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There isn't anything that does not require faith to believe.
Nothing is infallible... so, you always need faith in the veracity of the data/info it is based upon.
All you have is faith...you need to get hip to that.
There is a huge chasm of difference between walking across a bridge because you have "faith" that it will support you, and stepping off of a cliff because you have "faith" that your invisible friend will carry you safely to the other side. Faith in physical reality will in all probability get you safely to the other side. Faith in make believe can get you killed.
Pastor EATEN by crocodiles trying to walk on water
Jonathan Mthethwa was killed by three crocodiles as he carried out a religious demonstration in Zimbabwe.
Shocked witnesses said the clergyman had “prayed the whole week” before the stunt went tragically wrong.
He had also fasted in the lead-up to the attempted miracle, which was inspired by a Biblical tale of Jesus walking on water during a storm.
Horrified members of the Saint of the Last Days Church said the pastor was completely devoured in a “couple of minutes”.
He promised he would demonstrate his faith to us today, but he unfortunately ended up drowning and getting eaten
He had waded around 30 metres into what was known locally as 'Crocodile River'. At this point he had promised his congregation he would rise up above the water.
Instead he was brutally attacked by a group of crocodiles who had been hidden in the deep water.
Deacon Nkosi said: “The pastor taught us about faith on Sunday last week.
“He promised he would demonstrate his faith to us today, but he unfortunately ended up drowning and getting eaten by three large crocodiles in front of us.
The attack occurred when the pastor was attempting to walk on water
“We still don’t understand how this happened because he fasted and prayed the whole week.”
Unsupported "faith" in make believe may simply be evolution's way of weeding stupid people out of the human gene pool.
05-27-2018, 11:22 AM
2K5Gx2km
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tired of the Nonsense
There is a huge chasm of difference between walking across a bridge because you have "faith" that it will support you, and stepping off of a cliff because you have "faith" that your invisible friend will carry you safely to the other side. Faith in physical reality will in all probability get you safely to the other side. Faith in make believe can get you killed.
Pastor EATEN by crocodiles trying to walk on water
Jonathan Mthethwa was killed by three crocodiles as he carried out a religious demonstration in Zimbabwe.
Shocked witnesses said the clergyman had “prayed the whole week” before the stunt went tragically wrong.
He had also fasted in the lead-up to the attempted miracle, which was inspired by a Biblical tale of Jesus walking on water during a storm.
Horrified members of the Saint of the Last Days Church said the pastor was completely devoured in a “couple of minutes”.
He promised he would demonstrate his faith to us today, but he unfortunately ended up drowning and getting eaten
He had waded around 30 metres into what was known locally as 'Crocodile River'. At this point he had promised his congregation he would rise up above the water.
Instead he was brutally attacked by a group of crocodiles who had been hidden in the deep water.
Deacon Nkosi said: “The pastor taught us about faith on Sunday last week.
“He promised he would demonstrate his faith to us today, but he unfortunately ended up drowning and getting eaten by three large crocodiles in front of us.
The attack occurred when the pastor was attempting to walk on water
“We still don’t understand how this happened because he fasted and prayed the whole week.”
The underlying reason, if faith is just a component, depending on how small that component is, does NOT have to be the underlying reason.
If the data if vetted and repeated and understood with high confidence beyond just chance it is not mere faith. There has to be a line drawn somewhere on this spectrum or all things beyond these ideas are meaningless with regard to these words. The data as such is far more reliable than just trusting an ancient voice to say that some extraordinary event or thing exists or happened. If you can't see the difference then that is quit sad and maybe a problem you should work on. No one is arguing that we can know all things or even most things 100%. The fact that we can not does not mean that all things are faith based according to how we use these terms and ideas.
Right...With anything we "know" it falls on a "probability scale".
Nothing can ever be 100%... because anything could be something other than what we figure it is.
The only reason we believe anything at all...is because we have faith (to whatever degree) that we trust the accuracy of the data/info that supports it. Without that faith...you would not believe it to be so.
You always need faith.
That is why it is ignorant to say that it is foolish for the religious to believe what they do on faith...when everyone believes anything and everything they do on faith.
I understand just fine that some things have higher probability of being accurate than others...but it is always on faith we accept whatever degree of probability we think it has.
Religious beliefs are not an exception as many like to claim. All knowledge is supported upon faith.
Right...With anything we "know" it falls on a "probability scale".
Nothing can ever be 100%... because anything could be something other than what we figure it is.
The only reason we believe anything at all...is because we have faith (to whatever degree) that we trust the accuracy of the data/info that supports it. Without that faith...you would not believe it to be so.
You always need faith.
That is why it is ignorant to say that it is foolish for the religious to believe what they do on faith...when everyone believes anything and everything they do on faith.
I understand just fine that some things have higher probability of being accurate than others...but it is always on faith we accept whatever degree of probability we think it has.
Religious beliefs are not an exception as many like to claim. All knowledge is supported upon faith.
You contradict yourself there. "We trust the acuracy of the data that supports it"
That is, the track record for science speaks for itself. Not perfect, always rvisong, but very largely, worthy of this 'faith' that you speak of.
Religious claims are not in the same league. In fact, as far as being worthy of trust goes, they are not even players.
So to equate the two is the good old fallacy of equivocation.
There isn't anything that does not require faith to believe.
Nothing is infallible... so, you always need faith in the veracity of the data/info it is based upon.
All you have is faith...you need to get hip to that.
Ha, the old 'all faith is equal' rubbish.
You will next be arguing my belief that I will have another coffee makes coffee drinking a belief system.
There is a huge chasm of difference between walking across a bridge because you have "faith" that it will support you, and stepping off of a cliff because you have "faith" that your invisible friend will carry you safely to the other side. Faith in physical reality will in all probability get you safely to the other side. Faith in make believe can get you killed.
Pastor EATEN by crocodiles trying to walk on water
Jonathan Mthethwa was killed by three crocodiles as he carried out a religious demonstration in Zimbabwe.
Shocked witnesses said the clergyman had “prayed the whole week” before the stunt went tragically wrong.
He had also fasted in the lead-up to the attempted miracle, which was inspired by a Biblical tale of Jesus walking on water during a storm.
Horrified members of the Saint of the Last Days Church said the pastor was completely devoured in a “couple of minutes”.
He promised he would demonstrate his faith to us today, but he unfortunately ended up drowning and getting eaten
He had waded around 30 metres into what was known locally as 'Crocodile River'. At this point he had promised his congregation he would rise up above the water.
Instead he was brutally attacked by a group of crocodiles who had been hidden in the deep water.
Deacon Nkosi said: “The pastor taught us about faith on Sunday last week.
“He promised he would demonstrate his faith to us today, but he unfortunately ended up drowning and getting eaten by three large crocodiles in front of us.
The attack occurred when the pastor was attempting to walk on water
“We still don’t understand how this happened because he fasted and prayed the whole week.”
Unsupported "faith" in make believe may simply be evolution's way of weeding stupid people out of the human gene pool.
Was he nominated for a Darwin Award? (Those are awarded every year to people [usually posthumously] who improve the human gene pool by removing themselves from it.)
The underlying reason, if faith is just a component, depending on how small that component is, does NOT have to be the underlying reason.
If the data if vetted and repeated and understood with high confidence beyond just chance it is not mere faith. There has to be a line drawn somewhere on this spectrum or all things beyond these ideas are meaningless with regard to these words. The data as such is far more reliable than just trusting an ancient voice to say that some extraordinary event or thing exists or happened. If you can't see the difference then that is quit sad and maybe a problem you should work on. No one is arguing that we can know all things or even most things 100%. The fact that we can not does not mean that all things are faith based according to how we use these terms and ideas.
The line we use consciously and unconsciously is probability... the probability of this or that.
Do you have faith whenever you cross bridges? Are you always 100% certain of the infrastructure?
Great point to bring up.
I practice absolute blind faith crossing bridges...completely blind..
I have NO certainty.
I have more certainty in the chair I sit in that I have seen has stood up for years and has no wobbles...aka, weak points.
That bridge could have just been lucky some crack has not gone
all the way thru...yet.
I can not stand blind faith...I say know something is a sure thing, myself.
You will next be arguing my belief that I will have another coffee makes coffee drinking a belief system.
That's not a bad analogy. I have to confess that coffee -drinking in my life feels me with dread at the thought that there might not be coffee in the afterlife.
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(Those are awarded every year to people [usually posthumously] who improve the human gene pool by removing themselves from it.)
