A question for born-again Christians (Mormons, hell, beliefs, minority)
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I have a question for those of you who identify as born-again Christians. I would like to know how the experience of being "born again" has changed the way in which you interact with your fellow human beings, i.e. your fellow born-again Christians, all other Christians, non-Christians who are devout in their own beliefs, and non-religious or non-believing individuals?
In your opinion, has being born again made you a better person, or does it just ensure your salvation?
Even though I'm Catholic, I consider myself to be born again by virtue of my baptism. All baptized believers are "born again".
Where Catholicism differs from evangelical Protestantism in this regard is that we don't see being "born again" as being an automatic ticket to heaven. One can be born again through baptism, but then at some point can spiritually die by committing mortal sin. If they physically die in this state of spiritual death, they will end up in hell. Of course, as long as we are still physically alive we have opportunity to repent and confess our sins, and God is faithful in forgiving us.
Even though I'm Catholic, I consider myself to be born again by virtue of my baptism. All baptized believers are "born again".
Mormons actually believe in being "born again," too, but like you, we don't see it as an automatic ticket to heaven. What I don't understand from your statement ("All baptized believers are born again.") is how it is possible for a baptized baby to be a believer. What if the baby is baptized and then grows up to be an unbeliever. Would you consider him to be born again by virtue of his baptism or is baptism just a sacrament that you believe to be essential to salvation? In other words, are belief and baptism actually tied together in some way or not?
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Of course, as long as we are still physically alive we have opportunity to repent and confess our sins, and God is faithful in forgiving us.
I can go along with that. Personally, I believe that belief in Christ and repentance for one's past sins is a pre-requisite for baptism, and of course this is impossible for an infant.
So what exactly do you believe it means to be born again, since you obviously don't see it the way either Protestants or Mormons do? I mean what does being born again accomplish if it doesn't involve an act of faith or a change in heart on the part of the recipient? Certainly it can't impact the way the person treats his fellow human beings. I'm just trying to understand the sequence of events in the life of a "born again" person who is baptized at a few days old.
Last edited by Katzpur; 10-05-2021 at 08:42 PM..
Reason: uenc
Even though I'm Catholic, I consider myself to be born again by virtue of my baptism. All baptized believers are "born again".
Where Catholicism differs from evangelical Protestantism in this regard is that we don't see being "born again" as being an automatic ticket to heaven. One can be born again through baptism, but then at some point can spiritually die by committing mortal sin. If they physically die in this state of spiritual death, they will end up in hell. Of course, as long as we are still physically alive we have opportunity to repent and confess our sins, and God is faithful in forgiving us.
Once saved always saved is a minority position even within Protestantism. (The topic is so divisive that the largest Christian forum banned any further discussion of it.) I basically believe that being born again means just that: You've been born spiritually, whereas previously you were spiritually dead. The Holy Spirit has entered into your life. You are now able to commune with God, to grasp spiritual truths, to enter on the path toward sanctification.
Like the Orthodox, I believe that being born again is different from being saved. Being saved requires remaining on the path of sanctification, remaining within the body of Christ, albeit not without challenges, stumbles and even falls. This is not "works salvation" - we don't earn anything. It is "remaining within the body of Christ salvation."
Mormons actually believe in being "born again," too, but like you, we don't see it as an automatic ticket to heaven. What I don't understand from your statement ("All baptized believers are born again.") is how it is possible for a baptized baby to be a believer. What if the baby is baptized and then grows up to be an unbeliever. Would you consider him to be born again by virtue of his baptism or is baptism just a sacrament that you believe to be essential to salvation? In other words, are belief and baptism actually tied together in some way or not?
A baby who is baptized receives a real grace from God, and it leaves a mark on their soul that can never be undone. In a way, we would say it enables them to believe, though of course an unbaptized person can come to belief later in life and then be baptized. God works in many different ways. Normatively though, baptism is tied with belief.
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Originally Posted by Katzpur
So what exactly do you believe it means to be born again, since you obviously don't see it the way either Protestants or Mormons do? I mean what does being born again accomplish if it doesn't involve an act of faith or a change in heart on the part of the recipient? Certainly it can't impact the way the person treats his fellow human beings. I'm just trying to understand the sequence of events in the life of a "born again" person who is baptized at a few days old.
This goes to original sin. Since we are all born of Adam, we are born in a state of brokenness; what we call original sin. What baptism does is give us rebirth into Christ. We are no longer under Adam's curse, but are made alive in Christ. What it accomplishes is removing the stain of original sin.
Once saved always saved is a minority position even within Protestantism. (The topic is so divisive that the largest Christian forum banned any further discussion of it.) I basically believe that being born again means just that: You've been born spiritually, whereas previously you were spiritually dead. The Holy Spirit has entered into your life. You are now able to commune with God, to grasp spiritual truths, to enter on the path toward sanctification.
Like the Orthodox, I believe that being born again is different from being saved. Being saved requires remaining on the path of sanctification, remaining within the body of Christ, albeit not without challenges, stumbles and even falls. This is not "works salvation" - we don't earn anything. It is "remaining within the body of Christ salvation."
I believe the Catholic and Orthodox positions are the same on this, though they do see original sin differently.
Once saved, always saved means that people still need to endure to the end, through repentance and resisting sin and seeking God through the righteousness of Jesus ..... I believe that God needs prayer so He can help the World or He cannot do anything , as God gave the world to man
I think being born again is great! It is definitely not about trying to stay one step ahead of sin. I don't even know why that comes up in a topic like this?
It is about having access to the master builder. If I don't love enough, He does. If I can't bring myself to forgive, He will help me. If I can't see the wisdom in turning the other cheek, He will teach me. Whether it is anger, loneliness, doubt or terror, the Lord has it covered.
Truth is, it's not just about access. It is the mystery of our nature. If you are fixated upon sin, then take up your nature.
It is the promise of becoming. God is the great teacher. He lives in you. It doesn't mean all of life will be rosy. It doesn't mean you won't get some things wrong, and offend. It's not the magic weight loss cure. You still won't find that your indulgences get you anywhere. But you will have this wonderful spirit living within you that will make you think and provoke you to find out more about the world around you in a good way. He will both convict and inspire you to greater things. He will give you yourself.
Last edited by Am I a Prophet; 10-06-2021 at 03:45 AM..
Reason: the writing process
I think being born again is great! It is definitely not about trying to stay one step ahead of sin. I don't even know why that comes up in a topic like this?
It is about having access to the master builder. If I don't love enough, He does. If I can't bring myself to forgive, He will help me. If I can't see the wisdom in turning the other cheek, He will teach me. Whether it is anger, loneliness, doubt or terror, the Lord has it covered.
Truth is, it's not just about access. It is the mystery of our nature. If you are fixated upon sin, then take up your nature.
It is the promise of becoming. God is the great teacher. He lives in you. It doesn't mean all of life will be rosy. It doesn't mean you won't get some things wrong, and offend. It's not the magic weight loss cure. You still won't find that your indulgences get you anywhere. But you will have this wonderful spirit living within you that will make you think and provoke you to find out more about the world around you in a good way. He will both convict and inspire you to greater things. He will give you yourself.
Thanks everyone for your input. I'm not finding any actual answers to the question I posed in my OP, though. Here it is again:
I would like to know how the experience of being "born again" has changed the way in which you interact with your fellow human beings, i.e. your fellow born-again Christians, all other Christians, non-Christians who are devout in their own beliefs, and non-religious or non-believing individuals?
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Great witness, Prophet!
