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I don't include latinos blacks as being black, gotta love it.
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With due respect to you there are many in Latin America who have no problem with being self identified as "black". The Garifuna of Honduras, Cuban blacks, some black communities in Colombia especially in the Choco region, and increasing numbers of the darker Afrodescents in Brazil.
Also large numbers of American blacks have problems and there is a huge segment lost to social pathologies. So not all have displayed the industriousness resilience, etc., that you describe, though I will agree that too often insufficient credit is given to the large numbers who have, and black immigrants are often as guilty as others for this.
I hope that you are not claiming that black Caribbean people have made no contribution to improving life for blacks in the USA because it will be really to easy to prove you wrong.
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Same with Caribbean Americans,who want a separate box for their group. Back in the 70's,they were just seen as black,like Shirley Chislom.
Did you poll Caribbean people to find out whether wanting to collect data on their group, which has different characteristics from American blacks because of their immigrant origin, means that they do not want to be black? Understand something. Without significant Caribbean immigration there will be much less black political clout in places like Florida, NY and Boston. Indeed Obama would have LOST FL without this vote.
With due respect to you there are many in Latin America who have no problem with being self identified as "black". The Garifuna of Honduras, Cuban blacks, some black communities in Colombia especially in the Choco region, and increasing numbers of the darker Afrodescents in Brazil.
Also large numbers of American blacks have problems and there is a huge segment lost to social pathologies. So not all have displayed the industriousness resilience, etc., that you describe, though I will agree that too often insufficient credit is given to the large numbers who have, and black immigrants are often as guilty as others for this.
I hope that you are not claiming that black Caribbean people have made no contribution to improving life for blacks in the USA because it will be really to easy to prove you wrong.
NOT ALL GARIFUNA identify as black:
SEE VIDEO LINK:
"Being Garifuna
When it comes to being counted in the census, the Garifunas, who are part African, part Caribbean and part Central American, say they don’t fit into any box."
"Being Garifuna
When it comes to being counted in the census, the Garifunas, who are part African, part Caribbean and part Central American, say they don’t fit into any box."
Not saying all do, but in Belize many certainly do, in fact ridiculing Creoles for being self hating people who have despised them for being darker and more African culturally. And now that mestizos (Belizean and migrant) are now the majority Creoles and Garifuna seemed to be mending their traditional distrust for each other.
And in Honduras they have a very active civil rights movement based on improving the rights for blacks in that country, and not just Garifuna.
I will not base it on what some migrant to the USA might feel because often these sentiments arise from a desire to be respected for being a unique ethnic group. In Honduras where those who they perceive to be their oppressors are Hispanics, many mestizo, their self identity will be different. There it will be their blackness and the strong African base within their culture that will stand out.
Indeed one girl even stated that she was black, but was seeking a description which allowed her cultural identity to be displayed.
Not saying all do, but in Belize they certainly do, in fact ridiculing Creoles for being self hating. And in Honduras they have a very active civil rights movement based on improving the rights for blacks in that country, and not just Garifuna.
I will not base it on what some migrant to the USA might feel because often these sentiments arise from a desire to be respected for being a unique ethnic group.
Ah ok. Fair answer. Makes sense. Garifunas are a unique bunch. Their culture and history is very interesting.
It's amazing how they retained the Carib and Arawakan language, yet the peoples that look more fully Carib don't speak much of any of the traditional Carib and Arawakan and Taino languages. It's very interesting.
In addition it's interesting how blacks from colonial times in Nicaragua, Guatemala, Honduras etc are overlooked when they still exist. It seems like many cultures and governments seek to push erasure.
Ah ok. Fair answer. Makes sense. Garifunas are a unique bunch. Their culture and history is very interesting.
It's amazing how they retained the Carib and Arawakan language, yet the peoples that look more fully Carib don't speak much of any of the traditional Carib and Arawakan and Taino languages. It's very interesting.
In addition it's interesting how blacks from colonial times in Nicaragua, Guatemala, Honduras etc are overlooked when they still exist. It seems like many cultures and governments seek to push erasure.
I actually know Garifuna from both St Vincent and Belize, and have encountered those from Guatemala and Honduras. Met a Guatamalan woman who said that she is from Livingston (if I recall). I then TOLD her (not asked her) that she must be Garifuna. Her eyes opened and she wanted to know how I. Told her that she is from a little corner of Guatemala that lies between heavily Garifuna parts of Honduras and a part of Belize with some Garifuna so I took a wild guess.
And yes the Hispanic elites in Guatemala do want erasure of the Garifuna as they occupy lands that others want for hotel development. They are considered alien in a Indo Hispanic majority culture, so some see them as not having any rights.
This is why in Honduras they will have a more militantly "black" identity than in the USA where the battle is to protect their culture from being erased through complete assimilation into black America. Sadly in LA more than a few Garifuna kids (both Belizean and Honduran) have become part of the Crips and Bloods culture, and have become a major problem when deported to their homelands. The usual problem when poor black migrants work long hours and raise their kids in ghetto neighborhoods because they cant do any better.
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There was a program on NPR years ago about the Creoles of Nicaragua. What amused me is that they are so isolated that a teacher was speaking in a Jamaican based patwa (they are not Jamaicans but their linguistic development is similar), I assume she thought that it was standard English.
Many Miskito Indians who live nearby have a similar culture. Will never forget seeing a TV program piece which had these Indian kids wining to soca music. They are another unique bunch as they aren't really part of the normal Central American mestizo cultural matrix.
Indeed both of these groups feel threatened by increased incursions by mestizos from the highlands.
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