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It looks like KB tried to do something at the Quarry and really offer non box homes, but it didn't work out and they have gone back to their 40-45 foot fronts like they do with their Hallmark brand, but offer some additional elevations and an extra garage.
My recomendation is to buy a Hallmark, and just get structural options i.e. extended porch, 5th bedroom, 9ft ceilings, electrical upgrades, kitchen cabinet upgrades, and plumbing upgrades. Spend 200K and then put $35k in upgrades and get you hardwood floors, stone flooring, appliances, crown molding, etc. You will have a home tailored to what you want, and not limited to the builders options which will cost you a ton of money. Not to mention that you will be paying only property tax on 200K not 235K.
Just for clarification - are you saying to buy a KB Hallmark home instead of their more expensive lines?
Yeah I really don't mind what the size of our neighbors yards are as long as mine is the size I want. What I really love is that we have no houses behind us, just trees. We don't have lots like that here.
Just for clarification - are you saying to buy a KB Hallmark home instead of their more expensive lines?
Yes, I can say that because I just got back from taking a browse of the Quarry. Some things I noticed:
2. The windows in their 400K homes are the same ones used on their Hallmarks and probably their entire line of homes. Where are the nice pella type wood stained interiors? Double hung windows? etc.
3. The front doors are the same, exception a side light or two. 9ft ceiling on Hallmark gets the same door without the sidelight
4. 3000+ sf gets you another heatpump in their top of the line brands. With your Hallmark just get it zoned. Although not as effecient as two heatpumps, it still gets the job done.
5. Their attempt at custom didn't go well...thats why they are still trying to sell their 400K+ homes
6. The model they are now selling after they attempted to go custom is no different than the box that they typically sell. No more tray ceilings or big vaults...just the standard 9ft ceiling you can upgrade to in the Hallmark. No more standard crown molding etc.
7. Quarry offers a slightly bigger lot 70-135 vice the 65-120 lot I got with my Hallmark
8. Exterior is a little nicer in the Quarry in that you have stone integrated with the brick
9. Quarry uses cedar fences vice the standard wood with most other communities.
10. Same cheap bathroom exhaust fans that they use in their entire line
KB foray into the custom home price range at 350-500K didn't go well and now they have gone back to their boxes with a little nicer facade and little bigger lot at an increased profit margin.
I wasn't impressed with the Quarry at that price point. $380K spec home I looked... when I compare it to the 204K home I bought about the same SF, although I did add probably 40K in upgrades...granite countertops to include arches in dining room, slate patio & porch, bamboo floors to include stairway, 35 year laminate upstairs floor, totally wired home with to include two fiberoptic cables for my cable jacks, etc, etc.
Buy a Hallmark on a nice lot...spend a month to get crown installed, rip out the standard carpet and put in hardwood and stone, pay the electrician to custom wire it, give the tile guy $100 to add a nice border in your tubs, give Brinks your bundled cat5E fiber rg6 lines to run, see if the on site sup will allow you to add a window or two, and you will have a better home at one hell of a less price...not to mention you will be paying taxes on 200K vice 300K+.
Just my personal opinion. Having spent about a month watching my home built and comparing it to other homes being built by KB and others. They build the homes to code. The location and what they offer on the inside make the price swings. A lot cheaper to do non structural stuff after you close. I know, because I have done it - only home to probably have hurricane ties, none of that toe nail crap at my gables (bought the simpson strong tie clips and gave it to the framer and watch him nail it), brick ties at 16" instead of 24". The only thing I messed up on was not getting the insulation guy to soundproof my bathrooms and laundry room, a few more 2x4s in the interior walls would have also been nice, and paying for about 600sf of tile when I could have put in stone at probably about the same price.
Yes, I can say that because I just got back from taking a browse of the Quarry. Some things I noticed:
2. The windows in their 400K homes are the same ones used on their Hallmarks and probably their entire line of homes. Where are the nice pella type wood stained interiors? Double hung windows? etc.
3. The front doors are the same, exception a side light or two. 9ft ceiling on Hallmark gets the same door without the sidelight
4. 3000+ sf gets you another heatpump in their top of the line brands. With your Hallmark just get it zoned. Although not as effecient as two heatpumps, it still gets the job done.
5. Their attempt at custom didn't go well...thats why they are still trying to sell their 400K+ homes
6. The model they are now selling after they attempted to go custom is no different than the box that they typically sell. No more tray ceilings or big vaults...just the standard 9ft ceiling you can upgrade to in the Hallmark. No more standard crown molding etc.
7. Quarry offers a slightly bigger lot 70-135 vice the 65-120 lot I got with my Hallmark
8. Exterior is a little nicer in the Quarry in that you have stone integrated with the brick
9. Quarry uses cedar fences vice the standard wood with most other communities.
10. Same cheap bathroom exhaust fans that they use in their entire line
KB foray into the custom home price range at 350-500K didn't go well and now they have gone back to their boxes with a little nicer facade and little bigger lot at an increased profit margin.
I wasn't impressed with the Quarry at that price point. $380K spec home I looked... when I compare it to the 204K home I bought about the same SF, although I did add probably 40K in upgrades...granite countertops to include arches in dining room, slate patio & porch, bamboo floors to include stairway, 35 year laminate upstairs floor, totally wired home with to include two fiberoptic cables for my cable jacks, etc, etc.
Buy a Hallmark on a nice lot...spend a month to get crown installed, rip out the standard carpet and put in hardwood and stone, pay the electrician to custom wire it, give the tile guy $100 to add a nice border in your tubs, give Brinks your bundled cat5E fiber rg6 lines to run, see if the on site sup will allow you to add a window or two, and you will have a better home at one hell of a less price...not to mention you will be paying taxes on 200K vice 300K+.
Just my personal opinion. Having spent about a month watching my home built and comparing it to other homes being built by KB and others. They build the homes to code. The location and what they offer on the inside make the price swings. A lot cheaper to do non structural stuff after you close. I know, because I have done it - only home to probably have hurricane ties, none of that toe nail crap at my gables (bought the simpson strong tie clips and gave it to the framer and watch him nail it), brick ties at 16" instead of 24". The only thing I messed up on was not getting the insulation guy to soundproof my bathrooms and laundry room, a few more 2x4s in the interior walls would have also been nice, and paying for about 600sf of tile when I could have put in stone at probably about the same price.
Have you priced houses with pella windows? They cost a lot more than $400K...anyway. The windows aren't the same - exactly. In the Quarry and The Woods of Alon are standard tan windows which look much better even if they are from the same manufacturer.
Front doors/9ft ceilings - yes the doors are the same - but it is all about standard features. In the Quarry I am guaranteed that all of my neighbors have at least the 9ft ceilings and nice entry doors. In their mid level homes you could have a neighbor that didn't select that upgrade and have eight foot ceilings and those types of cheap touches really hurt a neighborhood. So - while you can get the nine foot ceilings in other neighhorhoods - not all your neighbors will...thus you end up being on the high end in terms of upgrades.
To each his own on the A/C issue. I for one like being in a neighborhood with homes engineered with proper A/C layouts. Again - this is something that will impact the entire neighborhood resale value.
I wouldn't say their attempt to go semi-custom didn't go well. Did you see the street after street of high end $400-$500K homes? The national real estate market really hurt KB and many other builders. The change in product is an attempt to complete the neighborhood with cheaper to build homes that can be completed faster than the existing semi-custom homes like what I am having built. They were able to successfully market, build and sell very high end homes that are nothing like anything else KB has built in San Antonio since their 1996 aquisition of RAYCO.
The model you walked through was a Trails model...they don't have an Empire collection model at the Quarry but do at The Woods of Alon. And you are correct - they no longer offer tray/vaulted ceilings like in the old Liberty/Estate homes. This is a drawback and I agree that just the standard nine foot ceilings aren't nearly as nice. But they (KB) still has one thing not offered by a Hallmark line house - and that is an oversized three car garage. Why? Because the Hallmark target audience doesnt' expect that nor are the lots big enough to accomodate such a luxury. Which leads into your next point...the lot size. The Quarry's standard lot is larger than many upgraded lots in their other neightborhoods. The lot size was the biggest draw for us. If you go to Fox Grove, Stage Run, Cobblestone or even Saddle Mountain - you get that crammed in look that the Quarry avoids completely. I don't know how you can dismiss this so easily. Land is king. just having a large lot in a neighborhood full of small lots is meaningless. You are still left with that feeling of most of the homes being crammed in together. The Quarry has a spaciousness to it that no other KB community has offered - and this is due primarily to the generous STANDARD lot size. The lot size you quote is their smallest. Mine is 75 feet wide by 135 feet deep and on the small end - thers are wider and deeper than mine.
The exterior is "a little nicer"...drive through any of the Hallmark neighborhoods and you will see that while they offer four sides brick (as an upgrade) they don't offer the high end brick selections that the Quarry does nor do they offer the stone option. Again - this is a huge value add that will keep the neighborhood from looking like some of RAYCO/KB's attempts at nice neighborhoods like Gold Canyon which has some horrid brick options...which sadly KB still offers...like grey and pink brick....who selects that anyway?
Another plus in the Quarry is the standard sprinkler system - another feature that will help keep the community nicer in the long run without folks dragging unsightly hoses across the yard and leaving them there for weeks...
The element that The Quarry has that no other KB community will offer...is the type of buyer. Those that are spending $350-$500K on a home tend to be more discerning and have higher standards of up keep as well as more discretionary income needed to make updates and keep the neighborhood fresh over the long haul. This is not to put down other cheaper communities...but it is a stated fact. I know lots of folks that live in Hallmark homes and they are some of the best...but it does impact the over all feel of the community. (No haters due to this comment....please....)
Finally - there are many many many standard interior features from fixtures to the size baseboards used in the Quarry that are not used in other communities. It is all the little details that make a house - and while you are correct - there are many similarities between the Hallmark and the cheaper Quarry line - the Trails (the Empire is the nicer of the Quarry lines and unrelated in any way to the Hallmark houses) it is the little details that come standard in the Quarry that set apart this community over the others. I would argue that knowing your neighbors didn't cheap out has value over the long haul.
I am glad you are happy with your home. I am happy with mine so far and can't wait to move in this summer. Best of luck to you. Moderator cut: sentences removed
Last edited by Jammie; 04-27-2008 at 07:37 PM..
Reason: Everyone is free to post on a thread
Front doors/9ft ceilings - yes the doors are the same - but it is all about standard features. In the Quarry I am guaranteed that all of my neighbors have at least the 9ft ceilings and nice entry doors. In their mid level homes you could have a neighbor that didn't select that upgrade and have eight foot ceilings and those types of cheap touches really hurt a neighborhood. So - while you can get the nine foot ceilings in other neighhorhoods - not all your neighbors will...thus you end up being on the high end in terms of upgrades.
Lots of builders have the 9 ft ceilings - standard. Having an eight foot ceiling does not mean it is cheap. We have standard 9 ft ceilings and are paying nowhere near the prices at the Quarry. I am not saying The Quarry isn't
nice. But for you to say it is better than the "cheap" neighborhoods is ridiculous.
The final element that The Quarry has that no other KB community will offer...is the type of buyer. Those that are spending $350-$500K on a home tend to be more discerning and have higher standards of up keep as well as more discretionary income needed to make updates and keep the neighborhood fresh over the long haul. This is not to put down other cheaper communities...but it is a stated fact. I know lots of folks that live in Hallmark homes and they are some of the best...but it does impact the over all feel of the community. (No haters due to this comment....please....)
Just because people have the money doesn't mean they are going to spend it on up keep. You'd be surprised at how many people are completely in debt and are house poor leaving no money for updates.
Just because people have the money doesn't mean they are going to spend it on up keep. You'd be surprised at how many people are completely in debt and are house poor leaving no money for updates.
The same can be said of cheaper neighborhoods. There are house poor people living in every neighborhood in San Antonio...but at least to get into the Quarry you have to qualify for the house - which means you have a higher income level...so the odds work in your favor.
But again - lets not make this into a socioeconomic debate. To each his own.
Of course there are house poor people living everywhere. thats my point. We could have qualified for a house in the quarry but then we would have been strapped. Lenders will qualify people for houses they really can't afford. You say to each his own but put down any neighborhood that is not the quarry.
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