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I never said they were false. I just disagree with your racist solution.
There are disparities. Each person is an individual however, and should be judged as such.
If a poor white kid and a poor black kid apply to a college, should one be given the upper hand based on race?
To answer that question truthfully would go against the liberal mindset that "we're all equal". We are not and some are treated special. We did this to ourselves and too many are in denial that it's not working out the way it was supposed to.
I never said they were false. I just disagree with your racist solution.
There are disparities. Each person is an individual however, and should be judged as such.
If a poor white kid and a poor black kid apply to a college, should one be given the upper hand based on race?
No you haven't answered a single question nor have you disproved the article, stop attempting to avoid the issues presented.
But just to answer your question because it is so simple minded easy, the poor white kid would be included in an "under represented group" and receive benefit for that, and being that most psychology journals suggest we favor those that look most like us, this poor white kid will stack up pretty well.
The poor black lid will also receive credit as a member of an "under represented group" and his "life experiences" may also be considered, so he'll stack up pretty well.
Bottom line, it's a coin toss.
Now that I have answered the question that you hope will veer the conversation into another direction (it won't) let's get back to the original topic.
You have yet to disprove my statements or the content of my article.
You can't and therefore refuse to engage it on that level
Quote:
I just disagree with your racist solution.
Exactly what racist solution did I propose??..are you on medication at this time??
What about the benefits of being a member of the upper-middle class (which is all that's really left of the middle class anyway) or the true upper class?
What about the children of parents who are well-connected, educated and can 1) prep their kids 2) pull necessary strings 3) Have the wherewithall to do whatever it takes to get their kid into a better college, a better lawfirm, a better starting position at merril-lynch?
It's becoming more and more about those in the top 2-5% and everyone else is just scrambling for a piece. One step further, does even just an undergraduate degree from a middle of the road college guarantee a good life anymore? It's more in line with 'Death of a Salesman' that the American Dream may not be as healty as it once was. The fact that success is no longer a certainty unless you got into H/Y/P or have uber-advanced degrees, so this affirmitive action we're arguing about is just the first step.
Today you can come out of school with 200k in loans and a degree in sociology and be in trouble job wise.
The days of greatness with just a bachelor's from the University of Wyoming w/o connections are over.
You won't get an honest answer, don't wait for it.
No, it's not a coin toss. Maybe in your opinion but stats show otherwise.
Poor Blacks and Hispanics will get chosen over poor Whites or Asians.
Discrimination Against Whites in College Admissions - College Reviews : College Reviews
So what’s the solution? Whatever it is, it’s no doubt complicated, and politically untenable. It would seem a more appropriate response would be to try and close the achievement gap amongst black and Hispanic students, so that schools don’t need to discriminate against whites just to get their desired diversity ratios.
But a kid (black, white, whatever) who's gone as far as he could on his own talent, that is just 'there' should be afforded the opportunity to get into college, if they've shown in other areas that they can excel- Again we're talking about kids who are just shy of the standards, not the baskeball prodigy that can't count to ten (they'll get in regardless- black, white or whatever)
No you haven't answered a single question nor have you disproved the article, stop attempting to avoid the issues presented.
You're really all over the place here. If you have a direct question, go ahead and ask it.
I never tried to disprove the article, as I just stated very clearly. I take issue with racial considerations in admittance policies. This would include admittance policies that favor white males simply because they are white males.
This thread is a discussion on the Young Republicans doing a bake sale with a pricing structure intended to mock the concept of diversity quotas. You come in here and start going on about rich white people, so I assume you are taking the position that unfair diversity quotas are okay in response to other unfair realities. I disagree.
If I've misunderstood your position, feel free to enlighten me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by reconmark
But just to answer your question because it is so simple minded easy, the poor white kid would be included in an "under represented group" and receive benefit for that, and being that most psychology journals suggest we favor those that look most like us, this poor white kid will stack up pretty well.
The poor black lid will also receive credit as a member of an "under represented group" and his "life experiences" may also be considered, so he'll stack up pretty well.
Bottom line, it's a coin toss.
So we agree. No one should be given preference based on race.
In any case, there needs to be some accounting that schools in poorer districts, regardless of race, do not have the same amount of AP, IB, test prep opportunities, etc. Not to mention the parents are less likely to be educated themselves and are unable/unwilling to bring up their children to be highly successful in school, nor are they likely to know anything about what it takes to get into a competitive college. A kid who is smart in that environment is not likely to have the same grades as his/her counterpart in a higher tax bracket.
That may be the case but think of it this way: If that student is accepted into a college, what's to say he can now learn the study skills, etc. necessary for successfully finishing college? He may drop out and that spot could have gone to someone who would finish.
You're really all over the place here. If you have a direct question, go ahead and ask it.
I never tried to disprove the article, as I just stated very clearly. I take issue with racial considerations in admittance policies. This would include admittance policies that favor white males simply because they are white males.
This thread is a discussion on the Young Republicans doing a bake sale with a pricing structure intended to mock the concept of diversity quotas. You come in here and start going on about rich white people, so I assume you are taking the position that unfair diversity quotas are okay in response to other unfair realities. I disagree.
If I've misunderstood your position, feel free to enlighten me.
So we agree. No one should be given preference based on race.
If you believe that I have "agreed" with you on anything, well that speaks for itself.
My articles backed up my assertions, exactly where have you offered up anything other than unsupported opinions??..where exactly have you disproved anything I've said, anything??
The majority of students at top tier universities don't come from "rich white families" really.
Ask the army of privileged white students who could afford a private or group math tutor, English tutor, SAT tutoring and coaching, ACT coaching.
Ask them if all that money spent to give them an upper hand resulted in the lowering of standards or the admittance of marginal students let in due to the ability to pay for the preparation.
Army? I went to a well to-do high school and most kids didn't do that stuff. Some did group SAT classes but that's it.
Med school- off the MCAT mark by 1-2 points, but have a ton of research experience and you're well-published.
Law school- close on LSATS, but also excelled at statewide debate, did summer internships for a bigger law firm.
Or from highschool- You're close on GPA cutoff but also ran your family's store, providing income or worked nights to support your brothers and sisters.
Again these are 'close' cases I'm talking about...
But I understand how someone would be upset if their kid was passed over for another kid. No one's going to feel sorry for my daughter coming out a wealthy enclave and boarding school- but she's not the one who'd be on the bubble (or at least shouldn't if we do our job right). My daughter would likely have multiple options, it's the kid with limited options that needs help.
To flip it- say if both our kids were going for Anonymous Tier I college, our kids are equal- but mine is a legacy. I also give big to athletics and the chancellor goes to my church. So your kid who is evenly matched will get the shaft versus mine- just because her parents didn't have the wherewithall to be alums...
Is that fair?
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