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2. I think that a lot of women get frustrated that they have to ask in the first place. I know I would be. I mean, why should we have to ask for someone to just go do something that needs to be done? Then that turns the woman into a nag...'nagging' someone to do the job they should have done in the first place. That is immensely frustrating.
Well, that's what feminism taught boys. Women want to do it all.
I do agree with you that it's wrong to be that way though. I actually teach guys in dance class that they need to take their roles more seriously. Take charge in life.
The consequences of feminism are really evident in dance class. Beginning guys are afraid to lead the girls. The way they lead it's like, "I'm sorry for asking but you see I'm having to ask you, it not my fault, but please if it's okay with you would you please, if it's not too inconvenient, please whenever you are ready go ahead and do a right turn. Sorry."
It's so funny to watch them behave so timidly with the girls, then eventually over time they change the way they lead on the dance floor and inevitably the way the girls react changes their attitude in life. Women WANT take charge men. And I make sure the guys know that. In fact I use women nagging to show it. Women nag when the guy doesn't take charge and do what needs to be done.
Well, that's what feminism taught boys. Women want to do it all.
I do agree with you that it's wrong to be that way though. I actually teach guys in dance class that they need to take their roles more seriously. Take charge in life.
The consequences of feminism are really evident in dance class. Beginning guys are afraid to lead the girls. The way they lead it's like, "I'm sorry for asking but you see I'm having to ask you, it not my fault, but please if it's okay with you would you please, if it's not too inconvenient, please whenever you are ready go ahead and do a right turn. Sorry."
It's so funny to watch them behave so timidly with the girls, then eventually over time they change the way they lead on the dance floor and inevitably the way the girls react changes their attitude in life. Women WANT take charge men. And I make sure the guys know that. In fact I use women nagging to show it. Women nag when the guy doesn't take charge and do what needs to be done.
There is a vast difference between a confident man and some jackwagon who wants to 'take charge' and be the big boss.
Feminism did not 'teach' men to be subservient. If that's what men took from it then they missed the first vital lesson of feminism...equality. Just because a minority of women decided to go further and dominate men does make it true for all women who are feminists.
I just love how men blame feminism for their own stupidity
Well, that's what feminism taught boys. Women want to do it all.
I'm confused. What does feminism have to do with who does chores around the house?
Everyone should do chores around the house - as equal in proportion as possible.
The question becomes...why are women still doing way more of the chores?
Because it's easier to do it yourself than nag and nag and nag someone else to do it?
Because they think of it and the man would never think about pulling out the stove to clean behind it or wiping down the blinds or just, "Hey...nothing's been dusted in a while; I think I'll yank out the Pledge and get some done this weekend"?
2. I think that a lot of women get frustrated that they have to ask in the first place. I know I would be. I mean, why should we have to ask for someone to just go do something that needs to be done? Then that turns the woman into a nag...'nagging' someone to do the job they should have done in the first place. That is immensely frustrating.
I understand that. However, I have learned something in life with dealing with people, not only with a spouse. You have to work with what you have. Most likely you will not change people in general terms.
I have had people work for me and often I have felt the same way thinking that some things they 'should' know. Well, that may be the case but for so many reasons people will not do what you think 'they should know to do'. I have learned that I first try why they do not do what you would think should be obvious to know. I have found out there are so many reasons why people may not do what I may think they should do without being told. Many reasons are valid and others are excuses. You go from there.
Once I learned the reason I decide how to handle that. I make sure I do not become a nag. As you said nagging starts because women may feel frustrated the husband should know what to do and do it without being told. Why not take the time and find out why this does not happen and find ways to work with what they have and get the guy to do it.
Also, it is a matter of attitude. I forgot the name of the movie but Aniston and this other guy were in it. She wanted him to help at the house more. He was a slob. He did try to do work and got better. She complianed about helping with washing the dishes. He said he was doing the dishes. She said he does not like washing them. He said he was doing it but why should he like washing the dishes. She went into a fit. We all do things for others that we do not like to do. It would help the women to understand that if the men do some things in the house they do not like to do it means that they do it for love also. My wife does things for me she may not like and I do show appreciation for doing so. However, women complain because the men does not like doing those things, so what! It is done! But no! He must like it also!
Those are the things that create so many problems and arguments, take care.
I understand that. However, I have learned something in life with dealing with people, not only with a spouse. You have to work with what you have. Most likely you will not change people in general terms.
Also, it is a matter of attitude. I forgot the name of the movie but Aniston and this other guy were in it. She wanted him to help at the house more. He was a slob. He did try to do work and got better. She complianed about helping with washing the dishes. He said he was doing the dishes. She said he does not like washing them. He said he was doing it but why should he like washing the dishes. She went into a fit. We all do things for others that we do not like to do. It would help the women to understand that if the men do some things in the house they do not like to do it means that they do it for love also. My wife does things for me she may not like and I do show appreciation for doing so. However, women complain because the men does not like doing those things, so what! It is done! But no! He must like it also!
Those are the things that create so many problems and arguments, take care.
Right. But we are talking about an entire gender, not just some people with a few quirks. Why is it that most men don't do household chores?
The movie is called The Breakup, and it is funny you bring it up, because it's the perfect example.
You can see that the woman is a little control freaky, but you can also see that the guy does not give a crap at all about helping.
And here's a newsflash. Very few women enjoy doing household chores. WE DO NOT LIKE DOING THEM EITHER. I would much rather watch tv, go outside and play, hang out with friends, etc, too.
Nobody is saying you have to like it. But when Aniston's character said, "I want you to want to do the dishes," she means, "I want you to care enough about me to want to help around the house more so it's not always me doing everything." Nobody LIKES doing dishes. That's ridiculous.
There is a vast difference between a confident man and some jackwagon who wants to 'take charge' and be the big boss.
I didn't say "be the boss." I said take charge in life. When you get home you see that the front door knob is loose. You might take a break to recharge but you recognize that it needs to get fixed. You fix it yourself, call a neighbor, or you call a locksmith. You take charge. That's what I said.
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Feminism did not 'teach' men to be subservient.
I have an example. Just now I said women like a take charge man. You misunderstood me. See how easy it is to get the wrong idea even though you are told something completely different? Yes, feminism's goals were admirable. But it still is the reason why boys think women want to take charge and to do all the work.
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If that's what men took from it then they missed the first vital lesson of feminism...equality.
Is this the equality that means the size of my meal is equal to yours or the kind of equality where the suitcase you carry is just as heavy as the suitcase I carry? Equality isn't realistic because Men and women aren't equal. What we need, what I support, what chivalry is all about is fairness, not equality. Equality inevitability leads to unfairness and the wrong idea that men and women are interchangeable.
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I just love how men blame feminism for their own stupidity
1. Good point. If you want help, try not to criticize someone else's way of doing things (as long as the end result is the same).
2. I think that a lot of women get frustrated that they have to ask in the first place. I know I would be. I mean, why should we have to ask for someone to just go do something that needs to be done? Then that turns the woman into a nag...'nagging' someone to do the job they should have done in the first place. That is immensely frustrating.
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Originally Posted by stan4
Right. But we are talking about an entire gender, not just some people with a few quirks. Why is it that most men don't do household chores? Maybe many moms did not teach their boys to do household chores. My aunts and grandparents did teach me to do that and I make the bed, cook, wash dishes and other things. Now, do most women like to do work is still considered man work? No. Why? Because women still were not raised in doing those things. My wife ask me to work on the car. She said she does not like it and does not care to do such work. Do I nag she needs to help with the care as women nag about men doing the dishes? No. So you are talking about an entire gender? Well, I am doing so by addressing the other side of the coin on how women may be a factor on the issue. However, social changes do take time. More and more men are helping more at the house and more women are learning to help in areas that were considered men tasks. What has not changed is how men and women deal with situations. We man still let things bottle up and simply keep going and women nag. Both eventually clash for the very same reasons of handling it in a negative way.
The movie is called The Breakup, and it is funny you bring it up, because it's the perfect example.
You can see that the woman is a little control freaky, but you can also see that the guy does not give a crap at all about helping. Both have their flaws here, I agree.
And here's a newsflash. Very few women enjoy doing household chores. WE DO NOT LIKE DOING THEM EITHER. I would much rather watch tv, go outside and play, hang out with friends, etc, too. No news flash from my standpoint. News flash maybe to you. Men do like to help but do not demean them when they do it. Wome scream they want to be appreciated it, well, men do not scream it but do like it when they are appreciated.
Nobody is saying you have to like it. But when Aniston's character said, "I want you to want to do the dishes," she means, "I want you to care enough about me to want to help around the house more so it's not always me doing everything." Nobody LIKES doing dishes. That's ridiculous.
Great point you bring up. If that is what she really meant, SAAAAAAY IIIIIIIT!!!!!!!!! I admit we men are not as good as women in picking up clues. So why can't women then be clear instead of saying something when they really meant something else?! That would go a long ways I assure you. Maybe this should be a newsflash but I know it is not because I have heard this from so many men and women do not want to learn about. Learning needs to be both ways, Take care.
I didn't say "be the boss." I said take charge in life. When you get home you see that the front door knob is loose. You might take a break to recharge but you recognize that it needs to get fixed. You fix it yourself, call a neighbor, or you call a locksmith. You take charge. That's what I said.I have an example. Just now I said women like a take charge man. You misunderstood me. See how easy it is to get the wrong idea even though you are told something completely different? Yes, feminism's goals were admirable. But it still is the reason why boys think women want to take charge and to do all the work.Is this the equality that means the size of my meal is equal to yours or the kind of equality where the suitcase you carry is just as heavy as the suitcase I carry? Equality isn't realistic because Men and women aren't equal. What we need, what I support, what chivalry is all about is fairness, not equality. Equality inevitability leads to unfairness and the wrong idea that men and women are interchangeable.
Equality meant equal pay for equal work which is still not happening. It meant being able to vote and take part in civic duties, it meant not being a second rate citizen. Take the time to review what equality for women means. Feminist goals were not 'admirable', they were necessary for society to move forward and embrace all citizens with the same rights and responsibilities.
Men hate feminism because it makes men actually have to do other things apart from being a breadwinner. It means getting off your butt and doing the dishes and looking after the kids.
Great point you bring up. If that is what she really meant, SAAAAAAY IIIIIIIT!!!!!!!!! I admit we men are not as good as women in picking up clues. So why can't women then be clear instead of saying something when they really meant something else?! That would go a long ways I assure you. Maybe this should be a newsflash but I know it is not because I have heard this from so many men and women do not want to learn about. Learning needs to be both ways, Take care.
Yeah, it's tough, because no one wants to have to say it.
Then it's like someone is doing you a big favor when in fact they are just doing what they are supposed to do.
She was angry (as many women I know get) because she had to say it. She had to ask for 'help.' Why is it 'helping' when it is also your job? Do you go to your work and 'help,' or do you go to your work and do your job?
Some women are like your wife, but most women nowadays have spent time living alone away from their parents, so they know how to do the traditional 'man chores' or pay someone to do them. Do you think all the single ladies aren't getting their oil changed? Most of my female friends are mowing their own lawns, painting their own houses...any idiot can fix a toilet or redo a lot of fixtures...
Besides, not many men are doing those kinds of chores at home anymore anyway.
You seem to have some good insights and reflections here...so tell me why you think most men don't help around the house? I don't think there's any point in my speculating about it...better to hear it straight from the horses' mouths.
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