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In my opinion those clerks defying the tyrants in Washington are patriots. The federal government has no right to violate the state of Alabama's rights the way it has. This is about our bill of rights, it is about the freedom of states to make their own laws which reflect their own values. This is so much bigger than the gay issue. I support a states right to legalize gay marriage if its people chose it. If you don't like the laws of your state you are free to move. What I can never support is the federal government usurping the 10th amendment in order to force the liberal agenda on "red state America" because that is the only way they will ever get their agenda through there. I am glad that someone has had the guts to do this, most conservative states folded out of fear of the federal power. Time to stand up and tell these federal tyrants we will have no more. Our founding fathers had the guts to challenge tyrants, and the confederacy had the guts to stand up to federal tyrants. What I am trying to say is that our ancestors would not have put up with this without challenging it. We need people in this nation like this state judge and the county officials who are enforcing their state laws, in spite of this unconstitutional act by the federal government. I hope their spirit spreads like a wild fire across the red states, from the south to the mountain west, its time we assert our rights. Kudos to the patriots in our neighboring state to the south
That's right. Civil rights be damned!
You realize that there are amendments after the 10th, right? Those are every bit as valid as anything in the US Constitution. Including the 14th. Here is the text in question, I've underlined the important parts for your convenience (and for dramatic effect):
"No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
There is nothing wrong with wanting to preserve a moral standard that has been in place since the inception of this country.
So it's okay to be a bigot, it's our moral standard?
Slavery was our moral standard too, it was here since the inception of our country. We realized it was a pretty bad moral standard and changed it, however. I would like to think we're a nation that evolves past our mistakes and injustices...
In my opinion those clerks defying the tyrants in Washington are patriots. The federal government has no right to violate the state of Alabama's rights the way it has. This is about our bill of rights, it is about the freedom of states to make their own laws which reflect their own values. This is so much bigger than the gay issue. I support a states right to legalize gay marriage if its people chose it. If you don't like the laws of your state you are free to move. What I can never support is the federal government usurping the 10th amendment in order to force the liberal agenda on "red state America" because that is the only way they will ever get their agenda through there. I am glad that someone has had the guts to do this, most conservative states folded out of fear of the federal power. Time to stand up and tell these federal tyrants we will have no more. Our founding fathers had the guts to challenge tyrants, and the confederacy had the guts to stand up to federal tyrants. What I am trying to say is that our ancestors would not have put up with this without challenging it. We need people in this nation like this state judge and the county officials who are enforcing their state laws, in spite of this unconstitutional act by the federal government. I hope their spirit spreads like a wild fire across the red states, from the south to the mountain west, its time we assert our rights. Kudos to the patriots in our neighboring state to the south
I love how people talk about "their constitutional rights", yet fail to realize that the 14th amendment is also there. For the most part none of the judges did anything remotely like you are saying. They are simply refusing the cater to either sex at this point. That's not real upholding state laws as much as it's covering their asses. Since by law heterosexual marriage is legal in the state. If they were standing up to the judge who ordered the law to be struck down they would simply ignore it altogether. Once the next ruling comes down ordering them to begin issuing licenses or stand before the judge we will see just how many are willing to stand up and give her the middle finger .
You realize that there are amendments after the 10th, right? Those are every bit as valid as anything in the US Constitution. Including the 14th. Here is the text in question, I've underlined the important parts for your convenience (and for dramatic effect):
"No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
So it's okay to be a bigot, it's our moral standard?
Slavery was our moral standard too, it was here since the inception of our country. We realized it was a pretty bad moral standard and changed it, however. I would like to think we're a nation that evolves past our mistakes and injustices...
Some of the people on this board seem to believe that the first 10 amendments are somehow greater than all the rest. That anytime there is a conflict the first 10 will nullify an amendment that comes after it.
I don't care. You don't understand the South. You're just a partisan who defines your ideas as "progress" so therefore people who don't agree with you are backwards. That makes you the bigot.
What incredible self-ratifying nonsense. Gabe is referring to a litany of progress in our society for which there have been pockets of reactionaryism. It isn't limited to the South though. Reactionaryism and the rationalization of obstruction of progress can be found in other places as well. You lash out at others in apparently frustration that you cannot defend your perspective on the merits: You know that reasonable people, when looking at the changes outside of the context of how the changes affect them personally, acknowledge and recognize their progressive nature. It must suck to be a reactionary, without any reasonable argument to make to defend your perspective, simply because you are unwilling to grant that others have the right to live their lives, within their own skin, within their own families, within their own churches, as they see fit rather than in compliance with your obsolete preferences.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffbase40
There is nothing wrong with wanting to preserve a moral standard that has been in place since the inception of this country.
I'm confused. Are you referring to the moral standard that claimed that it was right for white people to enslave black people, or are you referring to something else?
Does the South always have to be the last area of the country to achieve social progress and be forced by the federal government to adapt these changes despite the opposition from its conservative politicians. From integration to education to gay rights it always seems like the South lags far behind the rest of the country. Will it always be this way or will the federal government always have to drag it kicking and screaming into the modern era?
And for those who say I don't understand the South I lived in North Carolina from age 6 to age 26.
Well to be fair, the majority of states have had to have the courts strike these bans down. I think it's more rooted *for the most part* in long instilled social values and some ignorance than anything. The other states in which this was stuck down haven't done anything remotely like this, so I would say this is more due to nature of the state and the yahoo voted into office than anything.
no. Refusal to give your citizens the access to rights enjoyed by every other resident in your state makes YOU the bigot. People in the south have very many fine qualities, but fall short when it comes to recognizing that all americans should share in the same rights and freedoms.
Marriage has limits. Marriage is discrimination.
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