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Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 10 days ago)
35,635 posts, read 17,982,736 times
Reputation: 50676
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lieneke
There was not a hung jury, there was a problem with the foreman in that he had not made a decision and could not make a decision or function in the role he was assigned. Today that foreman is presented as having voted not guilty and that he was the holdout, that he was removed because he was a holdout. That is simply not true.
Regarding the final juror who was added to the jury, there's nothing to suggest that she was a stealth juror except complaints from the defense. She had made up her mind after listening to all the evidence, similar to the other eleven jurors.
Technically, you're correct. It takes a judge to declare a jury hung, and the judge chose instead to remove the decenter rather than declare the jury hung.
He was made extremely uncomfortable for holding an "unpopular opinion" in the jury room, and was therefore allowed to walk free at which point someone who was more agreeable to the guilty verdict was placed there.
I'm sorry. A spade is a spade. That jury was hung, and to deal with that issue the judge removed the one hold out and replaced him.
Which is NOT the same thing as removing a juror for misconduct, or due to health or family emergency. It's because he wasn't in agreement with the other 11 on the guilt of the defendant.
I strongly believe before removing a juror for any reason except dire health of the juror, or inappropriate behavior, before removal after days of deliberation a vote should be called. If that indicates the jury is hung, it's hung. Or at any rate, you're not removing the one lone decenter, you're removing one whose opinion will have less profound impact.
Technically, you're correct. It takes a judge to declare a jury hung, and the judge chose instead to remove the decenter rather than declare the jury hung.
He was made extremely uncomfortable for holding an "unpopular opinion" in the jury room, and was therefore allowed to walk free at which point someone who was more agreeable to the guilty verdict was placed there.
I'm sorry. A spade is a spade. That jury was hung, and to deal with that issue the judge removed the one hold out and replaced him.
Which is NOT the same thing as removing a juror for misconduct, or due to health or family emergency. It's because he wasn't in agreement with the other 11 on the guilt of the defendant.
I strongly believe before removing a juror for any reason except dire health of the juror, or inappropriate behavior, before removal after days of deliberation a vote should be called. If that indicates the jury is hung, it's hung. Or at any rate, you're not removing the one lone decenter, you're removing one whose opinion will have less profound impact.
Judges more than having hung juries hate to be overturned on appeal... Scott's conviction would have been overturned in a heartbeat if the judge did what you claim for the sole purpose of gaining a conviction...sorry what you believe is irrelevant...
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 10 days ago)
35,635 posts, read 17,982,736 times
Reputation: 50676
I also have grave doubts about the process of assembling a death penalty jury. That just seems wrong, to stack the jury with those who believe in the death penalty. They are assuredly more likely to side with a guilty verdict, and believe strongly that Law Enforcement gets it right. The jury is stacked to favor guilt.
Honestly, that would be like in trials for child abusers, the jurors must all be survivors of abuse. In cases where alleged police misconduct is involved, the jurors must all have been arrested at some point.
It's blatantly unfair to stack a jury that agrees with harsh punishment, rather than by the ability to be fair and open to ferreting out the truth in the testimony.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 10 days ago)
35,635 posts, read 17,982,736 times
Reputation: 50676
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishiis49
Judges more than having hung juries hate to be overturned on appeal... Scott's conviction would have been overturned in a heartbeat if the judge did what you claim for the sole purpose of gaining a conviction...sorry what you believe is irrelevant...
Likewise. What does it matter whether he did it for the "purpose" of obtaining a conviction? The fact is, the jury was facing being hung, and to solve the problem of this one guy who wouldn't change his mind to the majority guilty opinion, he removed him from the jury.
Don't you think ALL hung juries have one (maybe several) jurors who are extremely uncomfortable and would rather be removed than face the fury of the other jurors who believe in guilt and want to go home?
They do, is the answer. They are uncomfortable. So was this guy. How was that different, that he should be let out of the obligation of voting his conscience?
I considered that but it's also possible that when Laci returned from the walk she put the dog in the yard, got distracted by something like the burglars across the street, the mail, or something else and was abducted just after putting her dog back in the yard.
If she confronted the burglars as per the recorded conversation between a CA inmate and his brother who knew Todd and was abducted, isn't it plausible that she would have put the dog in the yard and then walked over to ask them what they were doing?
And when did she change her clothes in this scenario?
And when did she change her clothes in this scenario?
Anytime. Maybe after her walk. Maybe even after she was abducted (if she was abducted). It's ridiculous to cling to clothing as an identifier as clothing is readily available and can be changed in a matter of moments.
Originally Posted by ohyesidid View Post
None of those witnesses saw Laci and McKenzie. They saw another pregnant or heavy-set woman walking a dog which looked similar, and they overlaid the details of Laci's disappearance which were brought out in the news onto their own personal experiences.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissTerri
Totally disagree.
None of those witnesses were reliable otherwise Geragos would have used them.
Technically, you're correct. It takes a judge to declare a jury hung, and the judge chose instead to remove the decenter rather than declare the jury hung.
He was made extremely uncomfortable for holding an "unpopular opinion" in the jury room, and was therefore allowed to walk free at which point someone who was more agreeable to the guilty verdict was placed there.
I'm sorry. A spade is a spade. That jury was hung, and to deal with that issue the judge removed the one hold out and replaced him.
Which is NOT the same thing as removing a juror for misconduct, or due to health or family emergency. It's because he wasn't in agreement with the other 11 on the guilt of the defendant.
I strongly believe before removing a juror for any reason except dire health of the juror, or inappropriate behavior, before removal after days of deliberation a vote should be called. If that indicates the jury is hung, it's hung. Or at any rate, you're not removing the one lone decenter, you're removing one whose opinion will have less profound impact.
Same suspicious van spotted by multiple people on that day.
False claim. You don't know it was the same van.
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