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It's worth pointing out that Hitler was definitely not a Christian.
Ah! So he wasn't a real Christian. Well let's say that Joe Stalin and Mao Zedong weren't real atheists....not that Stalin's or Mao's genocides had anything to do with atheism in the first place.
Having a bad day Mel? What's a matter? Did you see a woman with a cross necklace while standing in the checkout line at the grocery store? Is such a religious display too offensive to your atheist beliefs?
Never understood why atheists care what other people think about religion. If a group of people revived the Norse pantheon and started worshiping them I really wouldn't care less.
Don't profess ignorance! The problem is that Christian acolytes are never satisfied with keeping it to themselves, as you know quite well. There's this strident requirement that they go forth and proselytize. The real Christian agenda behind this is to spread the influence and "demonic" control of innocent, ignorant people through fear and disciplinary action. Quite simple, and easily proven.
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Originally Posted by artwomyn
How could a nation consider itself 'Christian", when it has allowed slavery, the slaughter of Native Americans, several useless wars, an obsession with violence, unbridled greed, corrupt politicians, racism, sexism, classism, squalid ghettos, starving people, homelessness, and the huge gap, between the rich and the poor.
America has used Christianity, and organized religion, to try and convince itself that's its really a pious, compassionate nation. In reality, nothing could be further form the truth! So America is not, and never was, a 'Christian' nation. America is more like a cruel, brutal Plutocracy, than anything else!
So accurately stated. Thanks.
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Originally Posted by kingdomcome1
Then don't believe...who is stopping you?
Not the problem. It's the arrogant and the "looking down my nose at you" patronizing attitude. As if Christians have ownership of some absolute truth. Keep THAT to yourselves, please.
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Originally Posted by Bideshi
So, this is the new atheistic tactic: equate belief in God with delusion. You will answer on Judgement Day for your mocking. You will be held accountable for every idle word.
No, no "tactic". It's just what the evidence has easily shown, Bideshi. We've had literally centuries to see how "Christianity" works. Not a pleasant story, frankly. Oh, and keep your vile personal but patently unsupportable opinions about what happens to me after I go to my pleasant personal death to yourself, thanks. Else my spirit devil will certainly come to your gravesite and fire-dance on your moldering and quivering remains.
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Originally Posted by Jazzymom
Coins do not say in the Christian G-d we trust or in Jesus we trust. It is in G-d we trust. The forefathers had a monotheistic belief, not necessarily Christian. We are not a Christian nation we are a nation that has many Christians who think it is a Christian nation.
The problem is again, that Christians have made a concerted (and increasingly annoying...) effort to claim ownership, outright, as though their mystical and supernaturally- based religion is somehow the only one, the right one, and you'll go directly to hell if you don't willingly join in the hymn-sing. Threaten, cajole, punish, lie.
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Originally Posted by Bideshi
I can't even begin to express how much I disagree with that ridiculous claim. Secular humanism is a great ill. Godless materialism is a great ill. Belief in salvation through Jesus Christ is the only healing balm for any nation, or any individual.
How about honest, spiritual nature-based humanism, NOT just from a forcefully mandated Christian perspective?
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
The bold is the missing ingredient in your indictment of believers, Sans . . . what will it take to break through your arrogant facade of knowledge? What exactly is this "invalidating evidence" you speak of?
and...
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Originally Posted by MysticPhD
Sanspeur laid claim to evidence "invalidating" the existence of God. There is no such evidence and I called him on it.
The "invalidating evidence" is that so much of what Christians claim so absolutely, and trot out their "proofs" ("It's written in the bible! So there!"), is so easily discredited. Like, for instance, the 6-day Creation myth, which you yourself have disowned.
So. You disown a major stepping stone of what the Christian mythology requires. You agree with an ancient universe. You allow as how fossils were NOT planted by God to confuse us. You agree with the geologic column. You discredit all those idiotic mythic-based fairy tales, and yet you don't simultaneously see any good (even potential) evidence there may be no god? For a Doctorate, you don't seem so ready to consider rational alternatives, especially given the wealth of evidence FOR there being no God.
I suspect you personally need a God just like all the other rabidly devoted Christians, but with your enhanced intelligence, you see how stupid their simplistic version is (there's no better word..). I mean, why would you want to be associated with the chanting, unquestioning rabble down in the streets?
Q: have you ever watched the original "Hunchback of Notre Dame" movie? I can easily see you as that archbishop who controls Quasimoto, and also controls those seething but illiterate masses down there with his high-falutin' "holier than thou" talk.
You also see how damning it is to associate directly with their child-like views and lack of interest in learning. so you've pretty much invented your own version.
Am I touching on a nerve here?
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Originally Posted by Nikk
Freedom of Speach extends to public places. So, if you dislike anything religious, stay at home!
Aha! So! We non-Christians must stay at home if we are to avoid "in your face" Christian proselytizing? I'd suggest the alternate: you don't get to openly shove it in the public's face. As the law in this country so often confirms.
Any given and specific particular religion has absolutely no right to shove itself squarely in the face of the overall public. If you wish to blatantly express your personal oddball beliefs, you MUST do it within the legal confines of a church or private property. Else we'll start placing open billboards that consecrate the Devil, or Native American spirit dancing or Wicca. In my home country, the government, back in the early 1900s, outlawed our potlatch ceremonies. We were ostracized, actually beaten in the streets, and forced, as was the paradigm of the day, to "attend" (how funny...) Christian schools.
If we could go back in time now, knowing what we now know about those arrogant Christian proselytizers, I doubt they would have survived their evil intentions. It would have been either the Native N. Americans or the intruder Euros. Too bad The Little Big Horn was so limited in it's scope and results, eh?
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Originally Posted by Rafius
Ah! So he wasn't a real Christian. Well let's say that Joe Stalin and Mao Zedong weren't real atheists....not that Stalin's or Mao's genocides had anything to do with atheism in the first place.
I love this one! Thank you, Rafius. Selective Assignment of Spiritual Perspectives. Yeah! "I'm a true Christian, but only when I'm doing good!" Therefore, no Christians have ever done anything bad!" Nifty!
Now, what else can we apply this sort of blindered thinking to?
Not the problem. It's the arrogant and the "looking down my nose at you" patronizing attitude. As if Christians have ownership of some absolute truth. Keep THAT to yourselves, please.
Does that apply to the other side of this argument? How about those who say the Christian God is a myth, fable, and "oddball beliefs"? How about those who "look down their nose" at Christians, while using words like ignorant, close-minded, & unthinking?
It's worth pointing out that Hitler was definitely not a Christian. He might've considered himself Christian, but actions speak louder than words, and his actions showed him not only to be at least somewhat insane but to also be a very hateful, non-Christian man.
You know it's been said, a picture is worth a 1000 words, you may want to take a look at these pictures and rethink your statement.
Does that apply to the other side of this argument? How about those who say the Christian God is a myth, fable, and "oddball beliefs"? How about those who "look down their nose" at Christians, while using words like ignorant, close-minded, & unthinking?
His formative years, his foundation for his belief, his education was christian.
And he was also insane and in his mind could justify (very badly) his actions, or just forget about justifying them altogether if he couldn't. You cannot blame Christianity for that.
For example, my father is a schizophrenic. He's also Catholic, or claims to be. And when he gets into a debate with me about free will or something (claiming that we don't have it and that the "Bible says so") he obviously doesn't really know anything about it, despite being surrounded by good Catholic influences, and just justifies his being right with "Well, you're just a kid."
oh ok i just saw what ptsum posted and low and behold he has the picture with hitler and the pope
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