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Old 11-16-2018, 09:10 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
1,081 posts, read 549,603 times
Reputation: 964

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vacanegro View Post
So you can water the liberty trees with the blood of patriots or some such nonsense ?



Not that any management proposal is going to work but if guns really kept anyone safe then our 300 + million would make the US the safest place on earth, which it obviously isn't.
Guns actually do make people safer:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsi.../#6061e571299a


Lives protected by Defensive Gun Use far outweighs the loss of lives by gun use, by hundreds of thousands, in this country.

As long as there are people willing to do evil, someone will suffer. Taking away guns from law abiding owners will only cause more people to suffer, not less.
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Old 11-16-2018, 09:31 AM
 
29,552 posts, read 9,737,716 times
Reputation: 3473
Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlEsc View Post
Guns actually do make people safer:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsi.../#6061e571299a

Lives protected by Defensive Gun Use far outweighs the loss of lives by gun use, by hundreds of thousands, in this country.

As long as there are people willing to do evil, someone will suffer. Taking away guns from law abiding owners will only cause more people to suffer, not less.
My compliments on providing something to consider in terms of substantiating your opinion, but I have read much about this argument, and I think AT BEST this from your article remains the case...

My own preliminary conclusions:

1) We still don’t really know how many defensive gun uses (DGUs) there are each year.

The article is not really much more than the opinion of one journalist who rightly concludes the above, but he does point out some of the difficult issues/challenges when it comes to proving this argument that I tend to be very skeptical about given all else I have also read about this.

There is the issue of how honest people are when answering surveys like this. I have a hunch gun enthusiasts tend to exaggerate the truth sometimes in line with their agenda. How many gun accidents are included in the numbers that determine whether we are more or less safe thanks to people packing/using? Did they count when our VP Cheney shot Whittington for example? What's considered "Defensive Gun Use?" Is gang violence included? Bad guys with guns protecting themselves against bad guys with guns? Hard to tell if a person answering a survey is a gang member. I used to sleep on the sofa in my buddy's house for a time when I was young, and he liked to answer any knock at the door at night with his shotgun in his hand. He thought it was a form of DGU even though he never used the shotgun against anyone.

Here's another what to read for your consideration before we are too quick to conclude either way...

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/hs...e-suggests-no/
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:23 AM
 
Location: So Ca
26,748 posts, read 26,841,237 times
Reputation: 24800
Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlEsc View Post
Guns actually do make people safer:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/paulhsi.../#6061e571299a
Sorry; a paper by a Florida State University professor and somebody's blog do not qualify as valid data. Those are opinions.
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:31 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
1,081 posts, read 549,603 times
Reputation: 964
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
Sorry; a paper by a Florida State University professor and somebody's blog do not qualify as valid data. Those are opinions.
So, a CDC study is not good enough. Fair enough.
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:32 AM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
42,850 posts, read 26,307,990 times
Reputation: 34062
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
I took it as, those seeking to do harm to another because they're physically bigger/stronger or armed wouldn't be so willing to F around and Find out who in society is armed. As their incentive to use violence/force amongst another for any reason would be revoked.
Kind of like how my 70 year old mother carries. She's 4'11 looks like mother goose lol. To a mugger or car jacker she's a prime target. Lives alone. Prime target for a home invader.
Or how my little sister carries. She's dainty. Prime target for a rapist.
Cowards that have to use force against another wouldn't be so quick to initiate force against another if another has the means of defense.
All of that makes me laugh, it sort of reminds me of the background dialog from the Purge TV series
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Old 11-16-2018, 12:16 PM
 
Location: San Diego
50,327 posts, read 47,088,247 times
Reputation: 34090
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
The article stated "designed FOR military use," not "used by the military."
So only full auto machine guns and .50 cal weapons and larger. For dang sure no AK-47 semi auto was designed for semi-auto. Any semi-auto used by any military was adopted/adapted for use.
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Old 11-16-2018, 03:58 PM
 
Location: So Ca
26,748 posts, read 26,841,237 times
Reputation: 24800
Quote:
Originally Posted by CtrlEsc View Post
So, a CDC study is not good enough. Fair enough.
From your lnk, the CDC study reported that, “Defensive use of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence” and is titled Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence. I don't see anything about that study that said that guns make people safer.
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Old 11-16-2018, 05:14 PM
 
19,724 posts, read 10,138,519 times
Reputation: 13096
Quote:
Originally Posted by CA4Now View Post
From your lnk, the CDC study reported that, “Defensive use of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence” and is titled Priorities for Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence. I don't see anything about that study that said that guns make people safer.
Guess you missed this part




“Studies that directly assessed the effect of actual defensive uses of guns (i.e., incidents in which a gun was ‘used’ by the crime victim in the sense of attacking or threatening an offender) have found consistently lower injury rates among gun-using crime victims compared with victims who used other self-protective strategies,” the CDC study, entitled “Priorities For Research to Reduce the Threat of Firearm-Related Violence,” states.
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Old 11-16-2018, 08:51 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,663,022 times
Reputation: 18521
Shall not be infringed.
No one gets to tell me what arms I have, or where I keep and/or bear them.

Or it is not a right at all, but a privilege granted by my MASTER.
Shall not be infringed, or it becomes a privilege quick.
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Old 11-16-2018, 08:53 PM
 
Location: Ft Myers, FL
2,771 posts, read 2,306,234 times
Reputation: 5139
"Shall Not Be Infringed."

Mantra.

Or a cool t-shirt. Not much more.
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