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The distinction is that Diss has massive self esteem issues around women and rejection and you don't.
This was an unfair personal attack in the middle of what had been a pretty decent discussion.
I also believe the friend zone is voluntary and that no one can put you there. But there also is a big difference between "being friends" and being "in the friend zone."
Two people who are not attracted to each other can be friends. Yes.
A person who is attracted to another person and asks her out but is rejected can possibly stay around as a friend if and only if he drops all pretense of her potentially developing feelings over time.
A person who is attracted to a person and asks her out but is rejected can get into the so-called "friend zone" if he hangs around being "a friend" with the hope that she will change her mind and discover that she is attracted to him after all. THAT is the friend zone, and that is totally voluntary. If you stay in orbit of a girl "as a friend" while she searches for a more handsome/attractive/suitable partner, that is your choice, but it's not your only choice.
The distinction has nothing to do with Diss's perceived self esteem but with intent.
Like someone else mentioned here, if you want friends, you go to a meetup. I met them at a meetup, not a dating app. They have not come right out to ask me on a date. I don't owe them anything. Especially not saying "I will not date you" if no date has been asked for. I only speculated that they like me based on their actions. Wish you would stop making this about you.
then what's the problem here?
Why all the premeditation over how you should handle things?
Outside of them taking an interest in you what keeps YOU involved here if you feel intentions are not lining up?
If you "owe them nothing" what's this all about?
You're literally asking how to keep things plutonic so you can keep receiving what you want from the relation knowing or assuming large part of that interest and desire to relate back to you is not rooted in plutonic intentions.
You cannot claim ignorance when you have already shown you are aware.
Last edited by rego00123; 08-30-2017 at 02:18 PM..
Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
26,701 posts, read 41,779,199 times
Reputation: 41386
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wmsn4Life
This was an unfair personal attack in the middle of what had been a pretty decent discussion.
I also believe the friend zone is voluntary and that no one can put you there. But there also is a big difference between "being friends" and being "in the friend zone."
Two people who are not attracted to each other can be friends. Yes.
A person who is attracted to another person and asks her out but is rejected can possibly stay around as a friend if and only if he drops all pretense of her potentially developing feelings over time.
A person who is attracted to a person and asks her out but is rejected can get into the so-called "friend zone" if he hangs around being "a friend" with the hope that she will change her mind and discover that she is attracted to him after all. THAT is the friend zone, and that is totally voluntary. If you stay in orbit of a girl "as a friend" while she searches for a more handsome/attractive/suitable partner, that is your choice, but it's not your only choice.
The distinction has nothing to do with Diss's perceived self esteem but with intent.
Wow, I must have earned some serious street credit around here. People are actually defending me.
You are on the money with your explanation. My thoughts on this may be blunt, but I think a woman would catch on super fast if I were only faking a friendship in hopes of changing her mind about being romantic.
I think honesty is more appreciated by a woman down the line. They may not like it at first when you reject the consolation prize of being friends, but I think deep down they appreciate the honesty and not wanting to waste their time and mine with a facade of a friendship.
Like someone else mentioned here, if you want friends, you go to a meetup. I met them at a meetup, not a dating app. They have not come right out to ask me on a date. I don't owe them anything. Especially not saying "I will not date you" if no date has been asked for. I only speculated that they like me based on their actions. Wish you would stop making this about you.
It has sounded to me like you're doing preemptive worrying about what sort of excuse you could use not to date them, if/when they actually ask. Because you don't want to come off like a jerk, or make them feel rejected, just because you're not interested in dating them.
If that is the case, then I get it. And I still think honesty will be the best policy. I've even gone so far as to tell the one friend that I really don't want him to feel bad because he's a great dude and I'm honored to be his friend. That I might be saying "no thanks" to a sexual relationship, but I really hope he understands that I am not rejecting him as a person, in general, because I really do like him. All the same if he wasn't comfortable just being my friend, and wanted to stop altogether, I understood that too. He appreciated what I had to say, he said that he flirts with everyone and mostly he's just having fun (though if I'd ever said yes, he would have been all over it) and not to worry about it. His behavior that I've seen confirms, the dude is just like that. He even jokingly flirts with other guys, and he's not gay, he's just playing around.
So maybe you don't think it's necessary to throw down the "I don't want to date you!" right now...but I'd advise at least that you psyche yourself up on how you can confidently say no, in ways that don't feel mean (from your perspective) and that you don't feel you have to apologize for. Trust me, it can feel much better once you've cleared the air of unspoken questions and assumptions. And the longer you let these guys guess at what signals they might be receiving from you (even when you're not trying to send any) and overthink their chances, the more it's gonna upset them when you let 'em down. Every moment they spend hoping you might become a romantic prospect, if that's what they hope for, they will see as an investment of time and energy trying to attain a goal. I really do think it's kinder to find a way to tell them, sooner rather than later.
The distinction is that Diss has massive self esteem issues around women and rejection and you don't.
I don't really disagree with what Diss said I have more guy friends than I know what to do with I wouldn't really see the point in being friends with a woman I like. I would the majority of the time disassociate most likely.
I guess I can see some exceptions, like if I ran into her down the road a year later and was kind of over it, chasing plenty of other women. Or if she said she had a friend that was really similar to her, and might be interested in me.
I'm not going to lie if I get into that situation I sometimes try and find out if she has any single friends I'd be into. That's just street smart and a guy doing what he has to do in the gender roles game where we start with the ball in our court and willingly pass it.
If I'm still in the drooling dog in heat stage I'm not even sure that would be fair to her. If she had a bf or something I would feel like I'm secretly hoping they break up or something and run into my arms..in which case that wouldn't make me a very good friend.
We're really in essence looking at a situation where the burden of pursuing is still on our shoulders for the most part. All of the challenges that can go along with that can go far beyond the guy just having the balls to do it.
I think honesty is more appreciated by a woman down the line. They may not like it at first when you reject the consolation prize of being friends, but I think deep down they appreciate the honesty and not wanting to waste their time and mine with a facade of a friendship.
True again. Also, in some cases---not all---"let's just be friends" is code for "let's be civil to each other, but leave each other alone". When a woman turns me down romantically, I initially react by doing just that: saying "OK" and retreating. It's what most women prefer, and it leaves no hard feelings. But if she reaches out to me later, and is not asking for a favor, then I know her friendship offer was genuine. In fact, that's how my current friendship with the Meetup started out in a similar way.
I don't really disagree with what Diss said I have more guy friends than I know what to do with I wouldn't really see the point in being friends with a woman I like. I would the majority of the time disassociate most likely.
I guess I can see some exceptions, like if I ran into her down the road a year later and was kind of over it, chasing plenty of other women. Or if she said she had a friend that was really similar to her, and might be interested in me.
I'm not going to lie if I get into that situation I sometimes try and find out if she has any single friends I'd be into. That's just street smart and a guy doing what he has to do in the gender roles game where we start with the ball in our court and willingly pass it.
If I'm still in the drooling dog in heat stage I'm not even sure that would be fair to her. If she had a bf or something I would feel like I'm secretly hoping they break up or something and run into my arms..in which case that wouldn't make me a very good friend.
We're really in essence looking at a situation where the burden of pursuing is still on our shoulders for the most part. All of the challenges that can go along with that can go far beyond the guy just having the balls to do it.
That makes it sound like a) getting pretty overly invested emotionally before you even know someone to get hurt just because they aren't interested At that stage you don't even know each other. b) like women have no value except as they are available to date. Both of those things strike me as too bad. For you.
Why all the premeditation over how you should handle things?
Outside of them taking an interest in you what keeps YOU involved here if you feel intentions are not lining up?
If you "owe them nothing" what's this all about?
You're literally asking how to keep things plutonic so you can keep receiving what you want from the relation knowing or assuming large part of that interest and desire to relate back to you is not rooted in plutonic intentions.
You cannot claim ignorance when you have already shown you are aware.
rego00123:
Regarding the bolded part in pink... it is platonic... not plutonic.
Orbit me no more
Plutonic is no planet
The Kuiper Belt Blues
Quote:
Originally Posted by snugglegirl05
rego00123:
Regarding the bolded part in pink... it is platonic... not plutonic.
Which may be why the haikus go right over his head. Just sayin.
It's hard to stay golden, pony boy.
...or was that Lucas
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Just sayin.
