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Excuse me??? "Scheme"??? What am I scheming? I'm not getting anything out of this. I won't even let them buy me drinks. I pay for my own things and I never text them first. Look, I get enough attention. I actually wanted less from them and wanted to talk to other people at the party but it's not my fault they like talking to me. You're making a lot of assumptions here. Don't you know friendship is a two way street? I have a lot to offer as a friend and as a person, more than my V. Yes, I made that other thread a while ago but the other guy has come to terms with being one of my BFFs now. He still talks about when he used to be in love with me but he understands that it will never happen. He still likes talking to me, and get this... believe it or not we're actually good friends. I put in my part of being a great friend and helped him when he had problems and he listens to me when I need to talk to someone. You don't need to be stereotyping about me "getting attention" from people and "giving nothing back". Complete BS. I also broke up with someone I didn't think was right for me but they choose to still talk to me about some things we have in common. I have no intentions of stringing anyone along.
Excuse me??? "Scheme"??? What am I scheming? I'm not getting anything out of this. I won't even let them buy me drinks. I pay for my own things and I never text them first. Look, I get enough attention. I actually wanted less from them and wanted to talk to other people at the party but it's not my fault they like talking to me. You're making a lot of assumptions here. Don't you know friendship is a two way street? I have a lot to offer as a friend and as a person, more than my V. Yes, I made that other thread a while ago but the other guy has come to terms with being one of my BFFs now. He still talks about when he used to be in love with me but he understands that it will never happen. He still likes talking to me, and get this... believe it or not we're actually good friends. I put in my part of being a great friend and helped him when he had problems and he listens to me when I need to talk to someone. You don't need to be stereotyping about me "getting attention" from people and "giving nothing back". Complete BS. I also broke up with someone I didn't think was right for me but they choose to still talk to me about some things we have in common. I have no intentions of stringing anyone along.
I believe you, and I'm not white-knighting here.
I have a true friend who happen to be a woman. The one time I paid for her meal was on her birthday. However, many men had negative experiences with non-genuine women friends stringing them along. At best, it was a waste of their (men's) time. At worst, they paid for things like dinners and event tickets, only to be told "let's just be friends". Plus, the Material We Do Not Speak Of , which is slowly growing in awareness, propagates the belief that women friends are scheming wasters of time and money. And it seems like a lot of the men on here have read the Material. Its content may not be true in your case, but just saying.
A lot of it has to do with you using the loaded term "friend zone", rather than a more neutral-sounding "make friends with".
Last edited by MillennialUrbanist; 08-29-2017 at 10:24 AM..
I just think it's dumb to say that attractive women can't have certain friends without it being this thing of people taking advantage of one another. What is the standard coin-flip exercise for this one...can a rich man have friends without advantage-taking? Life is full of all kinds of connections, I've had friends who were never sex candidates (like straight women) who were fake people who nonetheless tried to stab me in the back or take advantage of me. When you see that is how it's gonna be, then you cut 'em loose. If a woman is taking advantage of a guy's sexual interest, the guy should cut her out of his life. If a guy is taking advantage of a woman's friendly intentions by persistently trying to wear down her defenses in some way that makes her uncomfortable, she should also cut him loose. Friends do not take advantage of one another. Friendship should be a mutually beneficial endeavor.
So, if a man is the sort of man who can only see a woman (either generally or one specific woman because he finds her desirable) as good for love/sex, and not anything else, I would say that he is not capable of being a good friend. There absolutely ARE men out there who are capable of setting that aside and participating in legit friendship, once boundaries have been properly placed. I would say that due diligence on the part of the woman in this situation, is to tell a guy how it is, and not get into situations that might mislead him (such as one-on-one time) and not accept any gifts, him paying for things, tokens that might be construed as love-gestures. If you want friendship, then police your boundary properly. And if he can't deal with it, then it is on him to back away, and one has to respect that.
The one thing I would advise the OP to address is this: As a woman, I understand a feeling that in order to say "no" to sex/love/romance with a man, you almost have to have some sort of an excuse. It feels like you're being mean, rejecting him, hurting him. And yet you do know that you don't owe him anything at all. It's a prickly conundrum. I have told men in my social sphere, back when I was theoretically available, but not really interested in them, "Look, I really like you. You are an attractive person and a really cool guy, and I love being friends with you. But I am friends with many attractive, smart, cool guys, and I don't remotely have the time or the inclination to have sex with all of ya. So for reasons of my own, I am not going to go there with you, not now, probably not ever. I would love to keep being friends, I think you're great...if that would not be comfortable to you, I understand."
To me, that is a fair position to take. But you have to stop feeling guilty for saying no when you have no boyfriend. I know it can be difficult, it has been for me, because men will make a production about how hurtful "rejection" is...so I do my best to make it clear that I am not rejecting them as a human being or declaring them somehow unworthy. I think they're great. It really is me, not them. Sometimes I'll even come up with some silly thing that I tell them is the reason, the dealbreaker... My one very flirty friend, I often deflect him by telling him he is simply too young for me. (He is my age.) It's become part of the joke, how I only go for old guys. He got a bit of silver coming into his hair, and he points it out like, "Huh? Huh? Hot, right? Yeah, you like that." And I'm like, "You're adorable. But still...no." He pretends to be heartbroken for about half a dramatic second and then we talk about bad movies.
But anyhow, learning how to place healthy boundaries for yourself, without apologizing for them, or excusing them, or feeling guilty for them, is in my opinion an important part of growing and learning to respect yourself.
I have a true friend who happen to be a woman. The one time I paid for her meal was on her birthday. However, many men had negative experiences with non-genuine women friends stringing them along. At best, it was a waste of their (men's) time. At worst, they paid for things like dinners and event tickets, only to be told "let's just be friends". Plus, the Material We Do Not Speak Of , which is slowly growing in awareness, propagates the belief that women friends are scheming wasters of time and money. And it seems like a lot of the men on here have read the Material. Its content may not be true in your case, but just saying.
A lot of it has to do with you using the loaded term "friend zone", rather than a more neutral-sounding "make friends with".
I don't think women are scheming that many men out of money, and if they are, it's the man's fault. Most women I'm around tend to pay their own way, due to I generally only surround myself with women who are capable of paying their own way.
The issue with this friendzone is that you can start both being on the same page. Okay awesome, I have this man or woman that I can spend time with in a totally platonic fashion. However, friendzone, or better yet the people involved in the friendzone, do not account for one or both of their feelings changing at some time in the future. It's like when friendzone is established, no one's feelings can change, which isn't exactly true. You can find out in time that you don't like hanging out with the person and the friendship dissolves, or you find out you like the person strictly platonically or you find out you like them more romantically.
I've been the receiver of the friendzone and I've been the one who suggested the friendzone. The frequency of us spending time together factored into how long one or both of us was comfortable with the friendzone.
I mentioned something called prolotherapy and perineural injection therapy. Unfortunately, it's not covered by insurance, but I had a collection of injuries that I pretty much resolved completely through a combination of prolotherapy, PIT, and various mobility and flexibility training.
Honestly, the best I found for a strength based mobility and flexibility training is Flexible Steel which can be purchased on Amazon. The mobility drills are based on Amasov's work, which essentially stated that movement was necessary to get synovial fluid into your joints in order to heal and nourish them.
It sounds like we've had some similar issues, so really consider my advice. If you need advice on a specific doctor and how much you should anticipate spending if you decide to go through with it and get completely healed, just let me know. A lot of pro athletes get these relatively non-invasive procedures done, so it's sort of a travesty that it's not covered by insurance, but that's just the reality we live in.
I'm not sure what type of cream you use, but depending on what state you live in, you may want to consider using a high CBD strain and making oil out of it. There is evidence that suggest it can assist in healing, particularly when it comes to nerves. Like I said, I have a lot of experience in the realm of health and fitness and I take it very seriously, so anything I can do to help people become the best versions of themselves, I'm good with, unless of course they show signs of a bully mentality.
Hopefully, you're not a bully.
Hi Jobster,
This is the cream I was talking about:
I do have CBD oil and that helps a little too. I really do like acupuncture for the nerves. Sometimes I wish I could press my finger into a nerve point all day.
That book is only $2.99 on Kindle. Guess it would be worth trying out. Funny how I used to take stretching for granted. Really doesn't bode well as I age.
And no, not a bully. : ) Don't like bullies either.
My best friend is a man who I dated once five years ago. I knew it would never work. We've kept in touch ever since, while we dated others. He lives thousands of miles away so no worries about it becoming more intimate. I give him advice about women, which he appreciates, and offer sympathy when things don't work out. I know that once he finds a woman, our friendship will fade except for holiday cards because another woman wouldn't understand (unless she had a similar friendship). I would probably feel a bit threatened if the situation were reversed.
I do ask him to keep an eye out for a suitable man for me.
I've been the receiver of the friendzone and I've been the one who suggested the friendzone. The frequency of us spending time together factored into how long one or both of us was comfortable with the friendzone.
I don't even use that term, because any friendships I extend are genuine, not "consolation prizes" for rejection, or worse, charades for personal gain. I always expressed my intentions honestly and diplomatically. And I expect the same from the women rejecting me. In my definition, "friend zone" implies unrequited love, manipulation, cluelessness, or any combination of the above.
If you want to see the real friend zone, look no further than the movie "Lucas".
I don't even use that term, because any friendships I extend are genuine, not "consolation prizes" for rejection, or worse, charades for personal gain. I always expressed my intentions honestly and diplomatically. And I expect the same from the women rejecting me. In my definition, "friend zone" implies unrequited love, manipulation, cluelessness, or any combination of the above.
If you want to see the real friend zone, look no further than the movie "Lucas".
I'm using the term, because what started out as friends, ended up turning into the friendzone. As time went on my feelings began to develop as more than friends, which when professed, I was placed in the friendzone. I have female friends for sure, but we don't hang out at the same frequency as me and this particular friend did.
I even asked around to make sure I was being realistic. I received the same feedback from friends, which was that it definitely looks like dating, she's just not calling it that. To many it looked like dating, but to her it was two friends spending time together. Funny how feelings can change over time.
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, which is slowly growing in awareness, propagates the belief that women friends are scheming wasters of time and money. And it seems like a lot of the men on here have read the Material. Its content may not be true in your case, but just saying.
