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Old 12-17-2019, 02:51 PM
 
Location: USA
6,920 posts, read 3,754,471 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Statz2k10 View Post
You can say that by looking at ALL draft picks. But what % of draft picks in the first 60 picks never make it to MLB? My point is the more picks you have that high the more likely you'll get a future All Star.
Bob's right, US High School and College picks are a crapshoot. Especially at 17-18 years old.
International scouting has become just as or more important. Finding the right balance between the two is key.
If a big name FA helps a GM and owner win rings, they won't care about draft picks and the back ends of contracts.
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Old 12-17-2019, 04:07 PM
 
34,068 posts, read 17,088,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Statz2k10 View Post
You can say that by looking at ALL draft picks. But what % of draft picks in the first 60 picks never make it to MLB? My point is the more picks you have that high the more likely you'll get a future All Star.
I agree on that, but a pick due to MB alone is not going to make the Giants an October force again. I prefer acquiring free agent proven studs plus other top guys via trades from GMs more concerned about pinching pennies than winning.
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Old 12-17-2019, 05:51 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
48,564 posts, read 24,133,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
I agree on that, but a pick due to MB alone is not going to make the Giants an October force again. I prefer acquiring free agent proven studs plus other top guys via trades from GMs more concerned about pinching pennies than winning.
And what are you offering for those proven vets? Wouldn't you be more likely to secure the player you are after if you can offer an up and coming minor leaguer you drafted? The other GM isn't going to give up his prize player for your roster junk.
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Old 12-17-2019, 06:35 PM
 
34,068 posts, read 17,088,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
And what are you offering for those proven vets? Wouldn't you be more likely to secure the player you are after if you can offer an up and coming minor leaguer you drafted? The other GM isn't going to give up his prize player for your roster junk.
GMs who are more concerned with low payroll vs winning give up excellent players all the time, dirt cheap.

Here was the wonderful prospect the Fish got for Stanton. Stanton barely played in '19, had 4.0 WAR in 2018. Guzman WAR at AA not listed.

Bad GMs playing Dollar Store with payroll make good GMs jobs much easier.


Jorge Guzman Stats, Highlights, Bio | MiLB.com Stats | The Official Site of Minor League Baseball
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Old 12-18-2019, 06:57 AM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
48,564 posts, read 24,133,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
GMs who are more concerned with low payroll vs winning give up excellent players all the time, dirt cheap.



Bad GMs playing Dollar Store with payroll make good GMs jobs much easier.

I reject this idea that the definition of a good GM is that he has lots of money to spend and the definition of a bad GM is that he is forced to work within a limited budget.
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Old 12-18-2019, 06:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grandstander View Post
I reject this idea that the definition of a good GM is that he has lots of money to spend and the definition of a bad GM is that he is forced to work within a limited budget.
Limited budgets do not belong in MLB, as in consistently far below the MLB median payroll. It makes a team uncompetitive in the vast majority of years, or perhaps, middle of pack, if managed in an exceptional way.

Like Billy Beane, in this era with great info available, the always Dollar Store shopping GM will , 2 decades later like Beane, be waiting to win the final game of a season for the very first time.
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Old 12-18-2019, 08:41 PM
 
Location: Parts Unknown, Northern California
48,564 posts, read 24,133,502 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
Limited budgets do not belong in MLB, as in consistently far below the MLB median payroll. It makes a team uncompetitive in the vast majority of years, or perhaps, middle of pack, if managed in an exceptional way.

Like Billy Beane, in this era with great info available, the always Dollar Store shopping GM will , 2 decades later like Beane, be waiting to win the final game of a season for the very first time.
The biggest spenders last season were the Boston Red Sox, followed by the Chicago Cubs. Neither of those teams made it to the post season, but the 30th place Rays did, and so did the 25th lowest spenders, the A's.

The measure of a team's quality is not how often it wins the last game of the season, but how often it wins enough games to be in the post season and have a chance to win that last game. The Astros have won 100 plus games for three straight seasons, they have clearly been the best team in MLB the last three years, but they won the last game of the season just once.The Dodgers have been a great team for the past eight seasons, the best in the NL, but they haven't won that last game yet. The best team does not always come out on top. Would you argue that any of the three recent Giants championships were a product of them being the best team in baseball those three years? They won 89, 90 and 92 games those three years. How do you account for the 2006 World Champ Cardinals who won just 83 regular season games?

It is a matter of understanding the actual odds, the post season is a crap shoot, not enough games for the quality difference between the teams to be the decisive factor, that requires 162 games.
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Old 12-19-2019, 03:11 AM
 
34,068 posts, read 17,088,810 times
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https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/payroll/2019/

7th highest payroll beat 8th in 2019. 4th and 2nd gave them their best battle.

Beane may have watched the WS on TV, of course.
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Old 12-22-2019, 02:47 AM
 
834 posts, read 529,299 times
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Ellsbury and Stanton and their huge salaries didn't help the Yankees much . It was the fleet of bench guys who all played above their pay level who carried the 2019 Yankees.

Low budget teams can still compete as long as speed, defense, and quality middle relievers remain under valued. Older starting pitchers, slow sluggers, and closers are what cost the most, for no reason whatsoever.
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Old 12-22-2019, 08:45 AM
 
34,068 posts, read 17,088,810 times
Reputation: 17215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bumby88 View Post
Ellsbury and Stanton and their huge salaries didn't help the Yankees much . It was the fleet of bench guys who all played above their pay level who carried the 2019 Yankees.

Low budget teams can still compete as long as speed, defense, and quality middle relievers remain under valued. Older starting pitchers, slow sluggers, and closers are what cost the most, for no reason whatsoever.

2018 WS: #1 payroll Red Sox beat #3 Dodgers

2017 WS: Houston 17th beat LAD 1st

2016 WS: Cubs 5th beat Indians 18th

2015 WS: KC 13t beat NYM 17th (last year BOTH teams both under 10).

2014 WS: SF 7th beat KC 18th


https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/payroll/2015/
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