and we never did. Those guns were for hunting and protection, and he never saw fit to lock them away. He taught us early on how to shoot.

The differences in culture and geography makes people ignorant to open carry, I think...

[Pashta]

Out in the mountains where few people live and lots of huge, wild animals do, I am HAPPY they have open carry and liberal gun law. I will be getting one myself. Always smart to be prepared. Carrying a gun does not make one weak, it makes one smart.

[Reziac]

Originally Posted by mica

If guns cause violence then mine are defective.

Hmm. Mine must be outright broken, having been used to stop violence-in-progress.

[geonerd]

Originally Posted by Klapton

You merely feel secure. I actually am secure. That is the difference. By all means, rely on your badge-wearing betters to keep you safe. I'll take care of myself, thanks.

Did you like the boldface better? Perhaps italics next time?

First, I don't rely on the police to keep me safe. I appreciate what they do, but I'm more of a fan of the "stay out of places you shouldn't be" method. I've lived in major cities all my life and that's worked pretty well for me.

Second, I don't want to impede your carrying a gun, as long as you know what you're doing. But I believe that people in general aren't too bright. You know the type. The guy doing 35 miles per hour in the left lane of I-15. Or the lady who drives four miles from the gas station before she realizes the nozel is still attached to the car. The kid driving 50 in a 35 while updating his Facebook status on his new Droid. All imbeciles and all perfectly capable of buying and carrying firearms legally.

That is definitively, undeniably stupid.

[geonerd]

Originally Posted by Reziac

Not the case at all. Very few people carry out of fear. Rather, most carry because they are willing to be responsible for defending not only themselves, but ALSO are willing to defend those who are unarmed, like yourself, should the need arise.

If you want to protect the public, join the military or become a cop. It's not your place, nor is it your right to be Captain America at Albertsons if some thug decides to rob the place. That's called vigilantism and it's a bad idea for a lot of reasons.

[geonerd]

Originally Posted by Pashta

Out in the mountains where few people live and lots of huge, wild animals do, I am HAPPY they have open carry and liberal gun law. I will be getting one myself. Always smart to be prepared. Carrying a gun does not make one weak, it makes one smart.

That's not really what I'm talking about. I wouldn't want to become a bear snack anymore than you would, so I'd definitely carry some form of protection in that situation.

I'm talking about having guns in populated areas.

[Klapton]

Originally Posted by geonerd

If you want to protect the public, join the military or become a cop. It's not your place, nor is it your right to be Captain America at Albertsons if some thug decides to rob the place. That's called vigilantism and it's a bad idea for a lot of reasons.

No, it's called "citizenship" and being a decent human being. This was well understood by our founders. Here's an interesting article about the history of police forces in America: Roger Roots, Are Cops Constitutional?

I'm retired military, btw. And it is a horrible idea to only have agents of the government armed. It is such a bad idea that our founders insisted that a well-armed citizenry was "necessary to a free state." It's also worth noting that many of the State versions of the same protection of RKBA contain the phrase "standing armies are a threat to peace." (Those "standing armies" are the police and military that you think should be the only people bearing arms.)

And finally, it's not "your place" to decide what my place is. And thank God it's not.

[geonerd]

Originally Posted by Klapton

No, it's called "citizenship" and being a decent human being. This was well understood by our founders. Here's an interesting article about the history of police forces in America: Roger Roots, Are Cops Constitutional?

I'm retired military, btw. And it is a horrible idea to only have agents of the government armed. It is such a bad idea that our founders insisted that a well-armed citizenry was "necessary to a free state." It's also worth noting that many of the State versions of the same protection of RKBA contain the phrase "standing armies are a threat to peace." (Those "standing armies" are the police and military that you think should be the only people bearing arms.)

And finally, it's not "your place" to decide what my place is. And thank God it's not.

This isn't the 18th century. We're not in the Wild West anymore and your carrying around a Smith & Wesson in your jacket absolutely does not constitute a "well regulated militia."

This I think is the crux of this whole issue - there's a yearning among some Montanans for a time when man was a law unto himself and to God. But that's not the world we live in anymore, no matter how bad you want it to be.

I'd like to see us move forward. Move away from being afraid of everything.

Also, I'd like to note that I never once said that I thought the police and military "should be the only people bearing arms."

[GrandviewGloria]

Originally Posted by Lindsole

If I may just say something a bit off topic here....

I was born and raised in Montana and I still reside here happily. Although my schooling and my husband's Military career will soon be taking me away from my home state.

I was one of the lucky few to be brought up on my family's ranch where I worked my a$$ off learning from my family good work skills and values I don't believe come from anywhere else but rurally.

I can assure many people coming from out of state, that if you buy out our land and turn up our old hay fields to build your million dollar mansion and strive to change our "bumpkin" ways of thinking. You will not be welcomed here.

We have all seen too many good summer pastures be turned into "western landscaping" to the tune of millions of dollars. Believe me I now live next to the biggest idiot on the block who came and screamed at me for a good while because someone "drove down his driveway."

I don't believe that no one is welcome here in Montana. I will gladly welcome the next guy who moves here if he is a hard working citizen trying to make a living. I can tell all of you though that I am sick and tired of seeing a new mansion pop up on the tallest driest F-ing hill they can find. Oh and did I mention they only stay in that stupid looking house about a week outta the year!?

I really didn't mean to ramble on I just felt I had to vent.

I don't think you're off-topic at all. You just told us precisely what the thread is about: How NOT to ruin Montana.

And don't worry about Gloria and Company: gaudy as we are, if we did move to Missoula, we'd be doing manual labor with the neighbors, right off the bat. And we would not build on a hill. First, we understand the thermal dynamics involved, and also understand the subtle sonic problems that such an exposed position would cause for such a residence. Depression caused by infrasonic wind noise has been a documented phenomenon for at least a century. We also know that houses on the hills are ruining the cherished look of Missoula. I was being silly, talking about my Chateau. If we built, everything would stay pasture and rural, except for a courtyard vegetable garden in the middle of the house compound...sheltered by the buildings and eight-foot rock walls. Otherwise, pasture would come right up to the house....no rolled-out grass, no 'landscaping'...

Nor would we bring in servants from foreign countries. We've heard how Californians ruined Seattle, by doing just that.

Anyway, I spent a week in Aspen, staying out of my Decorator's way, while he moved us into this Portland house. It was supposed to be a time of solitary meditation for me: coming to terms with leaving Mississippi. Instead, some film industry people we'd met on the Vegan circuit in Malibu recognised me, and I spent the week party-hopping, instead of mourning. After all that fun, there's no way I'm ever hiding out on some Montana ranch. If we ever have ten-plus to spend on a house, we're moving to Aspen.

So why do you think these rich goobers build these clueless multimillion-dollar conglomerations? Do you think the menfolk hope to have (secret) affairs with real cowboys? What do you think they tell themselves about what they're doing? We were just looking for someplace better than Mississippi. But what about the others?

[mica]

Originally Posted by Reziac

Hmm. Mine must be outright broken, having been used to stop violence-in-progress.

Might want to check the warranty.