In Philadelphia, can you feel a difference between someone from a NJ suburb vs one from a PA suburb? (Chester: to buy, living)

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by rotodome

I think the question was whether the PEOPLE were different. Not whether you could tell a difference between the places, or their road design idiosyncracies.

haha oh. I misread that, I though the question was whether or not there was difference in the suburbs themselves. of course the people are the same. haha well I'll blame my senseless answer on the question being so pointless I assumed it must have been asking something else... alright fine, I'll take a little of the blame.

Originally Posted by scosm

Jug handles and traffic circles aren't a big deal to me, but the fact that most of the major roads in NJ seem to be highway-lite with 6 lanes and a median is not to my liking. I've driven through Cherry Hill many times, shopped at various stores there, visited the library and yet I have no idea what Cherry Hill is really like. That is on me of course because I haven't bothered to go off the main roads but if you drove on Lancaster Ave through the main line you would get a much better sense of, say, Bryn Mawr.

This has nothing to do with the people of course who I have no problem with.

not that it really matters at this point considering as it turns out my whole point was off topic but for those that care, this is what I'm talking about. It's not that I find the nj roads or a jug handle confusing... it's just I don't think any benefit they provide comes even close to making up for how much less walkable and ugly they make the street.

All I'm saying is that if most of these roads were turned into a regular 4 lane avenues with traffic lights, that is NOT divided, doesn't have unramps or jug handles or any other nonsense, I don't think it would really impact traffic negatively in any real way and would make the streets a lot more walkable.

In all PA suburbs there are big roads/minor highways like Street Rd (132) and Baltimore pike (1) and to walk across them doesn't feel like running across a highway. Baltimore Pike for example doesn't cut Springfield in half as much as it runs through it, those highways in NJ though? They seem to totally fracture southern NJ.

Originally Posted by frankgn87

We love it over here . Riverton still has gas lamps lit every night in town. How cool is that?

Anyway, the jughandles are a wonderful idea! There are no left turns off the main highways which makes traffic move faster and no accidents when people jam on their brakes to make the left, causing everyone behind to do the same.. Its an idea that should have incorporated since the beginning of road design. Think about it..

It's not that I disagree with the point of juggle handles, it's just I don't think their benefit makes up for wasting all the space and money that creating them necessitates, especially when the end benefit in my mind is totally destroyed by how ugly and unwalkable they make the roads.

I agree Riverton is beautiful. Seeing my friends more over in NJ has made me realize that southern NJ has a lot of cute little old town with a classic main street. I don't think people realize how many nice little towns there are right over the river... that's the main reason I think it's such a shame these overbuilt highway monstrosities make it virtually impossible to take a nice bike ride from one of these areas to the next.

[tom_567]

Originally Posted by soug

I agree these highways aren't the most attractive. There have been plans to "boulevardize" Rt.70 and the like before but no action has ever been taken.

Southern NJ will always be mostly highways. I think there are pockets of sensible old-town design - the Haddon Avenue strip is very city like. Architecturally, parts of Colllingswood even remind me of a flat Manayunk. The river towns are cool, actually.

Thank God no one has tried to encourage pedestrian use of Route 70. Aesthetics aside, 70 was designed as a state highway for long-distance travel. Also, did you ever notice NJ's state highway entrance sign? It says "No Pedestrians, No Bicycles, No Horses." Fun fact - NJ must explicit tell horse riders if they cannot use a state road.

You already can stakeboard on the shoulder through the Erlton section of Route 70W faster than you can drive it since the road seems like it was last paved in 1980 and the traffic crawls as 3 lanes merge into 2. The last thing that section of road needs is pedestrians.

Considering how much empty commercial lease space is available in the 70 shopping centers right now, I'm shocked that the state doesn't try to entice the Erlton shops to move and expand the highway properly to 3 lanes in each direction with an ugly concrete barrier.

It wouldn't look pretty, but maybe I could get 30 minutes of my life back on a daily basis!

[frankgn87]

Originally Posted by phillies2011

I agree Riverton is beautiful. Seeing my friends more over in NJ has made me realize that southern NJ has a lot of cute little old town with a classic main street. I don't think people realize how many nice little towns there are right over the river... that's the main reason I think it's such a shame these overbuilt highway monstrosities make it virtually impossible to take a nice bike ride from one of these areas to the next.

Ever go to Haddonfield? Take a trip there over the next few friday nights. Here is the schedule. its amazing.

Shophaddonfieldnj.com, a website all about Shopping in Haddonfield featuring the Shop Haddonfield Club, retail specials and Town events


I see what you mean about jug handles BUT if you were the one who gets rear ended while trying to make a left off a high speed 4 lane highway, you would love em really fast

[phillies2011]

Originally Posted by frankgn87

Ever go to Haddonfield? Take a trip there over the next few friday nights. Here is the schedule. its amazing.

Shophaddonfieldnj.com, a website all about Shopping in Haddonfield featuring the Shop Haddonfield Club, retail specials and Town events


I see what you mean about jug handles BUT if you were the one who gets rear ended while trying to make a left off a high speed 4 lane highway, you would love em really fast

nah never been to haddonfield before. looks nice.

agree that if someone doesn't properly signal a turn or if someone is not paying attention and tailgating too close, someone can be rear ended when trying to make a left hand turn. But if people actually do what they're supposed to do and properly signal there is no issue. That's the problem with jughandles, they act as though they solve a problem in design... when in reality they're trying to solve a human behavior problem. If used properly both the jug handle system and a regular undivided 4 lane roadway shouldn't result in any crashes! But of course the undivided 4 lane roadway came first and there were accidents because people were making mistakes... so they replace it with jug handles because on the drawing board it solves the problem that already existed and if used properly should work perfectly. What they don't take into account however is the fact that if people screwed up the old system they're going to screw up this system as well. Morons who can't figure out how to use this relatively simple system make illegal left turns and u turns, people trying to make a left get in the left lane and then realize suddenly they need to be in the right lane to use the jughandle to make the turn and then suddenly dive across lanes of traffic to do so.

haha i mean honestly frank, you must be driving these roads more than I am and the few times i do drive them it's a total s**tshow. I refuse to believe this system is any safer than the more common system used throughout most of the rest of the country. Driving down I73 is a MUCH more harrowing experience than driving down baltimore pike or street road. So yea they solve some problems but they create others and the fact that in general visitors not familiar with the area have NO IDEA how to drive these roads just makes them more dangerous... and on top of all that, they cost more money, take up a ton more space, drastically decrease walkability and pedestrian safety and last but not least look awful.

that's at least my two cents.

[UDResident]

Originally Posted by john_starks

this has been going on for a while. when you say that you're from NYC, you're from NYC. whenever, you say that you live in Philly, its never the actual city - bizarre. people are like , ok so ambler? conshahoken, landsldale, west chester, upper darby?

W...T...F, how about i live in Philly


nobody from greenwhich, CT, Kearny, NJ or massapequa, LI say they're from NYC

Haha man, you must not know too many people from Delco. It's really only the people in places without their own identity that tend to say they're from Philly. If you ask somebody from Clifton, UD, Sharon Hill, Yeadon, Darby, etc etc where they're from, they'll tell you they're from that particular neighborhood. They may even say their street haha

[97701]

In Philly and south Jersey, there is something that is clearly identifiable as from being from there.

People say "wooder" in place of of how others say "water". Seriously. Here in Oregon I have picked out some Philly / south Jersey people based on that with no mistakes. It is that distinctive. I've lived in Moorestown NJ and that's how I know.

[ElijahAstin]

Originally Posted by 97701

In Philly and south Jersey, there is something that is clearly identifiable as from being from there.

People say "wooder" in place of of how others say "water". Seriously. Here in Oregon I have picked out some Philly / south Jersey people based on that with no mistakes. It is that distinctive. I've lived in Moorestown NJ and that's how I know.

Wooder is pretty common, but not quite everyone says it, such as myself (and I otherwise have a fairly typical suburban Philly accent).

[NJhighlands87]

I think it depends which suburbs you're talking about. From what I've seen, Philly suburbs tend to have more of main street downtown area, as well as a train station. As others have mentioned, SJ was farms until the 70s and was never endowed with a decent commuter public transit network. Haddonfield, Collingswood, and the Riverline towns make a decent effort, but Cherry Hill/Mount Laurel are generally more typical.

Slightly off topic, but I've found Philly suburbs more closely resemble North Jersey suburbs. Some of this is geography, the hills, forests, and farms on the PA side remind me a lot of the northwest Jersey countryside. North Jersey suburbs tend to have better public transit, older buildings, bigger downtowns, and a lot more wealth in general, reflected in the recent trend towards making every North Jersey downtown a miniature block of Manhattan with pricey independent restaurants and boutiques. Not sure if this is true of Main Line towns in PA.

As for people, there's a bit of a difference, though I can't really put a finger on it. For example, even though King of Prussia area more closely resembles my home area, there's a comfort feeling of being at Cherry Hill Mall that I just don't get at KOP. Might be the jug handles...

[frankgn87]

Originally Posted by NJhighlands87

I

As for people, there's a bit of a difference, though I can't really put a finger on it. For example, even though King of Prussia area more closely resembles my home area, there's a comfort feeling of being at Cherry Hill Mall that I just don't get at KOP. Might be the jug handles...

I know what you mean. Even tho I was pa born and raised I felt NJ always had a closer connection to my heart as it does with my wife.. Even as kids we loved to cross the bridge to Jersey and shop at the Pennsauken mart, Berlin mart, Cherry hill mall and of course the shore!

[cricky]

Not as much as a person from NE philly vs. a person from South Philly.