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And that is a far cry from what happened in this situation.
This child was ALONE. No other children, no bike, no playing, just sitting on a bench.
Actually, the mom doesn't say that he was "sitting" on the bench but rather that he was over by the bench, playing. Personally I don't think the distinction is noteworthy but since you do I thought I'd mention it. You can read the mom's words here. Haiku of the Day: September 2014
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Kids playing or running around in a group, is a completely different from a 6 year old sitting alone. I am sort of shocked you think they are the same thing.
We went over this awhile back and I do find it sad that kids can't play outside in many parts of the country like I did when I was a child due to this fear. Like charlygal notes, it's a self-perpetuating cycle
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Originally Posted by Meyerland
The difference between now and then is that we all hung out in a big gaggle of kids. The older ones looked out for the younger ones. Now it's rare to see kids out, so they would be out there alone.
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Originally Posted by charlygal
Then that means it's a self-perpetuating cycle.
Perhaps if the parents on a street got together to discuss something radical like...having their children play outside together, then maybe things would change.
People look down on urban environments but I believe more urban children play outside. In a place like NYC, keeping kids cooped up in apartments would be unbearable.
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Originally Posted by MissTerri
I agree. It is a self perpetuating cycle. If all or even most parents let their kids play outside then there would be plenty of kids outside playing and then the kids would have the "safety in numbers" and they could play together, like they used to, without all of the fear.
I think calling CPS might be the escalation of the mother who thinks she knows better than every other mother, but gossiping just isn't enough to satisfy her self-righteousness.
True Story, this happened when I was in college:
I lived in family housing, where female students (all female college) who had husbands or children could live. I was warned as soon as I moved there that there was one lady who was an extreme busybody and who wouldn't think twice to lecture someone else about how they should raise their child - she was definitely kept on the outside of the group because of this. There was one woman who lived in an apartment there with her young handicapped child - one day, that woman came home to find a note from CPS on her door, with a number to call immediately, because if she didn't call by a certain time, then officers would be coming by. She called the number right away, and did everything they asked of her, all of which was a fairly traumatic experience for her to go through. This was the complaint:
The child was left outside for hours in one of those little plastic pools.
The child regularly was left without supervision.
The child was never allowed to leave the house (except, apparently, when she was playing outside on her own).
CPS spoke to the parents, and the child's doctors, and determined that:
The complaints had been completely false:
The child couldn't play outside on her own, because she literally couldn't crawl or walk due to her genetic condition.
The child couldn't have been in a little pool by herself, because being unable to sit up on her own, she would have drowned in seconds.
The child regularly was outside of the house at doctor appointments, therapy appointments, and in specialized daycare. No one had anything negative to say about the parents - in fact, they (mom and her boyfriend) were hailed as being excellent parents to a child with a lot of very special needs.
The woman who made the complaint (we all knew who she was) moved out about a month later. We all shunned her, didn't want to have anything to do with her, and there were a number of people who confronted her about what she had done. She had gotten so self-righteous, and so involved in the life of a child who she dreamed-up was being abused in some way, that she felt it was OK to make up complete lies and try to get that child taken out of the home. It was completely insane. That mother's two sons are probably plotting their escape from their psycho mother's house as soon as they hit 18.
I think part of the reason why self-righteous crazies like that sometimes flourish, is because there's less of a community/neighborhood feeling today. We were all living in family housing together - a lot of us were single moms - we formed a community together, and our kids regularly ran around to all the apartments and played outside together. We were all in it together, and felt loyal to one another, so when one of us did something completely insane, the rest of us didn't let her get away with it. Today, so many people don't even know who their neighbors are. There's so often not a sense of community, so not only is there a disconnect among everyone, but there's no accountability to keep the nutsos in check.
I think your last paragraph is completely spot on accurate.
For the woman in the OP, I suspect if she and the neighbor knew each other, she might have brought the 6 yo home, and that would have been that. We are all guilty of not being as neighborly as our parents generation. That maybe a very large factor in these types of situations.
I was thinking about this thread today as I walked my dog on the local bike path, which has a park and a playground at one point. It is more like 250 yards from my house, and I was trying to think of what I would do if I saw a very young child (and really the boy in the op could have been as young as 4 based on his picture) that I didn't know sitting alone on one of the benches. I am not really sure what I would have done, but it would likely have been an non-issue if it was actually I child I knew. If I knew him, I likely would have just stopped at his house on the way home to make sure someone knew where he was. But not knowing him definitely changes what my reaction would be. Interesting to think about the relationship between the loss of that "neighborly-ness" and the rise of reporting parents to CPS.
If he was sitting on the bench maybe he was just daydreaming not distressed. Children can enjoy having moments alone too don't assume just because he was sitting on a bench alone that he was sad. If he was within eye sight of his Mom and she was watching him I think it is fine. Kids need some independence to develop self confidence.
It is possible that the neighbor did not call CPS. The police many have contacted them because there was an issue with a child and they are required to by law.
Those are very different things. If you arrived at the park with your own children. No one was there but a six year old not playing, not with anyone else, but sitting alone on a bench, you wouldn't think that noteworthy?
I don't think it's noteworthy. That's a common occurrence here. Sometimes they're with a group of friends and sometimes they're alone, probably waiting/hoping for other kids to show up.
It's more noteworthy that there is a family that lives across the street from me with five children who rarely leave their house. They are outside in their yard for about an hour twice a month. In the past six years, I have never seen them play with other children. The parents sit outside a significant portion of the day while the children are inside. This concerns me because it's similar to the most extreme abuse cases that end up in the news after years of victims being isolated from society before they finally get help.
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Originally Posted by lkb0714
Children who are neglected or abused are more often than not, NOT visibly distressed.
That hasn't been my experience the times I have intervened.
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Originally Posted by lkb0714
I guess what this comes down to is which do you value more, a child's welfare, or parents privacy.
I've seen children's welfare be worse off after the authorities were called for no reason. I'd never call over something as trivial as a child playing alone outside unless there were additional circumstances to indicating there was a reason to be concerned.
What I find interesting is that if the child had been abducted or hit by a car, everyone who is currently supporting the mom would have been saying "Where were the parents? Who was watching that kid?"
Exactly! We're also only hearing the mom's side of it. There's the neighbors, police, CPS, and somewhere in the middle is what really happened. For all we know this has happened in the past and the neighbor did nothing. There could be 12 sex offenders on their block also. None of us were there or have them for neighbors, but people are real quick to say what they would do.
1 - I am absolutely horrified that some of you think that a child sitting on a bench is cause for alarm. I was totally that kid when I was little. I wasn't abused - I was just daydreaming. I am an introvert and liked to just sit and relax and unwind during recess instead of running around and socializing. One of my daughters is similar in temperament. I'm appalled that some people might take the sight of her sitting around as a sign that she "might be" abused.
2 - Setting up an argument for "parents' privacy vs. caring about children's welfare" is a straw man argument. I care about both. It's not an either/or thing.
3 - My opinions on this have remained the same throughout my now seven years of parenting, but recently they've become more pronounced because I've lived through the nightmare of a situation much like this one. Basically a summer of our lives was taken up because of a "well-meaning, concerned" (i.e. busybody) individual who called CPS on our family. It wasn't just a "harmless little investigation" - someone who has not lived through it cannot imagine how intrusive and threatening it is to have a complete stranger in a position of authority assume that you are hurting or neglecting the very children you center your lives around. They really do assume you are guilty until you somehow prove yourself innocent - and even then, they just send you a pretty little letter saying that they couldn't prove you were doing what you were accused of, but your sealed records will stay on state file until ten years after your youngest turns 18. Lovely.
Look, as much as this experience sucked for us, I'm still in support of CPS generally. I understand that these investigations are a necessary evil to have in a society where we want to keep tabs on kids' welfare. And in the cases where kids need help - I am all for getting them help. Obviously. Who isn't?? What I'm really concerned about is the trend in people saying, "let's call just in this case so they can check up on the family and make sure nothing is going on" types of cases. They're NOT a benign group of nice supernannies who swoop in and makes sure everything is going well before flitting off somewhere else. They are a government organization with the power to remove children from their homes. Would the neighbor in this instance have wanted the boy removed from his mother's home because he was sitting on a bench in a park? Really, did she think he would be better off in foster care in that situation? No? Well, then don't call CPS (or the police, who will then call CPS).
And I personally know several acquaintances that have lived through these types of investigations, by spiteful neighbors, relatives, etc. Were their kids removed, no. They were investigated, the accusations considered unfounded, cases closed - the system worked "as it should." But no one talks about good parents being investigated, because really, why would you bring that up to someone? It's so shaming to be questioned like that. I'm glad more people are speaking out about these types of things.
CPS is a necessary agency. It also needs reforms, clear guidelines for parents as to when they can and cannot leave their kids alone, changes in "mandatory reporting" guidelines, changes in the foster care system... Just changes overall. I'm not hating on them, or on anyone who genuinely is concerned with kids' welfare. But these things are traumatizing and need to be addressed by society so the innocent families don't continue to suffer investigations while traumatized kids are not being helped enough. (FWIW I don't envy the workers' jobs, either - damned if they do, damned if they don't!!)
If he was sitting on the bench maybe he was just daydreaming not distressed. Children can enjoy having moments alone too don't assume just because he was sitting on a bench alone that he was sad. If he was within eye sight of his Mom and she was watching him I think it is fine. Kids need some independence to develop self confidence.
I don't think it's noteworthy. That's a common occurrence here. Sometimes they're with a group of friends and sometimes they're alone, probably waiting/hoping for other kids to show up.
It's more noteworthy that there is a family that lives across the street from me with five children who rarely leave their house. They are outside in their yard for about an hour twice a month. In the past six years, I have never seen them play with other children. The parents sit outside a significant portion of the day while the children are inside. This concerns me because it's similar to the most extreme abuse cases that end up in the news after years of victims being isolated from society before they finally get help.
You have no idea of why that is. My nephew has Gorlin's syndrome. He looks normal, they don't discuss it with nonfamily members but it keeps him and his brother inside almost all the time. For all you know the kids may have something similar.
But if you are concerned that children are being abused. You have a moral obligation to report them to CPS and the legal right to do so just based on your limited exposure.
I suppose this goes back to the idea, that parental privacy does not supersede even potential child abuse.
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That hasn't been my experience the times I have intervened.
Ok. That is your experience. And if based on that you choose not to report that is your business. That doesn't make your experience the only acceptable response.
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I've seen children's welfare be worse off after the authorities were called for no reason. I'd never call over something as trivial as a child playing alone outside unless there were additional circumstances to indicating there was a reason to be concerned.
All we have is a mothers blog post about this. No police or CPS report, no neighbors account. Clearly the mother is going to portray herself in the best possible light while generating drama and this readership for her blog. We have no idea how trivial it was or was not.
And even it went down exactly as claimed, the neighbor may have had her reasons to suspect an issue that we haven't heard about.
And THAT is why no reforms seriously get made to CPS. Because once someone speaks out about the experience of this agency, they are immediately discredited by the majority of people. "Well, but that's HER side of the story - the REAL story must be something else" - "Of course she wouldn't say what OTHER things she did wrong to get accused" - "There MUST have been more to it." And on and on and on it goes.
What if there really and truly wasn't more to the story? Not just in this case, but in thousands of other cases? CPS is never going to come out and admit that. Heck, they never even really declare you innocent, even if they declare your case "unfounded".
And once you've been accused, God help you if you try to appeal to anyone after that, whether it be the public at large via blog/newspaper/interview or to a friend, a family member, anyone. If you do reveal the fact that you've had an investigation, you can pretty much bet that most people will think, "Hmm, I wonder what ELSE is going on! I never would have guessed THEIR family would get investigated. Only BAD parents get investigated." Or some version of that - maybe not that dramatic, but something akin to that. And then they go and think, "Come to think of it, little Johnny did have some bruises on his legs last Spring... True, he did take soccer with all the other little kids, but maybe that's more proof of abuse!" And so on and so forth.
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