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Having kids is "altruistic" and "self-sacrific{ing}"? In what way?
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Nonexistent children wanted to live? That's getting a bit out-there.
That the world "isn't* crappy is only *your* opinion. For some people, it's pretty terrible. No way am I going to judge them just because my own life is going okay.
I'm not saying that having kids specifically is self sacrifice. I'm saying that there are acts that are pure self sacrifice. Saving someone from a burning
building at the risk of your own life for example?
The world is what it is. It's neither crappy nor full of rainbows. Some things are good other things are bad and it is pointless to argue over what is what. If you feel like you don't like something in this world, try and do your best to make the world better any way you can.
At least that's what I want to do.
If we all contribute with love, the world is going to become a more loving place.
Look how far we have come with human rights. The change is slow, but it's there.
P.s: the thing about the non existent kids was just an answer to the previous post claiming that it is unfair to bring someone into this world without asking. I just wanted to give a counter example to show why that logic is faulty.
Sounds like you envy those who die young. That's why I have a problem with Christianity because Christianity teaches that newborn babies who die right at birth go straight to Paradise. So they don't suffer at all.
Of course I don't envy those who die young, I'm simply picking apart his theory with logic. Reincarnation makes no sense to me because we all are born into different circumstances. Some of them are really bad, and some of them are really great. Some are born with great talents while some are born with none. So who decides who gets screwed and who is the lucky one? Ocamm's Razor suggests the explanation requiring the least speculation and assumptions is the likeliest - and that for me is that life is a single event for every animal including humans, and we are born from nothing and return to nothing on death. There is no greater plan, talent and circumstances are dictated by family wealth and genes, and luck.
I feel just as strongly that those who kill others without justification should be executed as I feel about the right to take your own life. It all comes down to choice - murderers have no right to play God and take that choice away from anyone else, and nobody has the right to force someone who wants to die to keep living - either through physical restraints or guilt trips.
Louis C.K. in one of his standup performances once said something like "Everyone you come across each day is just other people who decided not to kill themselves today." The world should be filled with people who want to be alive, not with those getting through it like it's a prison term. Suicide should become more accepted and a legitimate choice rather than a societal taboo. Maybe someday society will stop allowing the medieval man written bible teachings to dictate such issues. But that would put a lot of retirement homes out of business, who make big bucks keeping tortured elderly breathing for easy insurance money so I don't see anything changing soon.
I think living in the days when Seconal was easily obtained would have been better. No one should have to resort to hanging or shooting themselves or obtaining drugs illegally if they want to die. If someone decides that life is no longer worth living, for whatever reason, I think they should have the right to decide to end their life. Terminal illness isn’t the only reason someone might want to die, and I don’t think we should slap a diagnosis of mental illness on someone if for other reasons they don’t want to live anymore. Why should someone suffer, whether it’s physically or mentally or emotionally, if they don’t want to anymore?
That said, I also know that we don’t know what is just around the corner and life can change for the better in an instant.
Your point is well-taken. At one point when I was suicidal myself, somebody told me that suicide won't solve the problem at all. Because if I die by my own hand, then in my next reincarnation I would have to resume the same problem I have at present. Reincarnation is simply a resumption of the same problem which continues. The solution then is to solve the problem in the present life.
^^^^
This.
Brilliant! So glad you realized before you made that mistake!
I'm not saying that having kids specifically is self sacrifice. I'm saying that there are acts that are pure self sacrifice. Saving someone from a burning
building at the risk of your own life for example?
The world is what it is. It's neither crappy nor full of rainbows. Some things are good other things are bad and it is pointless to argue over what is what. If you feel like you don't like something in this world, try and do your best to make the world better any way you can.
At least that's what I want to do.
If we all contribute with love, the world is going to become a more loving place.
Look how far we have come with human rights. The change is slow, but it's there.
P.s: the thing about the non existent kids was just an answer to the previous post claiming that it is unfair to bring someone into this world without asking. I just wanted to give a counter example to show why that logic is faulty.
But that part of the discussion that you replied to was specifically about having kids. Now you want to compare apples and oranges. A person can save someone from a burning building without children or procreation being involved.
And no, the logic isn't faulty. I've known people who've said they wish they were never born. Me, I wouldn't give a crap if I wasn't.
As far as "be the change you wish to see in the world," that's too little, too late for some people, people who need social or circumstantial change NOW to make their lives unhorrible. Or it's victim-blaming, for those with illnesses (mental or physical), living with abuse and genocide & etc. Again, it is not my place to decide whether someone else's life is worth living, so I'm not going to get on a high horse about it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by luzianne
That said, I also know that we don’t know what is just around the corner and life can change for the better in an instant.
Or for the worse.
And for some people, there may be no better possible. Do they have a degenerative illness? Are they poor with no way out? Do they live somewhere dangerous where they fear for their life every minute with no way to leave? Nothing's going to get better "in an instant"-- or a decade.
But that part of the discussion that you replied to was specifically about having kids. Now you want to compare apples and oranges. A person can save someone from a burning building without children or procreation being involved.
And no, the logic isn't faulty. I've known people who've said they wish they were never born. Me, I wouldn't give a crap if I wasn't.
As far as "be the change you wish to see in the world," that's too little, too late for some people, people who need social or circumstantial change NOW to make their lives unhorrible. Or it's victim-blaming, for those with illnesses (mental or physical), living with abuse and genocide & etc. Again, it is not my place to decide whether someone else's life is worth living, so I'm not going to get on a high horse about it.
Or for the worse.
And for some people, there may be no better possible. Do they have a degenerative illness? Are they poor with no way out? Do they live somewhere dangerous where they fear for their life every minute with no way to leave? Nothing's going to get better "in an instant"-- or a decade.
Lots of people have broken spirits. They are physically healthy nor poor, but they just. don't. want. to. live. anymore. Look at Brad Delp as an example.
And it's ok if they decide to exit. It's ok, because despite what fairy tale bs people tell themselves, we are all going to die anyway in time and we all end up in the same place. The result is the same, now or later, regardless of the cause of death.
Lots of people have broken spirits. They are physically healthy nor poor, but they just. don't. want. to. live. anymore. Look at Brad Delp as an example.
And it's ok if they decide to exit. It's ok, because despite what fairy tale bs people tell themselves, we are all going to die anyway in time and we all end up in the same place. The result is the same, now or later, regardless of the cause of death.
As I think back on the posts of this thread, I really appreciate the post where someone said "so you would teach your kids that suicide is a good option if you want out?"
Cause whatever bs you think everyone is saying, you are also telling yourself bs because you haven't been dead and you don't know what happens when you do. You hope we end up in the same place. You hope it is ok. You hope the result is the same now or later.
Maybe we do, maybe we don't. All I know is how to live.
Suicide should be as mundane as choosing which shirt to wear. If a person isn't getting the life thing, then what's wrong with exiting?
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