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I agree with much of this, and see that this is a distraction from the reality of the Bible, as the last of Revelations talks about in chapter 22:18-19, "18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book."
does this apply to all mormons? because i know many mormons pray to God and Jesus, and accept him as Savior.
FIRST OF ALL I NEED TEENAGER ADVICE! =) - im 15...
and needing advice as a Christian thinking about a relationship with a mormon, she is probably the kindest, most encouraging girl i know, and am not sure how much she is devoted to being a mormon, and what her firm beliefs are differing to the Bible... is it right, or wrong and can it be that bad to want a relationship like this in high school?
I agree with much of this, and see that this is a distraction from the reality of the Bible, as the last of Revelations talks about in chapter 22:18-19, "18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book."
does this apply to all mormons? because i know many mormons pray to God and Jesus, and accept him as Savior.
FIRST OF ALL I NEED TEENAGER ADVICE! =) - im 15...
and needing advice as a Christian thinking about a relationship with a mormon, she is probably the kindest, most encouraging girl i know, and am not sure how much she is devoted to being a mormon, and what her firm beliefs are differing to the Bible... is it right, or wrong and can it be that bad to want a relationship like this in high school?
Let me first say: I certainly cannot tell you who is saved, who is a true Christian, who is not--I certainly won't condemn anyone. Although I believe the Bible is clear that some will not inherit eternal life, I do believe the Bible is open to a universalist interpretation. So the point is this: we have no idea who will be saved and who won't.
However, I'm not convinced that Mormonism is a true version of Christianity, and would be very careful about it if I were you. However, Christianity is not limited to one single denomination, and there are many true Christians from all types of denominational backgrounds. My one very big issue with the Church of the Latter-Day Saints is their denial of the Trinity. The idea that God is one in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is an extremely important idea that has been rooted in mainstream Christianity for many hundreds of years. Some Mormons have also traditionally believed in various other oddities such as: one becoming a god when you go to heaven, having an entire universe to rule over, and the eternal nature of marriage.
With that being said, I think it is perfectly fine for you to have a relationship with anyone you want. As a Christian, I think it is particularly important to build relationships with people who are from different religions, who are agnostic or atheist. As Christians we are supposed to love everyone as we love ourselves--even those who don't agree with us. Thus, part of loving people means getting along with them, and even being a beacon of Christian testimony for them (I believe evangelism only works best among friends and never for strangers). Also, I think if you want more than a friendly relationship with this girl, that's fine too....but keep in mind that if Mormonism is a big part of her life, then that might be a big hindrance in your compatibility with her.
Let me just remind you that there is nothing wrong with wanting a relationship with someone who is not a traditional Christian. As Christians we should not be exclusive to anyone, but welcoming of all--that doesn't mean you should necessarily agree with them, or not try to influence them!
If you have any questions feel free to PM me.
I'm sorry, but this just seems like a perfect example of eisegesis. For one the reference to Joseph is most likely Joseph son of Jacob as the passage goes: "Ephraim's stick, belonging to Joseph." Ephraim was the second son of Joseph son of Jacob. Even considering the Joseph reference, this seems to be a serious stretch.
The reference to Joseph in Ezekial 37 mentioned in my post above IS a direct reference to Joseph in Egypt, NOT Joseph Smith (I'm glad you read the reference). As stated in my prior reply, this passage prophecies of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon. The Bible was written primarily by descendants of Judah, thus "the stick of Judah". We believe The Book of Mormon was written by descendents of Joseph of Egypt, thus "the stick of Joseph." The sticks can refer to the scrolls written on in the day (there were also anciently wooden tablets filled with wax that people would write on as well). This passage is also a prophecy of the gathering of Israel as the sticks can also refer to ruling scepters (though one doesn't typically write on these)... a time when all would be gathered into the fold of God... happening now.
As one studies the history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, it becomes evident that almost all of the events prophecied of in Isaiah 29 were fulfilled in the early days of the Church (a small part of this chapter remains to be fulfilled, which will probably happen during the Millenium). Isaiah 29 is a prophecy of the events of the restoration. Not just a verse or two but the entire chapter... I would argue that quoting this chapter is definitely not a case of "eisegesis." If you are interested in reading some of the history and fulfillments of prophecy I refer to you may at: Joseph Smith—History 1
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This is a good point. Although, I think the apostles voluntarily collected their money together--I was under the impression that Joseph Smith forced people out of their money if they were to become part of his following.
The passage in the latter verses of Acts 4:32 and subsequent verses seem to make it quite clear that ALL of those whom believed considered all things in common amongst them and did not consider anything their own. Then, at least at this point, this was one of the requirements of truly following (it later may have been withdrawn). I agree with you that it was voluntary (though some that read of the death of two in Acts 5 whom volunteered, then backed out and lyed might disagree). I don't think this means that those whom didn't volunteer were then still included as true believers as the passage seems to indicate that all of the true believers followed this manner of living. This passage is not referring to just the apostles "volunteering" as it was the other members who laid possessions at the feet of the apostles. Though there were many within the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in the days of Joseph Smith whom happily followed the law of consecration when put before them, there were also many that didn't. For this reason, It was later withdrawn and the law of tithing (a lower law dating back to OT times) has been in its place until such time that the members of the Church are willing to fully follow (as some of the early Christians as documented in Acts 4 and 5) to live the "higher" law of consecration... to truly live in "unity." This manner of living was never forced within the church in NT times or in the 1800's, nor can it be forced.
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I'm not really sure where in the N.T. the apostles prophesied the corruption of the truth of Christianity...in fact, it would seem as though one would have to accept the truth and validity of the N.T. to begin with in order to accept that a correct prophecy could be made within it--something which you yourself claim must prophesy it's own corruption. If you on the other hand accept the validity and truth of the Bible, then, again, I see no reason for the Book of Mormon.
The truth itself was not corrupted, rather people turned away from it and preached as doctrine the tenents of men mixed with the truths of Christianity. By the days of Joseph Smith, many key aspects of what was then considered as Christianity were based on interpretations of the NT shaped by Platonian thought and pagan influence rather than on true revelation regarding the revelations. Thus a knowledge of the truth was lost, though the truth itself was not corrupted. The truth is still within the pages of the NT.
This "turning away" happened by those whom at one point were considered "members" of the Church of Christ. The NT and the OT both prophecy of this. Furthermore, the NT makes it abundantly clear that this process was going on even before all of the apostles were killed. The fact that this happened and that history supports this does not invalidate the NT (and OT) but rather adds even more power to the words recorded in the Bible as the events of this turning away were prophecied of and did come to pass. Following are some references which you can peruse in regards to this topic:
Isaiah 24:5, 29:13, 60:2. Amos 8:11. Matt 13:25, 24:5, 24:24. John 6:06. Acts 20:29. 1 Cor 11:18, Gal 1:6, 3:1. 2Thes 2:3. 1Tim 1:6, 4:1. 2Tim 2:18, 3:5, 4:4. Titus 1:16. James 4:1, 2Pet 2:1, 3:17. 1Jn2:18, 4:1. Jude 1:4. Rev 2:2, 3:16, 13:7
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Here's the big difference between Mormonism and other "mainstream" versions of Christianity--The Holy Spirit. We certainly believe that Jesus prophesied the coming of the Spirit when he spoke of an Advocate who would come soon to reveal all truth. We have the Holy Spirit, and with him, the Christian church can never be fully corrupted to the point where we would need any other to testify on God's behalf in creation of a wholly new church and new Scriptures. In fact, the Bible testifies that any prophet whose testimony is contradictory to previous revelation is not a true prophet, and is not sent by God.
We too believe in the Holy Spirit. The Holy Ghost was active among men/women not only after the ascension of Christ (as is commonly taught in "mainstream Christianity") but also to a certain degree while Christ was still on the earth (see and compare 1Cor 12:3 and Matt 16:16-17) prior to His birth (Luke 1:35 and Luke 1:41) and in Old Testament times as well (Matt 12:36 refers to this). The Holy Ghost/Holy Spirit is vitally important and has been vitally important to knowing the truth, I believe from the beginning of time. He is the third member of the Godhead. As you know, His role is to testify of the truthfulness of the Father and the Son and to bring all things to our rememberence. He is to teach and to comfort us. His role is also to cleanse and to purify. The trouble is, there were many in the early Christian church whom rejected the Holy Spirit. The halt of scripture is evidence of this as revelation is one of the fruits of the Holy Spirit.
Despite the confusion and darkness that ensued as guidance from living prophets and apostles was removed from the earth (thus the dark ages) the Holy Spirit still confirmed truths regarding former apostles and prophets teachings. I believe this played a huge part in the Reformation. This Reformation then laid the stage to make possible, starting in 1820 the Restoration. In 1820, in answer not only to a 14 yr old Boy's prayers but in answer I believe to millions of prayers offered prior, the windows of heaven were again thrown wide open and God called another prophet to help establish again His church upon the earth in order to prepare for His second coming. Joseph saw the Father and the Son at His right hand, as had Stephen anciently (Acts 7:55-56).
As no doubt the Holy Spirit has confirmed to you that Christ lives and is your Savior, the Holy Ghost will also confirm to you that Joseph Smith is a true prophet of the Lord as you read the Book of Mormon and pray about its message. If he is indeed a true prophet of God, as I believe him to be, then what he taught about Christ is vastly important for you to know. The scriptures are clear that one cannot reject the messengers of Christ without also rejecting Him. Revelations given from Him regarding His former revelations are tremendously helpful in clarifying the truths already contained (but often misinterpreted) within the Bible. It is in part for this reason that a knowledge of the truthfulness of the calling of Joseph Smith as a prophet is important as Joseph is a true messenger for He whom is our true Savior, the Son of God, "The Eternal God," even Jesus Christ.
I think you will find that reading the Book of Mormon will draw you closer to Christ, at least I have found this to be true in my own life. It is a powerful witness of His Divinity... a witness that God has provided from a DIFFERENT region of the world to us that "Jesus is the Christ, The Eternal God, manifesting himself unto all nations" (title page, Book of Mormon). The Book of Mormon is true as is the Bible. God uses multiple witnesses to establish His truth, whether this be multiple individuals or multiple nations (2Cor 13:1). The Book of Mormon corroborates and supports the Bible and the truths therein. God does love His children and Jesus is indeed the Christ. I'm not aware of any religion other than true Christianity, that has writings and scripture from more than one region of the world to confirm its truthfulness. The "Stick of Judah" (Bible) and the "Stick of Joseph" (Book of Mormon) are unified as one!! It is truly a "marvelous work and a wonder" (Isaiah 29). Such is my belief, my knowledge and my testimony. I invite you to learn for yourself of this additional witness of Christ, though I certainly have no desire to force you, nor would I if I could. May you be blessed.
sk8er55, in all your decisions, involve the Lord in prayer. The Bible makes it clear that He will guide you if you ask for this guidance. That is all I can tell you in regards to your request for "teenager" advice.
In regards to Revelation 22:18-19, this is commonly taught as an injunction against any future scripture and as this being the end of the Biblical canon. However, when the Book of Revelation was written, the Bible did not yet exist as a canon. I believe the book to which the Book of Revelation is referring is the Book of Revelation, not the entire Bible, and certainly not God's ability or right to declare scripture. Furthermore, most biblical scholars believe that the Book of Revelation is not the last book that was actually written in the Bible. The books are not placed in chronological order. A very similar injunction to Revelation 22:18-19 is also found in Deut 4:2, "Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you..." Clearly, this is not a statement limiting God's ability to reveal or there would not be future revelation.
As stated in one of my earlier posts. Only a false prophet can proclaim that there will be no more revelation, for it would take a revelation from God proclaiming this (which there hasn't been) thus invalidating the false prophet's claim. Furthermore, God is an unchanging God. He is a God of revelation. If He ceases to reveal, it is not that He has changed but that man has stopped listening and rejected He and His messengers.
We see this pattern multiple times in the Bible. He withdrew prophets and scriptural revelation for the current events while the children of Israel were in Egypt, turned to idololatry. He withdrew His prophets several hundreds of years before Christ came due to the wickedness of the Israelites, though he sent messengers again (i.e. John the Baptist) immediately before Christ to prepare the way for Him. After the world again rejected His servants (the apostles, to include apostles called after the death of Judas) He again withdrew prophets and apostles, and with that ceased scriptural revelation for a time. However, He has again called prophets and apostles in our day to help prepare the way for His second coming (just as the way was prepared prior to His first coming). Of the hour "no man knoweth," but it is coming.
sk8er55, I believe God is far more loving than many "Christians" acknowledge. There are going to be many saved at that last day, whom are being prematurely "judged" or "condemned" as heading for hell by some on earth. I believe there are also going to be some not saved whom we would think might be.
Good luck with whatever you decide. Stay focused on your schooling right now and stay out of trouble. If you are partnered with Christ... you can go to far astray before He will pull you back.
My one very big issue with the Church of the Latter-Day Saints is their denial of the Trinity. The idea that God is one in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is an extremely important idea that has been rooted in mainstream Christianity for many hundreds of years.
The concept of the Trinity has been rooted in "mainstream Christianity" for hundreds of years. The concept first evolved around 300 A.D. A multitude of church leaders at the time had differing opinions regarding the true nature of God, they eventually came to the compromise known as the Nicene Creed. Later creeds were also formed. These were largely based in the non-bliblical belief that matter is evil and were influenced heavily by other non-Christian influences of the day.
The scriptures are clear that The Father, The Son and the Holy Ghost are One. They are perfectly unified in purpose, thought and intent. These three make up one "Godhead," one God. The word Trinity is not found once in the Bible. It is a later invention. All three of these individuals bear the single Title "God" and act in perfect unification. However, they are still three distinct beings, even when they are all next to each other. The Bible would appear to make this abundantly clear. Gen 1:26, 3:22. Matt 3:17, 26:39. Luke 3:22, John 17:21, Acts 2:33, and Acts 7:55.
Christ is indeed the perfect representation of the Father. However, could not similar things could be said of the son that resembles his father? We are told that Christ didn't merely resemble His Father but was in His "Express Image." Thus if one had Seen Christ, one had seen the Father, not just Because Christ did everything in proxy for the Father, but because in Authority, power, and even in appearance (2Cor 4:4, Col 1:15), Christ was the Father, even though His Father was still in the Heavens. They were and are perfectly unified, thus "One God."
Christ stated that he only did that which He saw the Father do (John 5:19). He has invited us to follow Him and to do likewise (John 14:12). As Christ is One with God, He prayed for us to Become One with Him, and thus by inheritance also One with God, maturing spiritually as a Child of GOD just as children mature here on earth to adulthood. (John 17: 21-23, also Romans 8:16-18. Revelation 3:4-5, 21. These other references also lend credence to this concept: Ps 82:6, Matt 5:48, Acts 17:29, 2Cor 3:18, Gen 3:22, Eph 4:13 and 1Jn 3:2).
This is not to say that we believe we will every replace God, or take His place. This will never be the sake. Such was what Lucifer desired from the beginning and such is wrong.
In 1820, Joseph saw God the Father and the Son on His right hand, similar to the vision of Stephen (Acts 7:55-56) during which he saw Christ on the right hand of the Father. Other prophets also have seen God. (Gen 32:30, Ex 33:11, Deut 34:10, Isa 6:5, Judge 13:22, 1Kgs 11:9, Ezek 1:26-28). Joseph learned of the true nature of the Godhead. This is consistent with the truths of the Bible. This was the most important truth God restored to the Earth again that had been turned away from hundreds of years before as His word became mingled with the philosophies of men and His prophets and apostles and their testimonies rejected and mis-interpreted.
Below are some excellent articles regarding the Godhead.
I invite you to read them and to learn more.
"The Only True God and Jesus Christ Whom He Hath Sent"
The reference to Joseph in Ezekial 37 mentioned in my post above IS a direct reference to Joseph in Egypt, NOT Joseph Smith (I'm glad you read the reference). As stated in my prior reply, this passage prophecies of the coming forth of the Book of Mormon. The Bible was written primarily by descendants of Judah, thus "the stick of Judah". We believe The Book of Mormon was written by descendents of Joseph of Egypt, thus "the stick of Joseph." The sticks can refer to the scrolls written on in the day (there were also anciently wooden tablets filled with wax that people would write on as well). This passage is also a prophecy of the gathering of Israel as the sticks can also refer to ruling scepters (though one doesn't typically write on these)... a time when all would be gathered into the fold of God... happening now.
As one studies the history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, it becomes evident that almost all of the events prophecied of in Isaiah 29 were fulfilled in the early days of the Church (a small part of this chapter remains to be fulfilled, which will probably happen during the Millenium). Isaiah 29 is a prophecy of the events of the restoration. Not just a verse or two but the entire chapter... I would argue that quoting this chapter is definitely not a case of "eisegesis." If you are interested in reading some of the history and fulfillments of prophecy I refer to you may at: Joseph Smith—History 1
None of the passages you mention seem to have anything to do with LDS. I could just as easily apply some of these passages to the Methodist Church or the Catholic Church.
The style of argument that you're using is similar to the Islamic argument. Simply picking various passages and claiming these prophesy to your prophet is not convincing to me. Some of your beliefs and your support of Joe Smith as a prophet appear to me to be scripturally unsound (especially concerning the Trinity)--this is the mark of a false prophet.
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Originally Posted by JNHarris
The truth itself was not corrupted, rather people turned away from it and preached as doctrine the tenents of men mixed with the truths of Christianity. By the days of Joseph Smith, many key aspects of what was then considered as Christianity were based on interpretations of the NT shaped by Platonian thought and pagan influence rather than on true revelation regarding the revelations. Thus a knowledge of the truth was lost, though the truth itself was not corrupted. The truth is still within the pages of the NT.
The Catholic church is imfamous for splicing Greek philosophy with Christianity--this is not the case with any of the Protestant denominations.
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Originally Posted by JNHarris
We too believe in the Holy Spirit. The Holy Ghost was active among men/women not only after the ascension of Christ (as is commonly taught in "mainstream Christianity") but also to a certain degree while Christ was still on the earth (see and compare 1Cor 12:3 and Matt 16:16-17) prior to His birth (Luke 1:35 and Luke 1:41) and in Old Testament times as well (Matt 12:36 refers to this). The Holy Ghost/Holy Spirit is vitally important and has been vitally important to knowing the truth, I believe from the beginning of time. He is the third member of the Godhead. As you know, His role is to testify of the truthfulness of the Father and the Son and to bring all things to our rememberence. He is to teach and to comfort us. His role is also to cleanse and to purify. The trouble is, there were many in the early Christian church whom rejected the Holy Spirit. The halt of scripture is evidence of this as revelation is one of the fruits of the Holy Spirit.
I realize now that you don't deny the Holy Spirit is God. However, I also realize that LDS believes in polytheism. This is the main tenet contradictory to past revelation:
"Is God the God of the Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too, since there is only one God" Romans 3:29-30.
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Originally Posted by JNHarris
I think you will find that reading the Book of Mormon will draw you closer to Christ, at least I have found this to be true in my own life. It is a powerful witness of His Divinity... a witness that God has provided from a DIFFERENT region of the world to us that "Jesus is the Christ, The Eternal God, manifesting himself unto all nations" (title page, Book of Mormon). The Book of Mormon is true as is the Bible. God uses multiple witnesses to establish His truth, whether this be multiple individuals or multiple nations (2Cor 13:1). The Book of Mormon corroborates and supports the Bible and the truths therein. God does love His children and Jesus is indeed the Christ. I'm not aware of any religion other than true Christianity, that has writings and scripture from more than one region of the world to confirm its truthfulness. The "Stick of Judah" (Bible) and the "Stick of Joseph" (Book of Mormon) are unified as one!! It is truly a "marvelous work and a wonder" (Isaiah 29). Such is my belief, my knowledge and my testimony. I invite you to learn for yourself of this additional witness of Christ, though I certainly have no desire to force you, nor would I if I could. May you be blessed.
I wish that you would realize that we simply don't need the the Book of Mormon. Christ was the fulfillment of the Old Testament, and the Old and New Testaments together are all we need for faith and understanding. Having the "right" church traditions and worship is meaningless if we don't have the right heart, and I believe Jesus made it clear in the New Testament that church and worship style is not that important, but it's the heart of worship that matters. Thus, what does the Book of Mormon provide the believer but contradictory notions of Christianity?
I wish that you would realize that we simply don't need the the Book of Mormon. Christ was the fulfillment of the Old Testament, and the Old and New Testaments together are all we need for faith and understanding. Having the "right" church traditions and worship is meaningless if we don't have the right heart, and I believe Jesus made it clear in the New Testament that church and worship style is not that important, but it's the heart of worship that matters. Thus, what does the Book of Mormon provide the believer but contradictory notions of Christianity?
On much we agree, though there are also matters on which we don't agree. Obviously we can go back and forth all day quoting Biblical verse to support our varying points of view.
The greatest evidence as to the truthfulness of the calling of Joseph Smith as a prophet of God is the Book of Mormon. Christ stated, "by their fruits ye shall know them."
Read it, pray about it and you will know it is true (Moroni 10:3-5, BofM), see also James 1:5.
I have done this. I have received multiple witnesses regarding its truthfulness. It has helped bring me much closer to my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I cannot deny that it is His Word anymore than I can deny that the Bible is the Word of God.
Below are the words of the Lord as found in 2Nephi 29 regarding the Book of Mormon and the Bible.
2Nephi 29
1 But behold, there shall be many—at that day when I shall proceed to do a marvelous work among them, that I may remember my covenants which I have made unto the children of men, that I may set my hand again the second time to recover my people, which are of the house of Israel;
2 And also, that I may remember the promises which I have made unto thee, Nephi, and also unto thy father, that I would remember your seed; and that the words of your seed should proceed forth out of my mouth unto your seed; and my words shall hiss forth unto the ends of the earth, for a standard unto my people, which are of the house of Israel;
3 And because my words shall hiss forth—many of the Gentiles shall say: A Bible! A Bible! We have got a Bible, and there cannot be any more Bible.
4 But thus saith the Lord God: O fools, they shall have a Bible; and it shall proceed forth from the Jews, mine ancient covenant people. And what thank they the Jews for the Bible which they receive from them? Yea, what do the Gentiles mean? Do they remember the travails, and the labors, and the pains of the Jews, and their diligence unto me, in bringing forth salvation unto the Gentiles?
5 O ye Gentiles, have ye remembered the Jews, mine ancient covenant people? Nay; but ye have cursed them, and have hated them, and have not sought to recover them. But behold, I will return all these things upon your own heads; for I the Lord have not forgotten my people.
6 Thou fool, that shall say: A Bible we have got a Bible, and we need no more Bible. Have ye obtained a Bible save it were by the Jews?
7 Know ye not that there are more nations than one? Know ye not that I, the Lord your God, have created all men, and that I remember those who are upon the isles of the sea; and that I rule in the heavens above and in the earth beneath; and I bring forth my word unto the children of men, yea, even upon all the nations of the earth?
8 Wherefore murmur ye, because that ye shall receive more of my word? Know ye not that the testimony of two nations is a witness unto you that I am God, that I remember one nation like unto another? Wherefore, I speak the same words unto one nation like unto another. And when the two nations shall run together the testimony of the two nations shall run together also.
9 And I do this that I may prove unto many that I am the same yesterday, today, and forever; and that I speak forth my words according to mine own pleasure. And because that I have spoken one word ye need not suppose that I cannot speak another; for my work is not yet finished; neither shall it be until the end of man, neither from that time henceforth and forever.
10 Wherefore, because that ye have a Bible ye need not suppose that it contains all my words; neither need ye suppose that I have not caused more to be written.
11 For I command all men, both in the east and in the west, and in the north, and in the south, and in the islands of the sea, that they shall write the words which I speak unto them; for out of the books which shall be written I will judge the world, every man according to their works, according to that which is written.
12 For behold, I shall speak unto the Jews and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the Nephites and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto the other tribes of the house of Israel, which I have led away, and they shall write it; and I shall also speak unto all nations of the earth and they shall write it.
13 And it shall come to pass that the Jews shall have the words of the Nephites, and the Nephites shall have the words of the Jews; and the Nephites and the Jews shall have the words of the lost tribes of Israel; and the lost tribes of Israel shall have the words of the Nephites and the Jews.
14 And it shall come to pass that my people, which are of the house of Israel, shall be gathered home unto the lands of their possessions; and my word also shall be gathered in one. And I will show unto them that fight against my word and against my people, who are of the house of Israel, that I am God, and that I covenanted with Abraham that I would remember his seed forever.
On much we agree, though there are also matters on which we don't agree. Obviously we can go back and forth all day quoting Biblical verse to support our varying points of view.
The greatest evidence as to the truthfulness of the calling of Joseph Smith as a prophet of God is the Book of Mormon. Christ stated, "by their fruits ye shall know them."
Yes, there is much more that we agree upon then disagree. It's just that in order for me to seriously read the the Book of Mormon, I would have to be convinced of two things:
(1) That the teachings of Joseph Smith are not contradictory to past revelation (i.e. the Old and New Testaments).
(2) That such a great prophet to have added new scriptures and bring the final word of truth (even after Jesus himself), would surely be prophesied...I would need to see reasonable testimony in the Scriptures concerning Joseph Smith.
The Point: I am far from being convinced of either of those two points.
I thank you for your kindness in explaining more about LDS to me, and I pray to God for your blessing.
I agree with much of this, and see that this is a distraction from the reality of the Bible, as the last of Revelations talks about in chapter 22:18-19, "18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book."
does this apply to all mormons? because i know many mormons pray to God and Jesus, and accept him as Savior.
FIRST OF ALL I NEED TEENAGER ADVICE! =) - im 15...
and needing advice as a Christian thinking about a relationship with a mormon, she is probably the kindest, most encouraging girl i know, and am not sure how much she is devoted to being a mormon, and what her firm beliefs are differing to the Bible... is it right, or wrong and can it be that bad to want a relationship like this in high school?
The site is based on the book, Speaking the truth in love to Mormons.
This will help you to understand the culture of Mormonism..... the attractions but also the stresses many have (especially teenager girls). This isn't a bash 'em site, but how best to reach out to them, in the language they understand.
What you may not be aware of (and your friend may not either) is the ultimate goal of Mormonism is to become a god.
This is from Doctrine & Covenents
"They shall pass by the angels, and the gods, which are set there, to their exaltation and glory in all things, as hath been sealed upon their heads, which glory shall be a fulness and a continuation of the seeds forever and ever. Then shall they be gods, because they have no end; therefore shall they be from everlasting to everlasting because they continue; then shall they be above all, because all things are subject unto them. Then shall they be gods, because they have all power, and the angels are subject unto them. D&C, 132:19,20
When Mormons say that they believe in Jesus as their savior, the usage of terms isn't the same as when confessed from a Christian. As for some spiritual advice from a Christian who is old enough to be your father, (since I have children same age & older than you) .... be very well grounded in the Bible... very well grounded!
I can not think of any other religion today than what Jesus warns about the "wolf" in sheeps clothing; the "sheep" that has teeth like a bear; and the like.
LDS is a great mission field but its also like a web that is easy to get into but extremely hard to get out.
Do not be decieved. The gospel of Mormonism is no gospel at all. It's salvation based on works.
It appears to me, that one of the last true bastions of what is good and genuine about America still resides within American Mormon culture, beliefs and teachings. I am not a Mormon but I do believe our country would significantly benefit from the examples of how main stream Mormons live today in America.
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American Mormon Culture
