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Old 01-31-2011, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
2,332 posts, read 2,840,489 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
It's pretty tragic that so many children are not given the opportunity to develop their own belief system. Teaching morality is one thing. Not killing, stealing, etc.. those are pretty basic regardless of beliefs. But forcing religion onto them before they can even begin to think for themselves... how incredibly selfish of parents.
I don't know what children learn these days for means to opinionation.

Beliefs systems are supposed to be taught at schools, the church, and what other sociological instrument. Hey, the computer (ha,ha, ha,) They could actually shut it down in Egypt for a day. I didn't even get informed about that in America.
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Old 01-31-2011, 10:33 AM
 
138 posts, read 163,637 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
It's pretty tragic that so many children are not given the opportunity to develop their own belief system. Teaching morality is one thing. Not killing, stealing, etc.. those are pretty basic regardless of beliefs. But forcing religion onto them before they can even begin to think for themselves... how incredibly selfish of parents.

Freewill is what Christian children don't get until they become a teenage atheist.

Christians should set by example. If their children don't follow in their footsteps, they should love them no matter what direction God planned for them. Maybe God planned for them to be a serial killer and here they are, trying to make them religious.
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Old 01-31-2011, 10:44 AM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
2,332 posts, read 2,840,489 times
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Originally Posted by bjhulk View Post
Freewill is what Christian children don't get until they become a teenage atheist.

Christians should set by example. If their children don't follow in their footsteps, they should love them no matter what direction God planned for them. Maybe God planned for them to be a serial killer and here they are, trying to make them religious.

Come on, the means that they develop their opinions is either by indoctrination ways or the belief examples of the their peers and elders. I guess we have a mix of the two ways. The opinions by a free society are each individually developed with a free will of desire and conscience. Of course, belief systems are sought in a forced circumstance of applied intellect and will; that's what I mean. Some are more morally demanding; some less. Science, for instance, was always to me less morally demanding.
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Old 01-31-2011, 11:01 AM
 
16,294 posts, read 28,538,091 times
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Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
I disagree, it is a parent's duty to instill their own values into their children, regardless of what they are. There is no guarantee that those values will stick, but a parent can do no other and be responsible.
I see yours did a bang up job, you have even boasted about not going to their funeral.
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Old 01-31-2011, 11:24 AM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
2,332 posts, read 2,840,489 times
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Originally Posted by TKramar View Post
Here's the thing. I don't care WHAT parents teach their kids. I don't care if they teach them that the way to get through life is to steal from others. It is their right to instill their own values in their children...in fact, it is their duty to do so.
Are you being naive. Parents can be surrigate or adopted-adopting for that. In many ways, parents are necessary for being-there for their children's lives. But God is the value the child cannot be Brought to understand without his own meaning from lessons. What is instilled is always the tautology: I must do what I got to do, and the double standards for teh identity of Who I Am.
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Old 01-31-2011, 12:53 PM
 
2,958 posts, read 2,561,469 times
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Originally Posted by tgnostic View Post
Are you being naive. Parents can be surrigate or adopted-adopting for that. In many ways, parents are necessary for being-there for their children's lives. But God is the value the child cannot be Brought to understand without his own meaning from lessons. What is instilled is always the tautology: I must do what I got to do, and the double standards for teh identity of Who I Am.
I've always wondered about that "Honor Thy Father And Mother" commandment. What if the father is a serial killer and the mother is a crack ho? What treatment at all do they deserve from their offspring?
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Old 01-31-2011, 11:58 PM
 
Location: I'm around here someplace :)
3,633 posts, read 5,357,922 times
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Originally Posted by Melvin.George View Post
Seems to me that Ex. 21:20, Ex. 4:20; 7:9; 12:19 Prov. 3:11-12; Heb. 12:5-11 etc. taught discipline by use of the rod. Is that a good way to raise children?...by beating them?

feel free to read my post. I didn't say that, did I?
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Old 02-01-2011, 01:21 AM
 
2,958 posts, read 2,561,469 times
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Originally Posted by Tia 914 View Post
feel free to read my post. I didn't say that, did I?
So the bible is wrong?
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Old 02-01-2011, 02:01 PM
 
138 posts, read 163,637 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgnostic View Post
Come on, the means that they develop their opinions is either by indoctrination ways or the belief examples of the their peers and elders. I guess we have a mix of the two ways. The opinions by a free society are each individually developed with a free will of desire and conscience. Of course, belief systems are sought in a forced circumstance of applied intellect and will; that's what I mean. Some are more morally demanding; some less. Science, for instance, was always to me less morally demanding.
Read this story about a well loved pastor in my ex-wife's community.

My ex-wife and I were married in 1982 in the backyard of her parent's house. The pastor of the Christian church they were members of had a meeting with us the day before and he tested us to see if we were capatible. He talked about sex, love, responsibility and all the rehearsed things he must have said to other couples for the 20 years he had been a pastor of his church. The next day he married us.

If this pastor didn't have the genetic sin of lust in his DNA, he might have been okay but his upbringing and religious training had nothing to do with what God planned for him. He didn't want to be screwing his daughters but his strong sexual desire given by his sin of lust couldn't be controlled. Now he's in prison but he's still a very nice man.
 
He was a well loved pastor who had a beautiful wife and three lovely daughters who were in high school and junior high at that time. I had gotten to know them while dating my wife before we got married. No one would ever suspect they has problems in their home at nights.
 
About 17 years later, my wife and I learned that he was in prison. His youngest daughter had told her psychiatrist that her father had sexual intercourse with her and her two sisters on a regular basis while they were living at home. The doctor called the authorities who took him to court and prosecuted him for sexual crimes against his daughters. His youngest daughter was the only one who dared to testify against him but it was enough to put in him prison. His two oldest daughters didn't have the courage to admit to his attacks.
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Old 02-01-2011, 02:06 PM
 
138 posts, read 163,637 times
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Originally Posted by Melvin.George View Post
So the bible is wrong?

If Christians knew how many pagan thoughts were added to the new testament and some in the old testament, they would still be involved in pagan worshiping. All it takes to be a pagan worshiper is a sinful body that makes you worship your own ideas other than God.
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