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Old 12-10-2018, 10:51 AM
 
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Income tax is a tax on production. RE taxes are a tax on consumption. To me that is a very important distinction.
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Old 12-10-2018, 11:49 AM
 
Location: Anaheim
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Originally Posted by cowbell76 View Post
It's a totally different chain than whatever used to be in California. It's an old Mass.-based company and used to be solely in Mass. (often under the family name Demoulas - that's what I grew up calling it), but now they're in NH (seem to open new stores here frequently) and there is at least one in Maine.


Edit to add - People like it because of the prices, and the newest locations are pretty nice as far as basic grocery stores go. But unless people are extremely supermarket-deprived, it's not the sort of grocery store people travel to for the "experience." (In contrast to, say, a Wegmans.) Many of them are pretty dreary, in fact.
The ones in California were part of Kroger, which has Ralphs as well.
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Old 12-10-2018, 01:29 PM
KCZ
 
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Originally Posted by Space_League View Post
Income tax is a tax on production. RE taxes are a tax on consumption. To me that is a very important distinction.

Income taxes are a tax on sweat. RE taxes in NH are monetary transfers to people with children.
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Old 12-10-2018, 05:01 PM
 
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Originally Posted by KCZ View Post
RE taxes in NH are monetary transfers to people with children.

Yes, but, that's not the fault of people who have children, and NH is in dire need of younger residents. The way of funding education is ridiculous and unsustainable, and the costs of education are also totally out of control. If there were no other component to property taxes except local and state education, our annual taxes would still be over $5500, and we have a modest house. Doable now while working, much more difficult when retired.


One could also say that property taxes are taxes on wealth, except that in most cases, the "wealth" is actually partially or even mostly held by a bank, not by the "owner" of the property.
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Old 12-10-2018, 05:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by cowbell76 View Post
the costs of education are also totally out of control.
This is the root of the problem. Until this is fixed no amount of creating, shifting, or disguising taxes is going to improve anyone's standard of living. Only getting the cost under control will help. If you don't believe that, find a resident of Connecticut and ask them how well creating an income tax has worked out for them.

Until costs are contained, there are beautiful towns in NH with low taxes. There are states that have allocated their tax burden differently. Choose whatever works best for your own situation. Turning New Hampshire into a high tax state isn't the answer.
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Old 12-11-2018, 11:23 AM
 
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Originally Posted by jdhpa View Post
This is the root of the problem. Until this is fixed no amount of creating, shifting, or disguising taxes is going to improve anyone's standard of living. Only getting the cost under control will help. If you don't believe that, find a resident of Connecticut and ask them how well creating an income tax has worked out for them.

Until costs are contained, there are beautiful towns in NH with low taxes. There are states that have allocated their tax burden differently. Choose whatever works best for your own situation. Turning New Hampshire into a high tax state isn't the answer.

I'm definitely not advocating for an income tax. I agree a major part of the solution is cutting costs, I just don't see that happening. The only time that seems to happen is in very property-poor towns with low-income residents. When people get truly desperate, they are willing to cut back on education, but they can only cut so much in the current system and it barely makes a dent on the tax rates in those town. I do continue to think that funding education entirely on the backs of property owners (and yes, indirectly, renters... but they pay much less) is not a sustainable system but I can't think of a "better" way to tax.

The problem with many of the low-tax towns is that the home prices are higher than elsewhere (though not always by a huge amount), and if people are looking at their bottom line now, rather than down the line when their mortgage is paid off, they might feel it's not worth it. (Although, I'd rather be paying a higher mortgage than money to the town/state which I will never get back.) And, a lot of them aren't close to many jobs (or to someone's current job which may be a great and stable job.) There are definitely situations which will work out for some people, though. And in those cases it's amazing to see the difference in taxes one family versus another might pay.
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