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Old 02-02-2009, 08:04 AM
 
Location: Nottingham, United Kingdom
151 posts, read 272,384 times
Reputation: 39

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Thats just it! Humans aren't responsible creatures.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:07 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,032 posts, read 8,921,785 times
Reputation: 1973
Quote:
Originally Posted by LondonBoy View Post
Thats just it! Humans aren't responsible creatures.
Many of us are. Yet we still end up paying unfairly for those who are not.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:08 AM
 
Location: Nottingham, United Kingdom
151 posts, read 272,384 times
Reputation: 39
Where's the public outcry for that?

*Looks everywhere* There isn't one!
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:09 AM
 
733 posts, read 1,928,540 times
Reputation: 449
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
If I had a pregnancy and there was a disorder that could be determined before birth I would have no problem aborting. I would consider it the responsible thing to do.
They would have given me that option if they knew...
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Nottingham, United Kingdom
151 posts, read 272,384 times
Reputation: 39
But isn't it wrong to abort babies with afflictions?

I've got a mild disability and consider my kind a threatened species if mothers had no choice but to abort. Some babies are disabled for a reason.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:19 AM
 
Location: mass
2,905 posts, read 7,350,665 times
Reputation: 5011
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrsMtnsOnTheMind View Post
That would be Palestine.

Point?????????????

Even if her parents are from Palestine, the likelihood is that the mother was born here.

As much as I think the woman has *mental issues* for getting fertility treatments when not even married,, clearly the media is harassing the family at the home. Her father cannot even put two children on the bus w/out reporters hounding him.

WHOA, MOMMA!!! - New York Post

The fact of the matter is there will be a lot of interest in her story and most likely she will be paid for telling it, which should help her support the children. Plus, I am sure that there will be enough people out there willing to donate their needs.

Is it completely unethical that a doctor allowed this woman to be implanted w/that many embryos? YES! Crazy her and crazy doctor. I mean really, who would do such a thing. But at this point they are here. They need to be taken care of. The woman, while single, has two parents who appear to be willing to stand behind her and help her.

If she can make some money off her story that will definitely benefit the family. She is already shopping around for deals to net her $2 million. (And she'll probably get it)

Although, that is dangerous because the more glorified these pregnancies are the more idiots out there will be willing to endure these high risk multiple birth pregnancies.

The real issue here is not why she wanted these children, or whether a single woman should be able to get fertility treatments (With a 50% divorce rate why would we bother to require someone to be married), or even how many kids someone has (I come from a French Canadian background, my mother has 7 brothers and sisters, and huge families are not unknown) but:
HOW COULD A DOCTOR BE ALLOWED TO IMPLANT SOOOO MANY EMBRYOS????? There should be some regulations preventing this. Especially when the women that become pregnant w/this many fetuses refuse to abort some of them to give the others a chance to survive.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:28 AM
 
3,106 posts, read 9,125,448 times
Reputation: 2278
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
Look at it this way - food is a gift from God, but too much food will make you ill.
Well, for a society/family more children than you can responsibly overlook and provide guidance and an education for sometimes makes society ill.

Hey. If you are wealthy and can hire nannys and housekeepers and spend lots of time with the darlings, fine. Chances are, the more kids a person has, they are going to get some who are problems, healthwise and sometimes just difficult to manage. You cannot make assumptions that they all will be great.
Just one of those problem children can destroy a marriage.
It is roulette, and sometimes you don't know the outcome until it's too late.
I don't disagree with what you're saying. This is a case of things being taken way too far. I am completely against the abuse of ART and it seems like this is a case of that from everything I've read. I haven't said anything about the children other than that they will have an uphill battle trying to become healthy babies and as 1 of 14 children, each of those children will never receive the individual care they deserve.

My only disagreement was that I personally don't see my children as a science project. Did science and medical technology help get them here? Yes. Absolutely. I would never deny that. My religious faith has nothing to do with that for me. Others may feel differently for themselves.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SuSuSushi View Post
If you believe in god, then you must also believe god "created" you infertile on purpose. Apparently though, you're willing to go against "god's will" and use medical science to change how god created you to be.

How then can you be critical of those of us who don't see those children as "gifts" from god?
No one here knows how any of us (me included) views how they live their faith. You are all assuming that I live my faith in absolutes. I do not. I believe in God but I do not take things literally and some of the decisions I've made go directly against the teachings of my faith. Why is that such a problem for those of you that do not believe in God or a god? So many of you are crying foul that you're being criticized but I haven't seen anyone attacking non-believers on this thread.

By your logic if the following people all believe in God:

*a child is born with a cleft palate - was CREATED that way. Should that child not undergo surgery to correct the problem?

*Cancer patients - They're not supposed to get treatment because God gave them cancer and science created the technology that might cure them. So they should just live with it, suffer through the stages of cancer without any morphine and die without any medical attention;

*Someone has diabetes that is God-given. Because medical science came up with insulin and glucophage, they should not take those drugs but succumb to blindness, dead limbs, kidney and liver damage and eventually die from their illness.

*Someone has MS and cannot walk, has spasticity and other problems so because their illness is also "god-given", they should not have a powered wheelchair (engineered by "science"), not take anti-spastics such as Baclofen because drugs are all created by man and just sit in a bed while society takes care of them.

I do not debate that this woman got herself and those children into a very bad situation. She's obviously got some problems that will now affect 14 individual lives (and taxpayers as being debated heatedly). She abused ART and now many will suffer because of her actions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelstress View Post
Dontch know? She obviously thought God erred with her and needed to be corrected! So she did! So they're actually a gift from herself... and her doctor.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:38 AM
 
Location: The Hall of Justice
25,901 posts, read 42,706,825 times
Reputation: 42769
Quote:
Originally Posted by goldengrain View Post
If I had a pregnancy and there was a disorder that could be determined before birth I would have no problem aborting. I would consider it the responsible thing to do.
I'm glad I live in a country where you are free to have this opinion and speak it, while I am free not to be ruled by it. Abortion is a woman's personal choice.
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:44 AM
 
Location: Nottingham, United Kingdom
151 posts, read 272,384 times
Reputation: 39
What about the man involved?
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Old 02-02-2009, 08:49 AM
 
Location: Montrose, CA
3,032 posts, read 8,921,785 times
Reputation: 1973
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sampaguita View Post

By your logic if the following people all believe in God:

<snipped for brevity>

No, the real answer is that god didn't make you infertile AND god had nothing to do with your children being born/conceived.
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