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No, I don't have mental health training but I recognize manipulation and emotional blackmail when I see them. I'm just not stupid enough to buy that she had three "accidental" pregnancies. One accident I'd believe. Three is deliberate.
Any way you slice this, this woman should not be having any more children. Paul needs to take care of things so there are no more "accidents". His wife needs serious psychotherapy and it probably wouldn't hurt to put the four children caught in the crossfire into therapy too. I feel so badly for these kids. They didn't ask for any of this and they're helpless while their mother acts like a self centered witch (I really don't care why she's doing this to her family. She's unstable and needs to be in therapy at the very least and the last thing she needs is another baby).
You are missing my point, but never mind, as we are OT enough already. The only two sets of opinions and interpretations that matter IRL are those of the OP and his wife.
I feel for the kids as well and think your suggestion about dad checking in with them and whether they need therapeutic support is a solid one.
Last edited by eastwesteastagain; 02-26-2012 at 11:07 AM..
The fact your wife is willing to put the four children she has through a divorce, knowing that that doesn't even get her her way, speaks volumes. She's intent on punishing you AND HER FOUR CHILDREN (I know they're yours too but she's not running for mother of the year here) for not giving her what she wants even though she still loses in the end. Let's, see if I have her logic right: You won't give me what I want, I can't get what I want by leaving and leaving would destroy my children's family but I don't care because leaving hurts you and I'm determined to hurt you because you didn't give me what I wanted. Am I close?
OP, the above is EXACTLY what you need to say to your wife.
Sounds like you've really been thinking about all of this. Good for you.
One of the things I was trying to get you to do was think about how controlling you may have been in your marriage. (Because the first time I read your post I was a little put-off by some of the unilateral decisions you seemed to have made.)
In a marriage decisions should be made as a team.
I can't tell you whether or not to have another child but I can tell you what I would do in your position.
First have your wife seen by a GOOD OB/Gyn. Make sure nothing is wrong physically. Hormones do go out of whack. Explore treatment options if recommended. Including seeing someone if she's depressed. A good OB/Gyn has seen this 1,000 times before and will know what needs to be done. Enlist a relative she trusts to get her there if she balks.
Second marriage counseling. And if the counselor tells you that you have been responsible for some of your wife's problems.... LISTEN. (I should add I don't think marriage counseling will do a lick of good until she gets the first part done. First stop, IMO is the OB/Gyn. You need to find the root cause of things.)
A decision on having another child SHOULD NOT be made now. No way, no how. If you both want this marriage to work, the repair work needs to be done first. I have an idea she is carrying a WHOLE lot of hurt inside her for a variety of reasons. She needs to be healed physically and mentally (and emotionally) before any more babies are made. So do you, for that matter. (Which means you can go to counseling on your own.)
Take care of your other kids too. All of this is affecting them. I imagine they have a whole lot of pain in their lives right now. Are you arguing in front of them? Stop. Make sure they are protected from all the drama going on between you and your wife right now. They need to know this isn't their fault. Because that's what they are going to think.
Best I've got. Good luck. Make sure your kids aren't in the center of all this.
The OB/GYN may make sense as the first stop, but it's not going to be. Tuesday we go to counseling, but she is a marriage counselor and a mental health specialist.
Of course our marriage can improve and should improve. We've been going along in mommy mode and provider mode for too long. I don't think either of us were prepared for all this, even though considering the times and challenges we've done pretty great. So I do want to get back to us, correct what needs to be corrected, but as I said the elephant in the room is what I REALLY need to get processed and delt with.
I also stated in a previous post that none of my current children were accidents. I hate that description. Again I was just trying to give a brief background. I don't feel I was manipulated with any of my children. Now MAY be another story. We'll find out. My wife is great and our family is great, hopefully in the end we'll get back to that and more.
PF...such a good post above. I'm very glad that you two are heading to the counsellor on Tuesday. That's wonderful news. It's great that you love your wife and children enough to be willing to admit that there might be some changes which need to be made. From the sounds of things, you had a pretty good relationship and clearly, not a nagging wife. If you had, you'd have heard about things that are on her mind now....over and over again.
I hope that things work out for you two. I really hope that this counselling helps you both to look at things from a new perspective. I do think that the previous comments about your wife ALWAYS being a manipulative monster are waaaaay off base, I do think that your wife is not thinking clearly enough right now about the impact a divorce would have upoin her children, whom she obviously loves dearly. As for calling children "accidents"....well, that word slips out sometimes and for MOST people, that's all it is...a slip up. Children are never accidents, unPLANNED maybe...(USUALLY), but never accidents.
The OB/GYN may make sense as the first stop, but it's not going to be. Tuesday we go to counseling, but she is a marriage counselor and a mental health specialist.
Of course our marriage can improve and should improve. We've been going along in mommy mode and provider mode for too long. I don't think either of us were prepared for all this, even though considering the times and challenges we've done pretty great. So I do want to get back to us, correct what needs to be corrected, but as I said the elephant in the room is what I REALLY need to get processed and delt with.
I also stated in a previous post that none of my current children were accidents. I hate that description. Again I was just trying to give a brief background. I don't feel I was manipulated with any of my children. Now MAY be another story. We'll find out. My wife is great and our family is great, hopefully in the end we'll get back to that and more.
I wish you the best of luck! Hopefully the counselor will suggest the obgyn. Like you've said, she isn't behaving in her usual manner, that is a clue.
You sound pretty supportive, I think you'll work through it.
I hope your wife can find support as well as you.
I disagree with those who think any one who wants a big family is mentally ill. Just because most people want 0-2 kids doesn't make those who actually want more kids insane. I think that the problem is that people don't discuss these issues before marriage. This man should have married a woman who didn't want to be a mother and she should have married a man who wanted a large family.
I should have married someone who didn't want to be a mother? Where the hell are you getting that? Because I don't want 5 or more I don't want any? What the? Come on now. I love being a dad, I just don't want a village. That's all.
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Let's, see if I have her logic right: You won't give me what I want, I can't get what I want by leaving and leaving would destroy my children's family but I don't care because leaving hurts you and I'm determined to hurt you because you didn't give me what I wanted. Am I close?
