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You are WAY off base here. I never stated the OP's case wasn't real or valid so you are totally wrong. I never said it wasn't true for me or anyone else. I never said anyone wasn't telling the truth. I was asking more details about their experience which is far from the same thing what you are implying.
I was very polite with the OP. Where I live or some of the things you mentioned have no bearing on this conversation at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bloom
er is even-handed, Fran66
It's not about being even-handed. Its about the appropriateness of asking for more details about unpleasant experiences.
If I were in some accident, I would not appreciate being asked for details in a forum like this. From my close family and friends it might be OK, but definitely not in a forum like this which is open to the whole world.
Even more so if the bad situation I had to endure wasn't an accident but was deliberately caused by some ignorant, bigoted person.
Bad things happen. What's the point of asking for more details? Two reasons I can think of are skepticism (and I'm guessing that's what Fran66 was responding to) or a touch of ghoulishness. Either way or any way, I would feel it to be an unwelcome question. Just sayin ...
It's not about being even-handed. Its about the appropriateness of asking for more details about unpleasant experiences.
If I were in some accident, I would not appreciate being asked for details in a forum like this. From my close family and friends it might be OK, but definitely not in a forum like this which is open to the whole world.
Even more so if the bad situation I had to endure wasn't an accident but was deliberately caused by some ignorant, bigoted person.
Bad things happen. What's the point of asking for more details? Two reasons I can think of are skepticism (and I'm guessing that's what Fran66 was responding to) or a touch of ghoulishness. Either way or any way, I would feel it to be an unwelcome question. Just sayin ...
We can agree to disagree. If someone comes to an anonymous board to post about their "accident" then I don't find anything wrong with people asking details of that "accident". As well, this is no where the same thing as being in a personal setting where you are sitting around face to face. The setting is totally different which I'm sure you will agree.
The structure and set up of these kinds of forums is to share experiences, learn and grow and find out about things. I think as long as people are respectful and courteous there isn't anything wrong with that. And of course if people choose not to share that is their prerogative as well but there isn't anything wrong with asking questions, IMHO.
Absolutely we can all agree to disagree with the "bad things happen what is the purpose of asking more details". In society today there are so many cases and examples where that is just clearly wrong to have that attitude.
IMHO, we need to get to a place in society when someone speaks about horrible things no matter the race, religion or sexual orientation of the person, and the acts are so heinous then why not discuss it? If a white or Asian or Hispanic person came on the board and told of how they were mistreated, had horrible things said to them or some of the same things that the OP mentioned, would it not be ok to ask them follow up questions about it? I don't think so. So why should it be wrong to ask someone that is black about it?
Right is right and wrong is wrong in my eyes. We need to get to a place where we can talk about ANY horrible issues in society that are happening where it's not only ok to ask about it if the person is white or in the majority. What happens a few decades from now when white people are the minority? Get my point?
Last edited by earlyretirement; 06-17-2013 at 11:54 AM..
True. This is an open forum to the public, but it can go either way oddstray.
If someone doesnt want to share their experience (bad or good), then so be it. I dont see the harm in asking...especially considering the degree of anonymity or lack thereof any poster chooses to expose themselves to.
While I would not consider this an online confession booth of sorts, I think these days, especially online, there are advantages to people sharing that kind of REAL personal info. I dont have stats, but am pretty certain there are far more readers than contributors. If someone shares their own painful or great experience, that is where the strength of an online forum comes in. IMHO there may be one reader that it impacts personally or shares the same experience.
In forums world, there are two ways people make a point: personal experiences or just rehashing data points or extrapolating data points to illustrate a point.
Both are valid and only become more valuable when a personal experience can be expanded upon.
Additionally, I am not sure if posting in THIS forum was appropriate but it does border considering queenvic experienced it in SD. Nonetheless, she did take the time to post about how she wont answer the post (anonymously) rather than just share her experience in just as much detail and thought.
True. This is an open forum to the public, but it can go either way oddstray.
If someone doesnt want to share their experience (bad or good), then so be it. I dont see the harm in asking...especially considering the degree of anonymity or lack thereof any poster chooses to expose themselves to.
While I would not consider this an online confession booth of sorts, I think these days, especially online, there are advantages to people sharing that kind of REAL personal info. I dont have stats, but am pretty certain there are far more readers than contributors. If someone shares their own painful or great experience, that is where the strength of an online forum comes in. IMHO there may be one reader that it impacts personally or shares the same experience.
In forums world, there are two ways people make a point: personal experiences or just rehashing data points or extrapolating data points to illustrate a point.
Both are valid and only become more valuable when a personal experience can be expanded upon.
Additionally, I am not sure if posting in THIS forum was appropriate but it does border considering queenvic experienced it in SD. Nonetheless, she did take the time to post about how she wont answer the post (anonymously) rather than just share her experience in just as much detail and thought.
I totally agree with you (as usual) Shmoov. It's not like I was asking the OP what her name was, where she lived, where these events happened, etc. or other types of very invasive questions.
On these anonymous boards, there are always more lurkers than there are posters. And people should always remember these boards will be around forever. So they can serve as a tremendous educational source of information on a number of topics.
What I love about Citydata is they do have really helpful and useful statistics. But I actually think where the real "gem" of information is all the personal experiences from people in any given city or on any given topic.
I agree that this topic could get off topic but I think it's relevant as it relates to their experiences in San Diego as that is what we are discussing here vs. just speaking in general how it might be for someone in any given city.
I also think it's great that we all disagree on certain topics/subjects and we all have our own opinions. The world would be a really boring place if we all thought the same thing. People disagreeing about various topics is actually very healthy and normal in society.
We can agree to disagree. If someone comes to an anonymous board to post about their "accident" then I don't find anything wrong with people asking details of that "accident". As well, this is no where the same thing as being in a personal setting where you are sitting around face to face. The setting is totally different which I'm sure you will agree.
The structure and set up of these kinds of forums is to share experiences, learn and grow and find out about things. I think as long as people are respectful and courteous there isn't anything wrong with that. And of course if people choose not to share that is their prerogative as well but there isn't anything wrong with asking questions, IMHO.
Absolutely we can all agree to disagree with the "bad things happen what is the purpose of asking more details". In society today there are so many cases and examples where that is just clearly wrong to have that attitude.
IMHO, we need to get to a place in society when someone speaks about horrible things no matter the race, religion or sexual orientation of the person, and the acts are so heinous then why not discuss it? If a white or Asian or Hispanic person came on the board and told of how they were mistreated, had horrible things said to them or some of the same things that the OP mentioned, would it not be ok to ask them follow up questions about it? I don't think so. So why should it be wrong to ask someone that is black about it?
Right is right and wrong is wrong in my eyes. We need to get to a place where we can talk about ANY horrible issues in society that are happening where it's not only ok to ask about it if the person is white or in the majority. What happens a few decades from now when white people are the minority? Get my point?
Yes, I'll agree that we disagree.
Absolutely, no one should have to feel they need to keep horrible things hidden. Such thing should always be reportable, so they can be somehow fixed.
But when something becomes a general topic of conversation, that seems to make it somehow less ugly and less unacceptable to society as a whole. Violence on TV and in games, inappropriate gun brandishing and usage, gangsta' talk ... stuff like that. That's why I think there's a time and place for discussing the details of bad events. This doesn't seem to me to be the time or place.
Wow, those things that happened to you are HORRIBLE and I'm truly sorry that you had to deal with truly IGNORANT people like that.
Again, I admitted that I haven't met too many black people here in San Diego. But as I posted, the ones that I have met mentioned that they love San Diego. And we specifically discussed how people are and that they haven't had any issues at all. Sure, I guess they could have been lying to me and they are having problems but they sure didn't seem like it.
And one of my VERY close college friends was black and he lived here for many years. His experiences were VERY different from your experiences.
I know there are some black Citydata members that post here so if they feel comfortable sharing their personal experiences that would be great too and I'm sure it would be hugely beneficial for other CD members.
I had lunch with a Citydata member a few weeks ago and we specifically mentioned this and he said he and his family LOVED San Diego and haven't had any issues at all. But obviously I'm really sorry that you had to deal with this kind of racism in ANY city, let alone San Diego.
You would think in this day and age you wouldn't have to deal with this sort of thing. I look forward to the day when no one has to deal with this kind of ignorant behavior.
queenvic, I am curious. Do you think that your experience is unique in how poorly you were treated? Or do you think you were the exception and not the norm? Did your other black friends experience the same types of problems here?
No, I'm not way off base. You don't witness racism in SD, none of your Black friends don't experience racism in SD. So queenvic's experience has to be "unique" or the "exception".
I thought traffic was terrible in SD and you didn't ("compared to a lot of other cities in The US"), so I was wrong.
You are right, you are judge and jury, and you don't allow other people the validity of their personal experiences. You simply said, well, we can agree to disagree.
Racism still exists. It exists everywhere in The US. It exists in SD. The Ku Klux Klan STILL exists. And no Black, Vietnamese or Mexican should have to defend themselves here.
As for bloom chiming in with "ER is even handed." It simply means that bloom THINKS you are. That doesn't make it a fact.
Absolutely, no one should have to feel they need to keep horrible things hidden. Such thing should always be reportable, so they can be somehow fixed.
But when something becomes a general topic of conversation, that seems to make it somehow less ugly and less unacceptable to society as a whole. Violence on TV and in games, inappropriate gun brandishing and usage, gangsta' talk ... stuff like that. That's why I think there's a time and place for discussing the details of bad events. This doesn't seem to me to be the time or place.
I do agree sometimes things can become less ugly by it being so mainstream but I don't believe that racism is one of them. I truly believe much of the progress that we have made today with race relations and improvement of racism is specifically because we talked about it and people were able to chime in and give their opinions on right vs. wrong.
Again, it's fine to have differing opinions on this and I don't want to take this thread off topic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fran66
No, I'm not way off base. You don't witness racism in SD, none of your Black friends don't experience racism in SD. So queenvic's experience has to be "unique" or the "exception".
I thought traffic was terrible in SD and you didn't ("compared to a lot of other cities in The US"), so I was wrong.
You are right, you are judge and jury, and you don't allow other people the validity of their personal experiences. You simply said, well, we can agree to disagree.
Racism still exists. It exists everywhere in The US. It exists in SD. The Ku Klux Klan STILL exists. And no Black, Vietnamese or Mexican should have to defend themselves here.
As for bloom chiming in with "ER is even handed." It simply means that bloom THINKS you are. That doesn't make it a fact.
Yes, you are way off base Fran. I was asking queenvic about her experiences and didn't say she was unique or the exception. I asked her opinion on that topic.
Your traffic in San Diego example is a good one because when I hear people that sound ignorant or off base then I will chime in to give my thoughts on the matter. You saying traffic here was horrible was one example. I gave my opinion and you gave yours. As it should be.
Absolutely racism still exists everywhere including San Diego. Where did I say it doesn't? You make too many presumptions that are totally wrong. Absolutely I'm not the judge and jury. And I always welcome people to share their personal experiences. No one is asking anyone to "defend themselves" here.
Ok..let's keep this thread on topic. Queenvic said she doesn't want to discuss the matter anymore so unless anyone else can post about their experiences as it relates to San Diego let's keep the thread on topic.
Location: In the basket with the other deplorables
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I'm not trying to bring up the subject again, but I did want to thank oddstray and Fran66 for putting themselves in my shoes and understanding why being asked to give supportive evidence of any discrimination and/or prejudice that I experienced felt wrong (it was not inappropriate, but again it is one of those situations that one cannot put their finger on, but does not make you feel too great nonetheless). I have learned how difficult it can be for some to identify with a person or situation that they have not experienced firsthand, so I wanted to thank the two of you.
For the record, I have no problem with questions. Living in SD for so many years, I became used to sporadic and invasive questions. Plus, I also went to law school, so I can interrogate and be interrogated for hours no problem. But for me, for someone to POSSIBLY hint at because their black friends did not experience it, therefore it may not really exist and requesting details of certain events, and then wondering if I am a unique situation just does not sit well with me (hence why I elected to not answer any more questions). I feel that even if I did look like a gorilla, it does not give anyone the justification to actually call me one (and make the gorilla noises too).
ER, you seem like a good guy and I'm positive that you were wondering about this with the most decent of curiosity.
In closing, I would like to point out that since black people are such a low percentage in SD, it seems that when whites do encounter a black person, some are so uneasy, shocked, and thrown off base by it that they lose/forget their sense of humanity and morality. That has been my personal experience.
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